California Power De-Regulation

[Brix13]

All I can say is if you live in Northern California, Rolling Blackouts Suck!

 

[weinir]

heh. i live in so cal and they almost cut power here. well my power aint going out cause i live very close to a fire station...hehehe

 

[matmax]

welcome to the world of deregulation.

 

[Russ]

Deregulation? With a government mandated rate cap of $250 per MH while the utilities are paying $1400?

With an environmental policy that is so restrictive that it has made it impossible for these companies to build new energy plants?

That's not deregulation. That's government stupidity.

Russ, NCNE

 

[Mister T]

ditto on what Russ said...

 

[BP]

Looks like they need LESS regulation out there.

 

[jobert]

>>With a government mandated rate cap of $250 per KH <<

Lets see...
If I use 700 Kilowatt hours
at $250 each, that's $175,000 for
my monthly bill.
I'd say its OK for the &quot;Government&quot;
to cap it at $250/KH. I don't think the
unemployeed single Moms of the USA should
have to go over 175 grand a month to cook a hamburger.

 

[Chris A]

The problem is that they were forced to sell most of there power plants 2 years ago. We have a plant 30 miles away that is owned by a out of state company. They refuse to run it an sell their power unless they can charge through the ASS..

Yes it is stupid. I have been going to work three hours early every day this week to start calling all of our employees to tell them there is no work again.. Several have had reduced paychecks or none at all in the last two weeks.. It sucks watching a single mom cry because you have to tell her again that there is no work... Not to mention the hundereds of thousands that my company has lost in the last month.. If this keeps up they will be forced to move.. Our bills have trippled in one of our plants for Electricity...

The california ISO forced all three of our plants down 19 hours out of 24 every day this week.... Rolling black outs are nothing compared to where this mess is headed...

 

[Russ]

jobert,

I meant megawatt. The point still stands. These companies are being forced in to insolvency because of a stupid and arbitrary rate cap.

Russ, NCNE

 

[JellyBaby]

You need some nuclear power plants. Get over it.

 

[charrison]

chrisa,

hmm being charged out the ass....or no power.

The solution seems obvious. If the price caps gets lifted, these power problems will start going away.

 

[shiznut123]

i want to buy a solar panel for my house

 

[Chris A]

charrison,

Triple what you are paying per month knowing that it is just these power companies greed. There costs have not trippled. They are just taking advantage of the people because the government screwwed up...

These companies are just economic terrorists... The power is there they just wont sell it. In California we already pay some of the highest rates. Now tripple that!! What do you consider a fair rate???

Be aware it will fall to other states next.. These companies are no different then Opec right now and are hurting a lot of people that can do nothing about it... Every night I see on the news the accidents caused when they turn off the power on a busy intersection.,. The police have gave up trying to direct traffic only showing up after the accdent..

These crooks are going after things you and I need to live on.. It is solely driven by greed...

Sorry for the typos

 

[charrison]

Chrisa,

Do some more homework. The cost of electricy is driven by the cost of natural gas. The price of natural gas has risen, but the electric companies cannot charge enough to even pay their bills right now. I guess edison filed bankruptsy just for the hell of it on friday.


As far as not being able to do anything about it, turn some damn lights off.

 

[The Wildcard]

Yes, power companies suck.

 

[Chris A]

<< In 1996 California passed legislation that was designed to help deregulate the state?s electric industry, the fifth largest in the world. Among other provisions, it mandated a 10 percent rate reduction and a cap in charges (the state?s energy prices were at that time 50 percent above the national average). Under the plan, power generators would place bids for their price for producing electricity, allowing energy buyers to shop around. The state?s Power Exchange (PX) publishes its ?spot market? rates hourly so consumers can shift their energy use to lower-priced periods.
What the new system prohibited, however, was for utilities ? San Diego Gas &amp; Electric, Southern California Edison, and Pacific Gas &amp; Electric ? to buy power from suppliers under reduced, long-term contracts, thereby raising the risk of spikes in energy prices when demand is higher, or when fuel supplies are interrupted. That scenario played out this summer (when shortages of electricity caused blackouts to some customers) and again this winter.
For example, in early 2000, wholesale electricity sold for an average of 3 cents per kilowatt hour. But prices shot up to 25 cents in December for the same amount of electricity. >>


News story

 

[Russ]

<< What the new system prohibited, however, was for utilities ? San Diego Gas &amp; Electric, Southern California Edison, and Pacific Gas &amp; Electric ? to buy power from suppliers under reduced, long-term contracts >>



Chris,

That article just proves Charrison's point. The electric utilities have no choice; they aren't trying to screw anyone, they're trying to just survive.

