Bahhh, I'm such a nerd.

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Beev

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2006
7,775
0
0
I agree, if a character on screen makes me roll my eyes and want them to leave, that's a failure of the game. Obviously they can't please everyone, though.

Tidus RUINED FFX for me, but the battle system was just so damn good. FFX also had a great stat maxing system.
 

ApexBoost

Member
May 5, 2011
125
0
0
I really enjoyed X, especially playing blitzball. I probbly spent more time doing that than anything.
 

RavenSEAL

Diamond Member
Jan 4, 2010
8,661
3
0
I agree, if a character on screen makes me roll my eyes and want them to leave, that's a failure of the game. Obviously they can't please everyone, though.

Tidus RUINED FFX for me, but the battle system was just so damn good. FFX also had a great stat maxing system.

The stat system killed it for me, I guess I was too young when I ran through it...
 
Mar 11, 2004
23,444
5,848
146
To keep on topic. I did try FFIX but lost interest so quickly I don't remember anything from it. I played most of the way through FFVI and Chrono Trigger, and a decent amount of FFVII and Chrono Cross. FFXIII didn't appeal to me at all, I even hated watching my friend play it. Him and his brother used to play the hell out of like every RPG they got their hands on which is a hell of a lot of them. Some were ok to watch (Breath of Fire III, Lunar 2, FFX, I can't even remember a ton of other ones).

IMO, JRPGs are all about 2 major things:

Story
Characters

Everything else can be refined and honed to truly make the game exceptional, but without those two pillars, the game is nothing.

If I find myself groaning out loud, questioning what in God's name the rationale was for a particular plot path, or basically thinking to myself, "Why the $^#@ did THAT just happen?!?", that's a bad sign. That's essentially what happened with FF8, FF9, FF10, and many later, edgier JRPGs.
Also, if I find myself rolling my eyes at certain characters and their dialogue, and basically thinking, "STFU and get off the screen, already" (see FF8, FF9, FF10), that's another failure.

EDIT: (Note: Just to be clear, that's bound to happen a little bit with most Japanese games due to cultural differences. But to be specific, I meant that happens multiple times)

Battle systems are nice, balancing and difficulty/gameplay are important, and I love me some great JRPG music, but that's all secondary to the story and the characters.
I didn't even put graphics down. I honestly think it's the least important aspect of an RPG.

That's why the great, simple 16-bit RPGs of yesteryear blow the ever-living CRAP out of what's come out the last decade: Engaging stories, and characters you care about.

I'm with you on that. I'm not big into JRPGs because I don't tend to like the battle systems (or random encounters or other things that get tiring, like level grinding when I already don't enjoy the battle system much), but I feel like I miss out on a lot of decent story/characters. I can force myself to play some even though I find it to be a bit tedious (Skies of Arcadia for instance) if it has some enjoyable characters/story, but I lose interest really quickly in JRPGs.

I need more action. Actually, I just need a decent amount of control and there to be movement involved (take for instance FFTactics). Even just a robust loot system could help wonders for some games. I wouldn't mind one trying a very action oriented battle system that is more like playing a fighting game or something. Toss the stats altogether and have it be based on skill and development (i.e. as the game progresses you learn more parry and combos and things like that, maybe make the magic system be sort of like a puzzle game where you can impact the speed of casting based on how quickly you can "solve" the puzzle).

I think my personal favorite JRPG is Star Ocean 2. It wasn't stellar, but it had the right mix of gameplay, action, story, and characters/world for my interest at the time. I'd like to play it on an emulator and see how I like it now.
 
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exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
The final Final Fantasy was Final Fantasy 6. It went downhill after that.

If you have never played or gotten into the Final Fantasy series, do yourself a favor and ONLY play 4, 5, and 6, and end it there with good memories.

When you have a jRPG with more mini games than main plot, you know you are trying too hard and failing miserably.
 

Sulaco

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2003
3,825
46
91
Boy, you are really blowing your hate for a game out of proportion...

Do you not understand basic context?

The previous posters were talking about the FF series as a whole, and even more broadly, JRPGs as a whole. Not one part of my quoted post was specific to any one game. Perhaps you're just overly defensive of your game.
It was response to the previous posters who were discussing things they did or didn't like in previous FFs, and RPGs as a whole. Those are rubrics, for me, that can be applied to nearly any JRPG.

Of course, FFIX is a horrible offender in those areas, so I can see why you would think I was only bashing it, but alas...
 

Pr0d1gy

Diamond Member
Jan 30, 2005
7,774
0
76
I think a lot of you are overreacting and I question if some of you even played the games you claim suck in this series or if maybe, just maybe, you didn't get it when you wanted and decided to hate it because.
 

