Originally posted by: Jeff7
Sad, but most definitely not unprecedented.It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
noOriginally posted by: SP33Demon
So you never had an ex who moved away and broke your heart? hmmm.Originally posted by: ElFenix
Originally posted by: SP33Demon
Oh, you thought we forgot the pathetic threads about your ex? lol.Originally posted by: ElFenix
what the hell are you talking about?Originally posted by: SP33Demon
Only if we bring back the YAGTs where you pathetically crying about your ex ElFenix
what threads about ex? i've never posted anything here about exes.
Originally posted by: DonVito
Although I don't subscribe to conspiracy theories, the poll numbers in this area are, IMO, clearly a by-product of the Bush administration's willingness to engage in all kinds of skullduggery and lie about it. I personally don't believe they have the competence to carry out a plan of this magnitude and keep it secret (and I also don't believe that President Bush, in particular, would green-light the murder of thousands of American civilians), but it's undeniably the case that 9/11 enabled them to carry out the pre-ordained agenda of the PNAC, and there's just no question that that plan was and is the number one agenda item for the Bush presidency.
A lot of well-qualified engineers, academics, and firefighters support a 9/11 conspiracy theory, and I think it's important that we are able to discuss this in a civil way - if anything it annoys me that so many people feel compelled to throw around the "tinfoil hat" barbs, which I think are nonproductive and antithetical to the American right to freedom of speech.
:thumbsup:Originally posted by: Amused
Yes, because in order to speed it up any, a significant, or all the supportive elements on every floor would have to be severed. But the MAIN thing that would have to be done to speed it up would be to open each floor by removing the windows.Originally posted by: SP33Demon
I never said that I believed explosives were set on every floor, of course that is preposterous. But a demolition type job had to be performed to bring it down that quick, it wasn't done by just one hit on a couple floors by a plane. Think about it, the WTC fell with the speed of an excellent demo job. Are we supposed to believe that gravity and a plane hit to couple floors of the structure brought the entire building down at the same speed as a demo job?Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: SP33Demon
So the top of the building was moving with a force other than gravity similar to the force generated from a karate chop? Please, don't post anymore. :laugh:Originally posted by: yllus
How much is a person's hand slowed down if they do a karate chop through 8 blocks of wood?Originally posted by: SP33Demon
You still never addressed the original argument: How is it possible for 94 floors to fall into each other as fast as a free falling object without explosives? Take a physics class please, then post again.
SP33Demon,
Even with demolition, they break only enough structural elements to allow the building to collapse. They do not blow every supportive element. So there is a lot of energy adsorption going on even in a demolition.
Furthermore, to do what this theory claims in the WTC would require hundreds of charges on every floor around the perimeter. Why? Because the main structural elements of the WTC were the beams visible from the outside.
Yep, every one of those beams supported the weight of the building. And for your theory to work, every beam at every floor would need a charge on it. Not to mention the core of the building, which was supportive as well.
And have you seen a building set for demolition? They have to gut the building to get to the structural supports.
The demolition theory is just too laughable. Either a building can collapse at that speed breaking through the floors, or a charge would have to be set on every level, at hundreds of locations.
Think about it for a minute, OK?
When a building reaches the critical point, it's going down, and fast. The main things that slows the fall are air pockets within the structure on each floor, and the elements hitting each other on the way down. NOT the elements breaking. Once the tops fell on the rest of the structure, the entire structure was doomed. No demolition was needed for what happened to have happened. The unique structure of the building made for the pancake effect so many equate with demolition... and this absurd myth.
Originally posted by: adairusmc
Originally posted by: SP33Demon
He teaches physics at a community college in the summer and 12th grade during the schoolyear, who really cares? The fact of the matter is that 94 floors fell as FAST AS A ROCK (8.4 seconds) would fall through thin air. The laws of Physics will not allow 94 floors of a building to fall on top of each other as fast a rock in thin air unless explosives were involved. If you believe anything otherwise then you are a naive moron and need to take a high school physics class.Originally posted by: AMDZen
Originally posted by: SP33Demon
I don't believe any conspiracies but I DO KNOW that explosives were used to bring down the WTC Towers. My dad is a physics teacher and shows this to his class as well:
Text
How the explosives got there, I don't know nor care but if you think that "frame was melted by fire" or "collapsed on its own" then you're a moron.
So we have fvcking retard #2 and #3 now. But I guess one was bred from the other, so we'll just count them as one.
