Constitutional? Louisiana about to pass law requiring 10 Commandments be displayed in public schools

[sdifox]

Yeah, omnipotent, but can't keep his messengers from diddling kids or just killing the kids off.


This clusterfuck is fairly recent. The last residential school was only closed in 1996. Pope Francis called it a genocide and apologised for it.

Residential Schools in Canada

Residential schools were government-sponsored religious schools that were established to assimilate Indigenous children into Euro-Canadian culture. Although the...

www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca

 

[Ajay]

Yet Paul made it through despite contradicting pretty much everything Jesus ever said.

Would you please provide me with a couple of examples? I’ve studied the gospels and letters of Saint Paul for some time. I can’t recall any contradictions.

 

[Ajay]

Circular arguments are not all that convincing. I have mentioned I lived in Buenos Aires for 7.5 years long ago and attended high school there. Clerical child abuse is a global problem.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/jesuit-sexual-abuse-list-residential-school-1.6781439

Catholic Church sexual abuse cases - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

O, honestly, I thought you should be able to answer your own question. Otherwise, why submit your qualifications?

Thanks for the history lesson on the development of Canada's educational system. I did not know it.

 

[sdifox]

O, honestly, I thought you should be able to answer your own question. Otherwise, why submit your qualifications?

Thanks for the history lesson on the development of Canada's educational system. I did not know it.

answer my own question? I am not the one proclaiming everything is going according to God's Plan.

 

[thilanliyan]

Patently insane. We have myriad methods of proving randomness. If it doesn't exist to your god, free will doesn't either.

Well, apparently we are not all-seeing beings so our intellectual proof of things means nothing.

We maybe needed religion when the only way to explain disease, famine, etc. was the wrath of a "god"...we really should evolve past that and hopefully someday we do. However, it seems it's in human nature to worship something. Unfortunately the worship options these days mostly suck.

 

[brycejones]

scrutiny.

You don’t seem to understand the meaning of this word. It is not synonymous with blind faith which is really what you are articulating.

 

[JD50]

He is, and will continue to. He used the investigative powers of journalists to shame them and uncover their evil deeds. This is an extra dose of humiliating, given the fact that , beyond all reason, the spiritual decedents of the apostles cover up this tragedy. This has happened before in the history of the church. Typically a Saint (someone of an unimpeachable degree of virtue) would correct them and expose their 'nakedness' before God. God does punish his own children if they will not repent of their sins.

Maybe he should have just not allowed it to happen in the first place, I'm sure the kids who were fucked by priests would appreciate that more than uhh.... God using his infinite powers to empower journalists? WTF lol

 

[fskimospy]

Maybe he should have just not allowed it to happen in the first place, I'm sure the kids who were fucked by priests would appreciate that more than uhh.... God using his infinite powers to empower journalists? WTF lol

That's one of my favorites. When I had cancer I had multiple people tell me that God cured me of my disease and my response was always (at least internally) that he could have done me an even bigger solid by not letting me get it in the first place.

You don't get points for putting out a house fire if you're the one that set it on fire to begin with.

 

[Stokely]

The point is not whether God exists, or doesn't. Or how logical or illogical it all is. You have faith, or you don't--no amount of discussion or evidence or anecdotes will bridge that gap. I used to have faith, became agnostic and now am atheist...not sure what's next

I heard the same bullshit when I got treated for cancer and I had a similar response. Not always internal either. I find that especially ridiculous. God helped me score a touchdown! Yeah, what about that cornerback who you beat that now will be out of a job and health insurance? Fucking stupidity. But anyway, I don't care as long as it doesn't get foisted on me.

Religious material doesn't belong in public schools, period. I don't care if people want to believe in deities in private, but then most of the religions dictate you spread them, don't they. It's not enough for religious people to be religious, they have to make sure YOU are too. And why would that be? Well, when it comes to churches the answer is hardly hidden, mo members mean mo money and mo influence into politics and other areas that in a sane world they'd stay the fuck out of.

 

[fskimospy]

The point is not whether God exists, or doesn't.

