Bought a 2600k

[mrSHEiK124]

If it is any consolation, $55 is more than I ever spent on a psu. And this one costed $80 new, and would probably have costed $90 if it wasnt a "newegg house brand". On my q6600 overclocked gaming machine at home I am using a $50 psu, and its been running fine for 4 years now.

I do not understand how we go from a $90 psu to one that has junk components. Could it be that it is <$60 now after 3 years not because it is junky but merely because newegg has made so much profit sellling them?

It's a Rosewill...the name doesn't exactly ring bells of "quality"

 

[blackened23]

It's a Rosewill...the name doesn't exactly ring bells of "quality"

Unfortunately its one of the things you just learn over time -- there are some things in life that you just don't skimp on. I'm as thrifty as the OP is probably, but after having 2 chips die from shady cooling and 2 PSU's go kaboom those are some things that i'll never skimp on again. Now of course he may never have problems, but I know i'll never risk it with my own cash.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Unfortunately its one of the things you just learn over time -- there are some things in life that you just don't skimp on. I'm as thrifty as the OP is probably, but after having 2 chips die from shady cooling and 2 PSU's go kaboom those are some things that i'll never skimp on again. Now of course he may never have problems, but I know i'll never risk it with my own cash.

Totally true. Just in case my posts made it sound otherwise in this thread - I *never* skimp on the power supply, I just have more realistic estimates of what kind of wattage I need. Again, I'm usually happier spending the $ on modular cables rather than 200W of capacity I'll never ever use.

 

[sm625]

But again, how is a $80 power supply for a 150 watt system in any way"skimping"? Of what substandard components are you referring to? I am just not seeing the logic of these arguments. You're talking about 50 cents of psu per watt. Following that same logic, you'd need a $300 psu to properly run a gaming machine that pulls 600 watts. Such a claim is obviously spurious.

 

[blackened23]

There's no argument, you were given advice based on others experiences and you decided what you decided. There's a large variance in the quality of soldering, capacitors, heatsinks, and numerous other parts inside the PSU that directly translates from how cheap of a shit psu you can get....My buddy runs a comoputer shop and he tells me stories of bad PSU's having leaking capacitors and what not, from using cheap components. Looking in one of my old PSU's I found all kind of shoddy crap like marginal soldering and loose screws, things that are transparent to the end user. You asked for advice in your original post , you got it, why argue? Its like talking to a stop sign because you obviously have your mind made up after 10+ people advise you to get a futureproof PSU... why get defensive about it. Jack Shepard learned the hard way, you don't buy a marginal PSU and fly to australia....bad things can happen...

 

[DougoMan]

If you are seriously going to spend $300 on Windows you might as well just save some money and get a complete system from a major manufacturer.

 

[Idontcare]

But again, how is a $80 power supply for a 150 watt system in any way"skimping"? Of what substandard components are you referring to? I am just not seeing the logic of these arguments. You're talking about 50 cents of psu per watt. Following that same logic, you'd need a $300 psu to properly run a gaming machine that pulls 600 watts. Such a claim is obviously spurious.

That you are ignorant of matters relating to electronics is not unexpected, we are all born ignorant of all things about this world and we remain ignorant of them until we come to be educated about them.

That you are arrogant about the fact that you are ignorant of matters relating to electronics is the root of the problem.

Lose your arrogant attitude, educate yourself, and stop being silly about the fact that you know as well as everyone else that you get what you pay for.

Some educational materials you could have found for yourself had you cared to visit our PSU sub-forum:
Capacitors and the Computer PSU
Power Supply FAQs

And lastly, read a few PSU reviews, even if they are not specific to the one you are buying, so as to educate yourself on the things to be aware of and cautious about when deciding to buy questionable quality PSU's:
Reviews - Superflower Golden Green 450W

You keep making these circular logic arguments that betray your ignorance of the entire state of the art behind the electronics of PSU's and why the cheap ones are priced cheap versus why the spendy ones are priced to be spendy.

Do some homework, then you might out find why so many members here are cautioning you against being a penny-wise but a pound-foolish with your PSU purchase.

 

[dma0991]

There was an article written by Tom's a while back about why you shouldn't buy a cheap PSU. You are paying a lot for the major components and I don't see why you should skimp on a cheap PSU. I think the money spent is worth it for better components and stricter quality control.