Beev

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2006
7,775
0
0
I think a lot of you are overreacting and I question if some of you even played the games you claim suck in this series or if maybe, just maybe, you didn't get it when you wanted and decided to hate it because.

I played quite a few JRPG's before my first Final Fantasy, which was 7. I liked it a lot and then got and hated 7. Went back to 6 and enjoyed it, but not as much as 7. Nine came out and I played it almost to completion and then just... stopped (I had tried to fight and lost against some floating ship(?)). I have no idea how close to the end I was, but it was disc 4.

Ten came out a little earlier than it was supposed to and I got it immediately, though I was cynical of the marketing because all it talked about were "real time voices" and some crap about better graphics. I hated it. Tidus is a sack of crap and only a couple of the other characters are worth anything, plus at the time I hated the sphere grid. That game was very bad to me then.

Twelve was average and forgettable but I did finish it. Same for Thirteen. Over the years I've played all of the others for at least some time.

Chrono Trigger is better than any Final Fantasy
 

Sulaco

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2003
3,825
46
91
I think a lot of you are overreacting and I question if some of you even played the games you claim suck in this series or if maybe, just maybe, you didn't get it when you wanted and decided to hate it because.

Speaking for myself, I own every game in the series, to this day, except the first Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy 2 (NOT IV. Japanese 2) and FF13. And the online entries. None of which I mentioned.

Every game I own, I've either beaten, or (according to official walkthroughs) finished 85-95% of the story.

Why someone would assume there would be "ulterior motives" for 'hating' games they own is baffling, especially since (in the case of VIII and X), that hatred is not exactly uncommon. But whatever you want to think.
 

Pr0d1gy

Diamond Member
Jan 30, 2005
7,774
0
76
Speaking for myself, I own every game in the series, to this day, except the first Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy 2 (NOT IV. Japanese 2) and FF13. And the online entries. None of which I mentioned.

Every game I own, I've either beaten, or (according to official walkthroughs) finished 85-95% of the story.

Why someone would assume there would be "ulterior motives" for 'hating' games they own is baffling, especially since (in the case of VIII and X), that hatred is not exactly uncommon. But whatever you want to think.

People are like that. Others also just go with the crowd so if it is cool to hate 8 or 10 then they jump right in with their "horror story" despite the fact they played the crap out of it when they were kids.

I played 1 when it came out and I was a kid. Didn't play another until 7 and I really enjoyed the story much more. I had fun with 8 although the story and characters were kind of vanilla. The card game and many discoverable summons made that one fun for me. I played 9 a lot but never finished it, I remember my toon was in some city with walkways that seemed up in the air if that helps anyone ID where I left off but I just left it one day and never went back. After that I played 13 and while it was horribly linear for a FF I found the story and characters to be completely engrossing and it is, to this day, the only game that ever made me shed a tear.

Now, wouldn't it have been a lot cooler if I came in here and said yeah FF 13 is crap, like everyone else has? The difference between me and most people is I genuinely don't give a flying fuck what anyone thinks of me, so I can write something like that where some other people here would never put that out there. You really don't see how that could happen? Really?
 

Sulaco

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2003
3,825
46
91
The difference between me and most people is I genuinely don't give a flying fuck what anyone thinks of me, so I can write something like that where some other people here would never put that out there. You really don't see how that could happen? Really?

The problem with that theory is that older Final Fantasy games just aren't "cool" to hate like your Halos, Call of Duty's, etc. Nobody cares. It's not "cool" to say you hated FFIX and FF X. Generally, people exaggerate their hate when they resent a game's popularity. FF VIII, IX, and X are, what, 10-14 years old? Nobody cares.

Maybe you meant 'finished', but yes, I have a hard time believing that 'a lot' of the people who are posting their dislike for a game, 15 years after the fact, never actually played it and do so because it makes them look cool on an internet dork forum.

Like I said, I can only speak for myself. I thought they were mostly terrible, and they still sit on my shelf as part of my collection.
 
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waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
10
81
FF series was great up until X after X it went to shit.

I have 1-9 and have played and replayed them a lot (FF 6 is by far the best). come to think of it most of Chronosofts games during that period were good.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
I just wanted some quick clarification, isn't 6 actually just 3?

There's always been a bit of confusion over some of the numbering used during Squaresoft's Nintendo days. The problem is that Square never released Final Fantasy 2 (NES), 3 (NES) or 5 (SNES) here originally, which means that we had adjusted numbers as not to confuse our feeble American brains.

Final Fantasy II (US) = Final Fantasy IV (JP)
Final Fantasy III (US) = Final Fantasy VI (JP)

Typically, you'll see people use terms like I did above when referring to the American names for the games to help differentiate. It's especially important since we've actually had the missing games released over here on various platforms.
 