Right now, they are forced to pay five times as much for the product as the government allows them to sell at.

How long do you think they can survive paying $1400 per MH and selling it for $250?

It all boils down to the governments half-assed &quot;deregulation&quot;. They handcuffed the providers.

Russ, NCNE

 

[charrison]

Chrisa,

I am quite aware of that. And the cost has risen to produce electricity as well. If yuo think pge and edison are taking advantage of the consumer, why are they both near bankrupt?
According to you, these 2 companies are rolling in money, when in fact they are 800million in debt.

Buying high and selling low will do it every time. California will have to pay for its mistakes, via high energy prices or a statefunded bailout.


I guess california gets the learn supply and demand economics the hard way.

 

[~zonker~]

The economic implications of this failed deregulation will be felt for years. Hopefully, the power companies will not become part of the government.. but the lawmakers are acting furiously, if not rediculously late to try and avert economic catastrophy...


Standard and Poors has put the state of California on credit watch

I've got my oil lamps, UPS, firewood, and battery operated radios ready. Someone has to be responsible for this... in my 20-20 hindsite, I blame the legislators

 

[Chris A]

charrison,
Re read my first paragraph

During deregulation Edison, PGE, Smud. Were forced to sell most of their power plants to other companies... Now they are forced to buy power from these plants they sold.. Most of these plants were bought from out of state companies who are putting the screws to Edison &amp; PGE..

So the utilities are getting screwed big time as is the California consumer.. charrison, I agree that Edison is doing the best they can as is PGE.


Thanks Russ for the very clear statment



<< It all boils down to the governments half-assed &quot;deregulation&quot;. They handcuffed the providers. >>

 

[ride525]

<< when in fact they are 800million in debt. >>


Actually Edison and PG&amp;E have had to borrow more than $10 BILLION (no misprint) to pay for the excess power costs they can't charge customers.

 

[Nick Stone]

I've read every news article I could get ahold of on this subject.
This is how I see it.

This problem did not just suddenly appear. Shortages of electricy apeared last June. That is also about the time when the big utilities started losing big money.

The big California utilities are allowed no &quot;wiggle room&quot; at all by the governmental regulating agencies.

I challenge someone to suggest a course of action that they would be allowed to take, short term or long term, that could improve the situation.

As an example, when it comes to &quot;scheduled maintenance&quot; -- these utilities must get approval from the regulating body to perform the maintenance. They have been scheduled for the winter since demand for electricity is lower then than in the summer.

 

[Michael]

The following actions should be taken (note, I live in California and will be affected):

1) Rates should be allowed to rise to the full cost of the electricity. Every user should feel the pain of the higher rates

2) Utilities should be allowed to purchase electricy in the forward market

3) The government should approve funds to aid low income families that will be affected by the rise in rates. They also should arrange for tax relief for companies so they will not drive jobs out of California (not 100$, but something)

4) Additional funding should be provided to the agencies that do the environmental reviews for new power plants. All obstacles that are the result of regulation as oppossed to law should be removed.

Once the full pain of the rate hikes hit, NIMBYism will be far less of an easy sell and people will be encouraged to conserve electricity.

As I look over the details of the &quot;deregulation&quot;, I shudder. California is so anti-business and so untrusting of the utilities, they not only froze rates, they did not allow the utilities to by power in the forward market as a hedge (I think they were afraid that the price would be low and the utilities would not pass the savings on).

The people in this thread that are complaining that the cost has not gone up as fast as the rates are forgetting that demand has gone up very, very much while supply has been held down. With a fixed supply and higher demand, prices should rise. Market price is not set by cost alone.

Michael

 

[fallenoncrack]

The single moms of USA can pay just like the rest of us !

Makes me wonder why MOMS are single.....

 

[apoppin]

I am buying a solar power system (panels and hot water) next month.

The good news is that the California utilities commission will pay for half of it in rebates.

It will be nice to see the meter spin backwards for a change. And battery backup for when the grid goes down.