 

[blackened23]

Every time someone buys a cheap PSU , little kittens die and Evangaline Lily is forced back to the island. Do it for the kittens.

 

[sm625]

You keep making these circular logic arguments that betray your ignorance of the entire state of the art behind the electronics of PSU's and why the cheap ones are priced cheap versus why the spendy ones are priced to be spendy.

Do some homework, then you might out find why so many members here are cautioning you against being a penny-wise but a pound-foolish with your PSU purchase.

A power supply that carries a MSRP price tag of $80 is not "cheap".
It is more than I have ever spent on a psu.
It is more than I will ever spend on a psu.
It is more than 99&#37; of people have ever spent on a psu.
It is more than 99% of people will ever spend on a psu.

That isnt circular logic, it is just the facts.

If you want "circular logic" how about this: I say the power supply I bought isnt cheap. It isnt. Point of fact, it is not cheap. By virtue of it being in the 99% bracket of power supply retail pricing. Yet you guys keep saying dont skimp on a power supply. It makes no sense. Skimping is buying a $14 POWMAX supply. But even those last for years more often than not.

 

[sm625]

Anyway, I got my 2600k. I have it clocked at 3.6 GHz base, with the following turbo modes:

1 core 4.2
2 core 4.0
3 core 3.8
4 core 3.6

Core voltage set to 1.31

I noticed that when running torture tests the intel stock hsf is pretty crappy. Core temps reach 79C even at just 3.6. But if I run just 1 core (2 threads) even at 4.2 it barely goes over 50C. So I'm thinking I should be able to get 1 core turbo up to 4.6. Maybe 4.8? Does anyone do this, or do yall just run the whole chip at 4.5 and disable turbo?

 

[mrSHEiK124]

A power supply that carries a MSRP price tag of $80 is not "cheap".
It is more than I have ever spent on a psu.
It is more than I will ever spend on a psu.
It is more than 99% of people have ever spent on a psu.
It is more than 99% of people will ever spend on a psu.

That isnt circular logic, it is just the facts.

If you want "circular logic" how about this: I say the power supply I bought isnt cheap. It isnt. Point of fact, it is not cheap. By virtue of it being in the 99% bracket of power supply retail pricing. Yet you guys keep saying dont skimp on a power supply. It makes no sense. Skimping is buying a $14 POWMAX supply. But even those last for years more often than not.

Just, no. For an extra dollar you would've gotten a better power supply.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371047
This is an Antec HCG-520. 520W < 600W, right? Wrong.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4343/antec-hcg-520-good-bargain
This is its review HERE at Anandtech.

+3.3V and +5V combined maximum output: 130W
+12V1 maximum output: 40A(480W)
Total Continuous Power: 520W

This is your Rosewill

Computers stopped needing that much on the 3.3V and 5V rail around the Pentium 4 era. Stop using price as a bearing of quality. It is not even close to the best thing you can buy for the money!

Anyway, I got my 2600k. I have it clocked at 3.6 GHz base, with the following turbo modes:

1 core 4.2
2 core 4.0
3 core 3.8
4 core 3.6

Core voltage set to 1.31

I noticed that when running torture tests the intel stock hsf is pretty crappy. Core temps reach 79C even at just 3.6. But if I run just 1 core (2 threads) even at 4.2 it barely goes over 50C. So I'm thinking I should be able to get 1 core turbo up to 4.6. Maybe 4.8? Does anyone do this, or do yall just run the whole chip at 4.5 and disable turbo?

Get a heatsink. Don't skimp :sneaky:

 

[blackened23]

Anyway, I got my 2600k. I have it clocked at 3.6 GHz base, with the following turbo modes:

1 core 4.2
2 core 4.0
3 core 3.8
4 core 3.6

Core voltage set to 1.31

I noticed that when running torture tests the intel stock hsf is pretty crappy. Core temps reach 79C even at just 3.6. But if I run just 1 core (2 threads) even at 4.2 it barely goes over 50C. So I'm thinking I should be able to get 1 core turbo up to 4.6. Maybe 4.8? Does anyone do this, or do yall just run the whole chip at 4.5 and disable turbo?