Nemesis13

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2006
1,226
1
81
I loved 6,7,8,9,10. I started with 7 when i was 13. What the hell is with all the hate for 8? I will admit after i beat 9 i was like well that sucked, dusted it off last year and found i was off base its a solid entry just not what i was expecting after 8. Square and Final Fantasy as it were is dead in my eyes, recent installments are 100% trash. I have hope for Versus 13, but it is dwindling.
 

magomago

Lifer
Sep 28, 2002
10,973
14
76
IMO, JRPGs are all about 2 major things:

Story
Characters

Everything else can be refined and honed to truly make the game exceptional, but without those two pillars, the game is nothing.

If I find myself groaning out loud, questioning what in God's name the rationale was for a particular plot path, or basically thinking to myself, "Why the $^#@ did THAT just happen?!?", that's a bad sign. That's essentially what happened with FF8, FF9, FF10, and many later, edgier JRPGs.
Also, if I find myself rolling my eyes at certain characters and their dialogue, and basically thinking, "STFU and get off the screen, already" (see FF8, FF9, FF10), that's another failure.

EDIT: (Note: Just to be clear, that's bound to happen a little bit with most Japanese games due to cultural differences. But to be specific, I meant that happens multiple times)

Battle systems are nice, balancing and difficulty/gameplay are important, and I love me some great JRPG music, but that's all secondary to the story and the characters.
I didn't even put graphics down. I honestly think it's the least important aspect of an RPG.

That's why the great, simple 16-bit RPGs of yesteryear blow the ever-living CRAP out of what's come out the last decade: Engaging stories, and characters you care about.

No No No No. You clearly have a rosy memory of the 16 bit era. I still love playing the 16 bit games (FF3/6 again!) but one thing I've noticed is that the development of the characters are a lot more primitive. Intros are somewhat rushed, you are told the history of a character and instantly are supposed to connect with them.
I'll give a good example of a character from FF6, which is a game that receives acclaim for its story: Cyan.

When I first played him, I remember thinking of a valiant and honorable knight (to where his chivalry made him somewhat awkward) whose castle was wrongly poisoned; he fought with his heart for his family, but lost them despite his bravery and had to say goodbye forcefully to them. Only later he had the opportunity to remember the past, do justice for his people, and truly express how much he cared about his wife and children.

That is how I remembered it...until I went back to play the game and then each part felt somewhat dry; the transitions between the emotional scenes also occurred abruptly and felt shallow.

Its still a great game, and some of the dialogue is hilarious (early encounters between locke and celeste are great!) but the character development leaves something to be desired. I think its that creativity played a bigger role in our minds, and we took that with us.

I thought ff9 was okay, but 9 did a MUCH better job developing the character and really letting you feel who he or she was. I got to understand Zidane, Adelbert, Eiko (etc) a lot better than Locke, Celeste, Terra. If you go back and play both, paying attention to the character development, you will start to see that. My main complaint of FF9 is that while you really got to feel for the characters, they actually didn't develop or evolve too much over the course of the game - this is a big problem with FF games in general.

Its one reason why I liked FF8 a lot - Squall and Rinoa's relationship developed slowly and went back and forth at periods of time, each character (well most lol) underwent changes that showed them to be truly different people. Squall at the beginning was not squall at the end; you went from an emo teenager trying to get away from it all to someone who was mature enough to stand up to...a last minute boss that had less than 5 extremely subtle references in the game. In FF7 you saw it somewhat with Cloud...but most everyone was the same: Cid was Cid, Barret was Barret, Tifa was Tifa.
Heck, the whole 'sepiroth=evil' thing was just something that you had to accept until you could go back to the game.
When I think of the FF game that had the best story, the best character development, and the most dynamic characters (I haven't played 12, X-, or 13) I would hands given give it to Final Fantasy Crisis Core for the PSP.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
I didn't have much of an issue with Cyan's character development in FF6. Part of it was the music too... The Unforgiven is a great track. They do spend awhile with him since you deal with Kefka poisoning the castle's water supply and then he tries to rescue his family by stopping the Phantom Train (Phoenix Down anyone?).
 

Pr0d1gy

Diamond Member
Jan 30, 2005
7,774
0
76
What the hell is with all the hate for 8?

I often wonder the same thing because every FF thread I have ever seen people blast 8 and I found it to be fun, but like I and others here have said it is only your opinion and things I liked about 8 other people may find less appealing.
 

AnthonyStarks24

Junior Member
May 5, 2012
12
0
0
FF 9 was definitely a great game to play, it wasn't as flashy as 8 (which was total garbage) or hyped as 7 (which was amazing) but it most certainly a game that im glad i got to play
 
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