The fact is, physics can only be applied to structural engineering. It doesn't make an expert of physics an expert of structural engineering. What grade, class, and school does your dad teach any way? There is a huge difference between say a 7th grade physics teacher and a theoretical Physics professor at MIT. Maybe you can provide your dad with more credibility - but I doubt it
Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.
I pulled out a statistic from a site you say is "activist" and it was correct, wow. Do you really take yourself so seriously?Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: SP33Demon
The site I linked took 2 seconds to get from Google, lol. It doesn't discount the fact that its information was correct, gas last July was $2.14. If you actually think I read activist sites then more power to ya, but I'm laughing over here.Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: SP33Demon
Nope, not into oil conspiracies although I did find it odd that a year after Katrina that we were still at 25% higher prices from PreKatrina levels. I attribute that to poor management of our country's overflowing reserves which weren't used (and should have been IMO) to mitigate international spikes in price for oil.Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: BrokenVisage
Originally posted by: Amused
SP33Demon,
The problem here is, you WANT to believe this. Just like your strange need to believe in a vast conspiracy among oil companies. You LIKE conspiracy theories. They do something for you.
Meanwhile, your logic and ability to think for yourself is left behind. How sad.
Your theory about him is more arrogant and pathetic then any conspiracy theory I could ever come up with. So if we believe in one conspiracy, we automatically are lumped into the oil conspiracy, aliens, going to the moon, etc.? The fact that you think you know how anyone on here thinks or what they want to believe is laughable and you are scum for trying to put such a untrue facade on anybody. Yeah, we LOVE conspiracies, when I'm having sex all I can think about is that building coming down. Give me a break, Amused. :roll:
I'm going to assume that he was basing this on some actual statement about oil conspiracy theories on the part of sp33d demon
It was explained to you that:
a. Oil prices are 25% higher than pre Katrina and...
b. The strategic reserves are for emergencies, not to ease the pinch on your wallet.
The oil companies had nothing to do with it.
Also, in an attempt to prove your point you produced a highly biased activist site full of conspiracy theories but conveniently missing the two very obvious points I made above.
It is the same thing you're doing here. You are believing whole cloth the claims of Loose Change without thinking critically. This tells me you WANT to believe it.
Maybe this page can do that for you:
http://www.loosechangeguide.com/lcg3.html
The claims in Loose Change are so patently absurd, you'd have to WANT to believe it to actually believe it.
And it still doesn't change the fact that I think the reserves SHOULD be used to ease the pinch on our wallets, especially when the reserves have been at all time highs for awhile now. Hence I chalk it up as very crappy domestic policy on oil, not a "conspiracy" that I got from some "activist" site.
Even if you don't read that site, you didn't even assess it for bias before using it as a reference. But since you parroted their argument almost 100%, I find it very unlikely that you hadn't read it before.
And crappy domestic policy is using emergency supplies in time of non-emergencies. You just don't do that. That leaves you fscked if and when a real emergency arises.
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
the united states government has proven in the past of conspiring to kill innocent americans for foreign policy goals.
proof of conspiracy:
Operation Northwoods
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
the united states government has proven in the past of conspiring to kill innocent americans for foreign policy goals.
proof of conspiracy:
Operation Northwoods
Proof of a conspiracy that never happened? Never came close to happening? Yeah...
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
the united states government has proven in the past of conspiring to kill innocent americans for foreign policy goals.
proof of conspiracy:
Operation Northwoods
Proof of a conspiracy that never happened? Never came close to happening? Yeah...
it's proof of a conspiracy. whether or not it went through isn't the point (although it was only missing 2 signatures).
it's irrefutable proof the united states government has the ability to conspire against the public AND hide it for 40+ years.
Originally posted by: SP33Demon
Nope, not into oil conspiracies although I did find it odd that a year after Katrina that we were still at 25% higher prices from PreKatrina levels. I attribute that to poor management of our country's overflowing reserves which weren't used (and should have been IMO) to mitigate international spikes in price for oil.
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
the united states government has proven in the past of conspiring to kill innocent americans for foreign policy goals.
proof of conspiracy:
Operation Northwoods
Proof of a conspiracy that never happened? Never came close to happening? Yeah...
it's proof of a conspiracy. whether or not it went through isn't the point (although it was only missing 2 signatures).
it's irrefutable proof the united states government has the ability to conspire against the public AND hide it for 40+ years.