I can't believe I just read this. Just..no. What the hell are you doing? 3.6 base? Why would you set the base at anything but 1600 base / 3700 turbo with stock HSF? (the default), did you do any research before you went out and spent 3$ on your new system. Overclocking 1 core, *head spins*. Kittens everywhere just got punched in the face because of you, I hope you're happy. Nothing against you of course but your decisions are strange to say the least.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Here are more better, cheaper power supplies.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371016
444W on the 12V rails. MODULAR.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371030
480W (12V * 40A).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371031
12V * 48A - This is a real 600W+ unit.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817139027
Only 408W on the 12V rail. But the MSRP is only $69. And it's really only $40 AR. By your rules...

 

[BonzaiDuck]

All this fuss about PSUs! If you don't overclock, your main worry is longevity.

I used to buy the $35 "ALLIED" PSU with the gray primer paint. Once -- I bought an Enermax that, truth be told, was a pretty cheap model. [Not all Enermax are cheap, but that one was . . ]

They were gone -- gone south -- within about three years. In fact, just about every little PC crisis I had with PSUs was exclusive to the low end models.

Rules of thumb: If the PSU weighs more, it may have better quality. The longer the warranty period, the more likely it's a reliable PSU. Some PSUs have adjustable rails, some don't. That adjustability is not necessarily a quality factor; if the unit ships so that all rails are within the +/- 2&#37; ATX spec, you don't need adjustability.

I buy and use Seasonic PSUs for my best OC'd builds. For budget builds (which may be mildly overclocked for the fam-damn-ily) -- I might pick an Antec NeoPower.

More recently, BFG (which apparently is no longer in bidnis) offered a "spesh-ul dee-ul" on a 500W unit they were promoting, for $34. Out of curiosity (and before the recent economic downturn) -- I chose to try one. It was a "paper-airplane" for weight. Within 10 minutes of hooking it up with new components, I fried a motherboard with it. BFG had been looking over our Anandtech shoulders when I was whining about it, and made contact to give me an RMA# and directions. Very kind of them, but I decided just not to bother with it.

If I ever switch from Seasonic for my "special" projects, the replacement will be an "80-plus 'Gold'." Forget the Silver and Bronze.

It is also useful to trace the "re-badging" practice in that industry. PC Power & Cooling (hereafter PCP&C) had been using re-badged Seasonics for their "Silencer" model line. Then OCZ bought PCP&C.

There are a lot of good PSUs out there by different makers. You want to find the best for the minimum price without skimping. So serious on-line reviews and especially comparison reviews at sites like "Tech-Report" should be consulted and the resulting information might at least temper your choices.

Also, I see there was a barrage of derision for NewEgg's "Rosewill." It may be true that some of these are low-end units. But there is an "S12" model, and I'd almost swear it's a rebadged Seasonic. Since I only just saw it today, I'll have to look a bit more, and anyone who might take this remark as a cue will do so at their own risk . . . .

 

[Rvenger]

The Rosewill PSU is manufactured by ATNG and is a decent power supply. The problem with this particular unit is that it has a Passive PFC and cannot deliver 80+ efficiency no matter what, plus its only ATX v2.01. That being the reason, it shouldn't be considered.

Get this one and its the same price. ATX spec 2.2. I have the same PSU and it works like a charm, its made by Delta and its partially modular!

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...k=BP550%2b


EDIT: Noticed he has the parts up and running. Should of read the whole thread

 

[ShadowVVL]

I did not know oem oses were for licensed businesses. A week ago my oem vista 64 ult was invalid after 3 years and have been a bit lazy but was going to call them on monday but I guess I can skip that.

Thank you Idontcare, now i know not to buy windows OEMs.

 

[Idontcare]

I did not know oem oses were for licensed businesses. A week ago my oem vista 64 ult was invalid after 3 years and have been a bit lazy but was going to call them on monday but I guess I can skip that.

Thank you Idontcare, now i know not to buy windows OEMs.

I've been buying OEM versions of MS OSes since win95. I own 8 XP OEM licenses. My first, and only, Win7 OEM resulted in the horror story I laid out above.

From the responses I get the impression that people either don't believe me or they don't believe the situation regarding OEM and DIYers. At any rate I've been on the phone w/MS support, used their web support, etc, and after going round and round on it for nearly 3 months I am now the owner of 3 retail (not OEM) Win7 Ult.

Will not be buying OEM again, ever. Those of you that continue to do so are definitely doing it at your own risk, I learned and won't be making that mistake again.

Prior to Win7, microsoft did allow individuals (DIY'ers) to buy and use OEM software...that changed with Win7 and all you have to do is a simple google search for "who can use OEM windows 7" and read page upon page of links on the EULA change.

