Doesn't help that Democrats are attacking themselves for not being able to come to a deal. Just look at some of the stuff just before the election. Hard to keep the high ground and support when your own party is pulling out the rug.
Doesn't help that Democrats are attacking themselves for not being able to come to a deal. Just look at some of the stuff just before the election. Hard to keep the high ground and support when your own party is pulling out the rug.The Democrats are going to get suckered into passing a bill with massive corporate relief and no individual payments on the promise that the individual payments will be worked out later, only to have all support evaporate immediately.
I think that 90% of Americans and 90% of Georgians could use $10,000 right now, today. I think that is a winning bill to hold up and say, elect Democrats for $10,000, or elect Republicans if you're cool with nothing.Police and firefighters help every American. I do want to win this thing, which is why if you’re making a messaging bill you should include super popular measures in it like funding police and teachers!
This is not an abstract policy argument - do you want to fire lots of cops and teachers or do you not?
Helping those agencies is helping the citizens of the country.
Edit: more importantly if they pass the bill you suggest without aid to state and local governments it will never happen. Republicans WANT those governments to go bankrupt because it means they will need to cut employees and services. The only way to get them to fund cities is to dangle other things they want.
Great, so let’s include both in the bill.I think that 90% of Americans and 90% of Georgians could use $10,000 right now, today. I think that is a winning bill to hold up and say, elect Democrats for $10,000, or elect Republicans if you're cool with nothing.
Firefighters and police and Hospitals are great, but if we're talking about winning 2 more Democratic Senators while not being able to pass a bill either way, let every single voter look at that $10,000 check they might get, and decide which party they want to vote for.
No, pass one bill that provides every US Adult $10,000. Full stop.Great, so let’s include both in the bill.
I find your resistance to putting popular things in a messaging bill to be very strange, haha.No, pass one bill that provides every US Adult $10,000. Full stop.
Pass the other bill the day after.
They should do this or similar. They should also do the same thing with lot decriminalization.In case you hadn't noticed, McConnell/Republicans have already said nothing of substance will happen.
Now is the time to show what the Democrats are offering, compared to Republicans.
You want to take the Georgia Senate or not?
House Democrats can pass a bill to make sure all of the Super Merry Christmas Funds are allocated this year, or they can pass a fucking, "Here's $10,000 for You, Your Wife, and Your Two Adult Children" bill and then tell Georgians that the reason they won't be getting their money is because McConnell and Republicans own the Senate. I know which bill will heighten the contradictions between the Democratic Party and Republican Party.
Nothing is passing. This is about showing who the Democrats are for, and who the Republicans are against.
I find your insistence on complicating a bill to be very counterproductive to the goal at hand.I find your resistance to putting popular things in a messaging bill to be very strange, haha.
Democrats have had 7 months to make it about teachers, police, and firefighters and haven't been able to. The problem is Dems don't know how to talk to stupid people. Nick is explaining how to talk to morons, not giving good policy. But fuck any bill that has as much in PPP as unemployment.I find your resistance to putting popular things in a messaging bill to be very strange, haha.
I haven’t seen them even really try, which is too bad as it’s probably the most powerful message they have. People will view $10,000 as unrealistic, even if they shouldn’t, and would never expect the Democrats to actually deliver on it.Democrats have had 7 months to make it about teachers, police, and firefighters and haven't been able to. The problem is Dems don't know how to talk to stupid people. Nick is explaining how to talk to morons, not giving good policy. But fuck any bill that has as much in PPP as unemployment.
If Dems won't go the bash their heads in route with direct payments, then they should compromise on UI not being more than previous pay and make any local benefits for use by education and first responders only. They've let Republicans kill them in the messaging over UI higher than previous wages and bailing out liberal cities.
I agree with you that would be a winning v message, but Dems won't fucking use it. To really make it work they have to limit where those funds could be used, which they will refuse to do.I haven’t seen them even really try, which is too bad as it’s probably the most powerful message they have. People will view $10,000 as unrealistic, even if they shouldn’t, and would never expect the Democrats to actually deliver on it.
People are very loss averse though, tell them their kids won’t have a teacher, that the police won’t be there to protect them, that the fire department can’t protect them, that’s the kind of message that people respond to.
Democrats have had 7 months to make it about teachers, police, and firefighters and haven't been able to. The problem is Dems don't know how to talk to stupid people. Nick is explaining how to talk to morons, not giving good policy. But fuck any bill that has as much in PPP as unemployment.
If Dems won't go the bash their heads in route with direct payments, then they should compromise on UI not being more than previous pay and make any local benefits for use by education and first responders only. They've let Republicans kill them in the messaging over UI higher than previous wages and bailing out liberal cities.