No, it's irrefutable proof that a handful of people can trite documents about conspiring against the people and hide it for 40+ years. Do you really believe that if they had legions of men out there committing these acts that it would have stayed secret for long?
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
the united states government has proven in the past of conspiring to kill innocent americans for foreign policy goals.
proof of conspiracy:
Operation Northwoods
Proof of a conspiracy that never happened? Never came close to happening? Yeah...
it's proof of a conspiracy. whether or not it went through isn't the point (although it was only missing 2 signatures).
it's irrefutable proof the united states government has the ability to conspire against the public AND hide it for 40+ years.
No, it's irrefutable proof that a handful of people can trite documents about conspiring against the people and hide it for 40+ years. Do you really believe that if they had legions of men out there committing these acts that it would have stayed secret for long?
They don't want us to know that they don't know.Originally posted by: sadguy
that's still proof of a conspiracy. of course the government can keep conspiracies secret for decades. just look at the jfk files, which are still sealed. i wonder why?
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: So
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
the united states government has proven in the past of conspiring to kill innocent americans for foreign policy goals.
proof of conspiracy:
Operation Northwoods
Proof of a conspiracy that never happened? Never came close to happening? Yeah...
it's proof of a conspiracy. whether or not it went through isn't the point (although it was only missing 2 signatures).
it's irrefutable proof the united states government has the ability to conspire against the public AND hide it for 40+ years.
No, it's irrefutable proof that a handful of people can trite documents about conspiring against the people and hide it for 40+ years. Do you really believe that if they had legions of men out there committing these acts that it would have stayed secret for long?
that's still proof of a conspiracy. of course the government can keep conspiracies secret for decades. just look at the jfk files, which are still sealed. i wonder why?
Originally posted by: Nocturnal
Originally posted by: DonVito
Although I don't subscribe to conspiracy theories, the poll numbers in this area are, IMO, clearly a by-product of the Bush administration's willingness to engage in all kinds of skullduggery and lie about it. I personally don't believe they have the competence to carry out a plan of this magnitude and keep it secret (and I also don't believe that President Bush, in particular, would green-light the murder of thousands of American civilians), but it's undeniably the case that 9/11 enabled them to carry out the pre-ordained agenda of the PNAC, and there's just no question that that plan was and is the number one agenda item for the Bush presidency.
A lot of well-qualified engineers, academics, and firefighters support a 9/11 conspiracy theory, and I think it's important that we are able to discuss this in a civil way - if anything it annoys me that so many people feel compelled to throw around the "tinfoil hat" barbs, which I think are nonproductive and antithetical to the American right to freedom of speech.
I'll play devil's advocate, how do you know for sure Bush wouldn't okay the murder of 3000+ innocent victims? You don't, honestly, nobody does. It could have happend and it could not have happend. Who knows? I'd sure like to know for sure, 100% though
Originally posted by: Vic
They don't want us to know that they don't know.Originally posted by: sadguy
that's still proof of a conspiracy. of course the government can keep conspiracies secret for decades. just look at the jfk files, which are still sealed. i wonder why?
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
SP33 has been owned so many times in the past 2 days it isnt funny.
and i actually forgot about that one fact that keeps getting brought up, when watching the conspiracist movies.
the entire building never readched 0... there were still 30 or so stories that werent colapsed when they say it finishes collapsing...
and the image of the dust lower than the building is SOOO key.
Originally posted by: Legendary
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
SP33 has been owned so many times in the past 2 days it isnt funny.
and i actually forgot about that one fact that keeps getting brought up, when watching the conspiracist movies.
the entire building never readched 0... there were still 30 or so stories that werent colapsed when they say it finishes collapsing...
and the image of the dust lower than the building is SOOO key.
If this is true, it is surely an important point to this discussion. 30 stories is roughly 20-25% of the WTC's height.
Originally posted by: Number1
Link
Quote: A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.
The conspiracy theory advocates are gaining ground. Unbelievable.
Soon we will all be wearing a tin hat.
It is sad to think that half the population thinks that their own government is willing to kill thousand of its own citizens to achieve its foreign policy.
Flame suit on.
Originally posted by: AMDZen
Actually, the whole JFK thing has finally been proven. The single bullet theory is 100% true. This was done by taking the square in which it happened, exactly as it was then, and recreating it EXACTLY in a computer model. Putting the gunman in the exact window he was in, having the bullet fired at the car on the exact trajectory (using the video footage we do have) and proving once and for a all that it was ONE bullet and ONE person.