Previous to Windows 7, Microsoft actually did allow individuals to purchase OEM versions of Windows, but only if they intended to install it on a brand-new PC that they were building. As Ed Bott pointed out in a 2008 blog post, the previous end user license agreement (EULA) for OEM Windows versions specified the following:
OEM system builder software packs are intended for PC and server manufacturers or assemblers ONLY. They are not intended for distribution to end users. Unless the end user is actually assembling his/her own PC, in which case, that end user is considered a system builder as well.

This is pretty clear-cut. Sadly, this language does not appear in the licensing for OEM versions of Windows 7. Yes, individuals can still buy OEM versions of Windows 7. But they cannot then install that copy of Windows 7 on a PC they are building for themselves. Instead, they can only install it on a PC that they then sell--and support--to someone else. And they must do so using Microsoft's OEM pre-installation kit (OPK), a step that is clearly aimed at further preventing this type of software from being used by the hobbyist market.

What was interesting about my case is that they actually went in an unvalidated a previously valid install of Win7 without me having done anything to the system. One day it is valid, next day it is no longer valid.

Then when I went to find out why it was no longer valid as well as to have it re-validated that is when I was told I needed to prove I was not a DIYer but that I actually bought the system from a licensed OEM reseller.

Here is what I was directed to read by the MS activation support people:
http://www.microsoft.com/OEM/en/licensing/sblicensing/Pages/licensing_for_hobbyists.aspx

Licensing for Hobbyists
There is a growing market for "do-it-yourself" home PC hobbyists who assemble PCs from components for their own use. Microsoft retail software licenses are the appropriate licenses for the do-it-yourself market. OEM System Builder software is not intended for this use, unless the PC that is assembled is being resold to another party.&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;&#8203;

And there you have it. There's no arguing that using Win7 OEM software is the same as using Vista and earlier OEM software, the EULA has changed.

And I can attest from personal experience that there's no arguing that MS doesn't care. They invalidated my installation to require me to prove that it a legitimate OEM install - not because my numbers were being used by hackers or some such.

(they may be a little more hungry for Win7 revenue too, which might be why they are getting more aggressive about enforcing the no-OEM for DIY policy)

Everyone is free to discount the facts (EULA and Microsoft stated policy) as well as to discount my anecdotal experience, but all I can tell you that my three retail boxes of Win7 Ult cost me ~$1000 versus the ~$500 that three OEM versions would have cost me...and I spent the $1k after this experience with my first OEM Win7 license and I'm not prone to just "waste" $500 for no good reason.

Caveat Emptor.

 

[blackened23]

Jesus christ wall of text. I and all of my friends only purchase OEM windows 7 because its cheaper and they never get invalidated. You can't speak to a person on the phone at microsoft (really, try calling them, its mission impossible) everything related to validation is completely automated.

The only way for you to get invalidated is by having pirated software, or purchasing an oem copy and being fucking stupid and telling the automated system "hey i'm installing on a 2nd pc". I have reinstalled my oem windows 7's multiple times and here's what happens. If you reinstall your windows on a new motherboard (if you're upgrading your system) , windows will think its a 2nd pc and when you get online - it will invalidate your key and give you 30 days to validate it. ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS USE THE AUTOMATED VALIDATION KEY, and tell the automated system that this is NOT a 2nd computer. (and it isn't, its the same computer with a motherboard upgrade) IT WILL BE VALIDATED JUST FINE. Unless, again, you're an idiot that tells their automated system that you're installing on more than 1 computer.

As long are you aren't stupid you will be fine with oem windows. As long as you don't tell microsoft "hey i'm installing this on 2 PC's" you will be fine. How do they know if you're a system rebuilder or not? Why would they care? Unless you're giving your key to 17 friends and mass installing them on every PC in your neighborhood you will be fine. Do they have spy cameras in your house or something? Give me a break.

 

[Idontcare]

Jesus christ wall of text. I and all of my friends only purchase OEM windows 7 because its cheaper and they never get invalidated. You can't speak to a person on the phone at microsoft (really, try calling them, its mission impossible) everything related to validation is completely automated.