I think you need to re-read. It's pretty obvious that we were talking about how Dems could win the Senate seats in GA, not talking about why nothing has gotten done in Senate. But your comment is exactly why democrats under perform their policies. Instead of formulating a simple straight forward message, democrats want to discuss nauce and reason.You must have missed all of your civics classes. The (Dem controlled) House passed a relief bill in MAY. The (Republican controlled) Senate has refused to vote on that bill, has never passed ANY new relief bill and, from all appearances, can't even come close to an agreement among themselves about whether any relief is necessary, much less the terms of such relief.
Arguing about 10k checks is a red herring issue that some people want-it is not part of the House bill that was passed and is not a part of any of the serious negotiations that have been attempted since last spring.
Not until the corporate interests are affected-say by a stock market collapse-will we ever see Mitch McConnell allow his Senate to address this issue.
It's time to stop blaming this horrible situation on the House, and rather point to the party (GOP) actually blocking relief. I wished I lived in GA so I could have a vote preventing no more action for the next four years.
It does not matter what messaging Democrats use Republicans will paint it as socialists wanting to bankrupt the nation by handing all YOUR hard earned money to the undesirables.
$10,000 to every citizen with no means test? Republicans will immediately start yelling how it will double the US Debt (no, it does not matter that it is wrong, or that it is basically the same amount we have been talking about, they know that the people they are talking about can't wrap their minds around that many zeros, they could claim that it would add 100 trillion dollars to the national debt and most would not even question it.) how taxes will have to skyrocket to pay for it, and that the middle class is who will have to pay that back. In just a few days the majority of Americans will be outraged that Democrats want to hand over all of the middle classes hard earned their wealth to the poor, even the ones that are currently starving.
We know who THEM is.I am of the firm opinion that the vast majority of conservatives/Trump supporters resistance to progressive messaging can be summed up in one sentence from your post...”I don’t MY tax money paying for (fill in blank, such as health care) for THEM!“
In Kansas City, Mo., with a municipal budget of $1.7 billion, the city manager has asked each department to draft a plan for cuts of more than 11 percent. That could mean laying off 200 police officers from the 1,300-member force and 180 firefighters and emergency medical technicians, said Dan Fowler, a City Council member.
“This is one of the things that keeps me up at night,” Mr. Fowler said, thinking about the impact on the city’s half a million residents. Such cuts could end up closing one or two police stations, even though crime is rising, he said.
Emergency response times are already slow, Mr. Fowler said, so even though he lives near a hospital, “if I have a heart attack, I’ll just crawl over there.”
Police and firefighters help every American. I do want to win this thing, which is why if you’re making a messaging bill you should include super popular measures in it like funding police and teachers!
This is not an abstract policy argument - do you want to fire lots of cops and teachers or do you not?
Conservative media is going to frame anything other than what Nick suggests as "billions in pork" like they have framed every other bill before it. They may even try to frame Nick's suggestion that way.I find your resistance to putting popular things in a messaging bill to be very strange, haha.
'May'?????Conservative media is going to frame anything other than what Nick suggests as "billions in pork" like they have framed every other bill before it. They may even try to frame Nick's suggestion that way.
'May'?????
You guys do realize that the Republican playbook is exactly the same for every single bill the Democrats pass, right? It doesn't matter what's in it.
The main messaging advantage of the Republicans is not that they are some sort of voodoo mind control experts with the best messengers in the world, it's that people are fundamentally risk averse and react to fear more than they react to rewards. Here you have a chance to turn the tables on them - to use that exact same fear against them. This shit writes itself - 'Perdue and Loeffler want to get thousands and thousands of cops and firefighters fired. When you come home and someone is raping your grandma after setting your house on fire it's because of them.'
So sure, $10,000 per person sounds nice and all but I bet 'raped and burned grandma' works better.
In other words, F them, we will secede and leave them out in the cold.No, then they just swap out to the 'blue states are poorly run, why should red states have to bail them out again'.
Divide and conquer. They already have people thinking in the us vs them mindset, now they just play us against each other. We are no longer the United States, we are now the Divided States.
There is such thing as a blue state or a red state. There is no real way to separate the states. Trying to do so would be like the Partition of India only 10 times worse.In other words, F them, we will secede and leave them out in the cold.
Well the good news is that Trump won, right in line with your other genius predictions so we don’t have to worry about it, right? Hahaha.For every moronic, naive, and inept individual here who said "B-B-but Democrats passed the HEROES act and Republitards didn't accept it!" which was an outright treasure trove of delicious Democrat goodies and candies for random loads of shit that had no actual relation to stimulus or helping Americans...
I give you this glorious oopsies.
A reporter asked "Are you more optimistic about a standalone stimulus bill now?"
Her Response? "Now that Biden is president elect, we are willing to do a smaller deal"
Beautiful, just fucking beautiful - and full on admittance of what we already knew - yet people here are still too stupid to see it even after I spoon feed it to you.