Concealed weapons on campus

[TheVrolok]

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Hey aren't college kids known for being level headed and responsible?

blink....blink....blink

Considering how many college kids I have to deal with who a) can't figure out marijuana is illegal, b) can't figure out when to stop drinking, c) can't remember that they need their damn ID to get back into their dorm... Them carrying guns is such a frightening thought. I keep telling myself that I keep dealing with the same sort over and over again, and that not all college kids are like this. Some of them have to be level headed and responsible, right?

I guess that once you leave college for the real world all these idiots just vanish? College students are no dumber a group than non-students; in fact, I would argue that on average, they're quite a bit smarter - but that just seems obvious to me.

 

[adairusmc]

Originally posted by: Gooberlx2

Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Originally posted by: JLee

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Jeez, it does look like I don't know teh grammer. I dragged and dropped words accidentally.


My point is that we are worried about people, who AREN'T setting out to break laws, carrying guns on campus, especially because of their age. It's not that someone sets out to do something illegal, but if a frat boy is concealed carrying and happens to get into a drunk fight, he might shoot somebody. Considering most apartments don't allow guns, I don't know where they'd keep their guns anyway.

Where do you live, Cali?

Texas. And I've never lived in an apartment where I could have a gun.

Strange. I've never lived in an apt that even addressed guns in their lease.

Neither have I. I would hope that any apartments that don't allow guns burn down with the owners inside or something, they should not be allowed to get away with that in any way, shape, or form.

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: AreaCode707
The only reason I could think of that it would not be a good idea is that somebody might notice a person carrying a gun, assume it was legal, and fail to report in an unusual situation, possibly stopping preventative action. However, since that type of prevention has not ever, to my knowledge, happened, it doesn't seem a strenuous objection. Usually the crazies are either caught before they get the weapons to school or they aren't caught til it's too late.

Concealed means concealed. A CCW Permit holder who has his or her weapon visible in states that do not permit open carry is in violation of the law and subject to the loss of his or her license. It's unlikely that a person with a valid CCW Permit would fail to conceal his or her weapon.

But in the scenario that a non-CCW crazy person has a weapon on campus, it is glimpsed by a bystander, the bystander (without a great deal of technical knowledge of requirements for CCW) might assume the weapon is legal and not a danger when in truth it actually is. The argument here is about bystanders growing lax when encountering a nut, not anything actually to do with a CCW holder.

Additionally, the possession of a legal tool is not sufficient reason for something to be reported. A person simply having a firearm is not, in itself alone, grounds for the assumption that the person should be checked out by "authority". One doesn't assume that a person holding a bottle of wine is an alcoholic and one shouldn't assume that a person with a gun is a criminal. There need to be additional reasons (e.g. person appears agitated, person has made previous threats that the reporter knows about, etc) for the situation to warrant reporting to authorities. A guy pumping gas peacefully with a sidearm on his hip has no reason to be reported to big brother.

ZV

Bolded statement true, which actually underscores the debated point. If weapons are banned on campus and somebody sees one, they then have sufficient reason to report it. If weapons are not banned on campus and somebody sees one, they do not have sufficient reason to report it, thereby possibly allowing something dangerous to take place. Again, I don't think this is an especially strong argument, but it is an argument.

Ditto for the italicized statement. You shouldn't assume that the person with a gun is a criminal unless they are holding a gun in a situation in which it is clearly known they should not be. Hence, setting up a situation where it becomes unusual is then a safety factor.

Once again, I think allowing CCW on campus is a good idea. This is just some of the thought process I went through in evaluating the risks as I see them.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: AreaCode707
The only reason I could think of that it would not be a good idea is that somebody might notice a person carrying a gun, assume it was legal, and fail to report in an unusual situation, possibly stopping preventative action. However, since that type of prevention has not ever, to my knowledge, happened, it doesn't seem a strenuous objection. Usually the crazies are either caught before they get the weapons to school or they aren't caught til it's too late.

Concealed means concealed. A CCW Permit holder who has his or her weapon visible in states that do not permit open carry is in violation of the law and subject to the loss of his or her license. It's unlikely that a person with a valid CCW Permit would fail to conceal his or her weapon.

But in the scenario that a non-CCW crazy person has a weapon on campus, it is glimpsed by a bystander, the bystander (without a great deal of technical knowledge of requirements for CCW) might assume the weapon is legal and not a danger when in truth it actually is. The argument here is about bystanders growing lax when encountering a nut, not anything actually to do with a CCW holder.

Additionally, the possession of a legal tool is not sufficient reason for something to be reported. A person simply having a firearm is not, in itself alone, grounds for the assumption that the person should be checked out by "authority". One doesn't assume that a person holding a bottle of wine is an alcoholic and one shouldn't assume that a person with a gun is a criminal. There need to be additional reasons (e.g. person appears agitated, person has made previous threats that the reporter knows about, etc) for the situation to warrant reporting to authorities. A guy pumping gas peacefully with a sidearm on his hip has no reason to be reported to big brother.

ZV

Bolded statement true, which actually underscores the debated point. If weapons are banned on campus and somebody sees one, they then have sufficient reason to report it. If weapons are not banned on campus and somebody sees one, they do not have sufficient reason to report it, thereby possibly allowing something dangerous to take place. Again, I don't think this is an especially strong argument, but it is an argument.

Ditto for the italicized statement. You shouldn't assume that the person with a gun is a criminal unless they are holding a gun in a situation in which it is clearly known they should not be. Hence, setting up a situation where it becomes unusual is then a safety factor.

Once again, I think allowing CCW on campus is a good idea. This is just some of the thought process I went through in evaluating the risks as I see them.

That is one of the few arguments that at least has some merit. The answer is quite simple however, encourage people to continue to report ANY weapon sightings. After all, if they're a cpl holder they should be doing better, and a brief interview with an officer can only help them. If they're carrying illegally then you've stopped a potentially serious situation. I've been stopped a few times and questioned, because people see a bulge or what have you. It's no big deal.