The only way for you to get invalidated is by having pirated software, or purchasing an oem copy and being fucking stupid and telling the automated system "hey i'm installing on a 2nd pc". I have reinstalled my oem windows 7's multiple times and here's what happens. If you reinstall your windows on a new motherboard (if you're upgrading your system) , windows will think its a 2nd pc and when you get online - it will invalidate your key and give you 30 days to validate it. ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS USE THE AUTOMATED VALIDATION KEY, and tell the automated system that this is NOT a 2nd computer. (and it isn't, its the same computer with a motherboard upgrade) IT WILL BE VALIDATED JUST FINE. Unless, again, you're an idiot that tells their automated system that you're installing on more than 1 computer.

As long are you aren't stupid you will be fine with oem windows. As long as you don't tell microsoft "hey i'm installing this on 2 PC's" you will be fine. How do they know if you're a system rebuilder or not? Why would they care? Unless you're giving your key to 17 friends and mass installing them on every PC in your neighborhood you will be fine. Do they have spy cameras in your house or something? Give me a break.

You seem to be rather emotionally invested in your view of reality.

Discount what I experienced all you like, make stuff up if it helps you feel any better (the validation system is NOT 100&#37; automated, you can and will get live person once you reach the levels of support I was directed towards), I was not hacked, they were quite explicit in their statements towards me.

It's posts like yours that just make me sigh, I attempted to relate a cautionary tale based on real-life experience and all you can do is scream back "no no no, its not true, no no no, its not true".

No worries, I'm not the one who is going to burst your bubble and bring you back to reality. Microsoft will do that for you.

 

[blackened23]

You seem to be rather emotionally invested in your view of reality.

Discount what I experienced all you like, make stuff up if it helps you feel any better (the validation system is NOT 100&#37; automated, you can and will get live person once you reach the levels of support I was directed towards), I was not hacked, they were quite explicit in their statements towards me.

It's posts like yours that just make me sigh, I attempted to relate a cautionary tale based on real-life experience and all you can do is scream back "no no no, its not true, no no no, its not true".

No worries, I'm not the one who is going to burst your bubble and bring you back to reality. Microsoft will do that for you.

Fact of the matter is when you install oem windows, the validation key will ALWAYS work on the first install. Period. UNLESS you tell the automated system something stupid. It will work on reinstalls too - you have to revalidate IF you install again on a different motherboard.

Microsoft has no way of know who you are, whether you're an oem, all you are is a number with a validation key. Unless you give the microsoft automated system a reason to think you're pirating or installing multiple copies (i'm guessing you did something stupid like tell the automated system "oh hey i'm installing on more than 1 PC") you'll be fine. My question is why would you need to speak to microsoft in the first place? You have to fail the automated system to even attempt to speak to anyone at microsoft, so I'm certain you did something dumb when going through the automated service.

 

[sm625]

I can't believe I just read this. Just..no. What the hell are you doing? 3.6 base? Why would you set the base at anything but 1600 base / 3700 turbo with stock HSF? (the default), did you do any research before you went out and spent 3$ on your new system. Overclocking 1 core, *head spins*. Kittens everywhere just got punched in the face because of you, I hope you're happy. Nothing against you of course but your decisions are strange to say the least.

? I had no choice. I cant OC all four cores because it will run too hot. I did not know the stock hsf would be half the size of the one that came with my q6600. (Why would they do that anyway?) I did have no trouble running at 4.4 for one core. 4.2 for 2 cores. 4.0 for 3 and 3.8 for 4. I plan on pushing the single core up to 4.6.

As for the 1600, does it really matter where I set the base since it goes down to 1600 at idle anyway?

Will it get better as the stock hsf thermal paste cures? (Or does that stuff cure at all?) Should I strip the thermal paste that came with the stock hsf and apply some arctic silver?

 

[ShadowVVL]

I reinstalled my vista and activated it and it was valid at the beginning of june then august 18th i booted up and got a black screen with a white popup asking me to activate windows then i type the key in over and over and it just keeps saying its invalid.

so if win7 is the only os this effects then should I try talking to MS?

 

[Markfw]

Edit... Everybody should get back on topic. OS crap goes in the OS forum, not CPU.

 

[sm625]

I'm having a problem where prime95 doesnt run at the cpu utilization &#37; I would expect. I made a video that shows what is happening: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAr4UHMx_EE

I'm just wondering if it is my overclocking causing this, or if it is just the way prime95 works. Anyone with a 2600k is welcome to try to reproduce this.