Religious material doesn't belong in public schools, period. I don't care if people want to believe in deities in private, but then most of the religions dictate you spread them, don't they. It's not enough for religious people to be religious, they have to make sure YOU are too. And why would that be? Well, when it comes to churches the answer is hardly hidden, mo members mean mo money and mo influence into politics and other areas that in a sane world they'd stay the fuck out of.

I agree - the fundamental point here is if public funds and public space should be devoted to evangelizing children about the principles of a particular religion.

The answer is obviously no to any sane person.

 

[Ajay]

Yeah, omnipotent, but can't keep his messengers from diddling kids or just killing them off.


This clusterfuck is fairly recent. The last residential school was only closed in 1996.

Residential Schools in Canada

Residential schools were government-sponsored religious schools that were established to assimilate Indigenous children into Euro-Canadian culture. Although the...

www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca

He could, but He chooses not to. When He gave us free will, He really meant it. He also meant for us to exercise it for the good, and not for evil - even though the consequences can be horrible. Supernatural grace is available to us to avoid or correct such evils - but we do not make good use of it. We are foolish and prideful in thinking the world should be better, even though we ourselves fall short of living genuinely virtuous lives. What do we really expect? We reap what we sow. In a world that, by and large rejects God, we reject God's grace, and then blame him for what are our own selfish acts.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Yea, sure... Ten rules to live by and number one is...

“Thou shalt have no other gods before me.”

LMAO so secular.

Don't take the bait and instead leave the troll to masturbate itself back under its bridge.

The fundies ignore most of the Ten Commandments, because like Greenman, they don't even know what they are.

Thou shall commit tax fraud is like #3, he knows that at least!

 

[sdifox]

He could, but He chooses not to. When He gave us free will, He really meant it. He also meant for us to exercise it for the good, and not for evil - even though the consequences can be horrible. Supernatural grace is available to us to avoid or correct such evils - but we do not make good use of it. We are foolish and prideful in thinking the world should be better, even though we ourselves fall short of living genuinely virtuous lives. What do we really expect? We reap what we sow. In a world that, by and large rejects God, we reject God's grace, and then blame him for what are our own selfish acts.

right...it's the human's fault God created him in His image...Everything good it was due to God, everything bad is human's own damn fault... How convenient.

 

[IronWing]

With gods it always comes down to, why bother? If you want a god, get a cat. Same obligations on your part and the same indifference to your suffering on the cat's part.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Did this thread seriously turn into a catholic trying to claim the Catholic church didn't cover up extensive rape and genocide of children? Like, the Catholic church/Pope even admits that shit. Granted the cabal of Cardinals fucking the guys in their little off Vatican complex weren't too pleased, but I mean, they're paying to fuck, hmm, were they 20 year olds or teenagers? Its hard to keep the rampant sexual misconduct perpetrated by clergyman straight.

 

[pmv]

With gods it always comes down to, why bother? If you want a god, get a cat. Same obligations on your part and the same indifference to your suffering on the cat's part.

An (excellent) idea with ancient roots

How Cats Became Divine Symbols in Ancient Egypt | HISTORY

Felines served a useful purpose in ancient Egyptian households and eventually became divine symbols.

www.history.com

 

[Ajay]

Did this thread seriously turn into a catholic trying to claim the Catholic church didn't cover up extensive rape and genocide of children? Like, the Catholic church/Pope even admits that shit. Granted the cabal of Cardinals fucking the guys in their little off Vatican complex weren't too pleased, but I mean, they're paying to fuck, hmm, were they 20 year olds or teenagers? Its hard to keep the rampant sexual misconduct perpetrated by clergyman straight.

I am not claiming that at all. I am well aware of the some of the clergy's horrific crimes and the coverups by bishops. I expressly stated that in this thread. So, I don’t know were you are getting this notion from. I’ve never denied the sex scandals.

 

[WelshBloke]

He could, but He chooses not to. When He gave us free will, He really meant it. He also meant for us to exercise it for the good, and not for evil - even though the consequences can be horrible. Supernatural grace is available to us to avoid or correct such evils - but we do not make good use of it. We are foolish and prideful in thinking the world should be better, even though we ourselves fall short of living genuinely virtuous lives. What do we really expect? We reap what we sow. In a world that, by and large rejects God, we reject God's grace, and then blame him for what are our own selfish acts.

So god's like some depressed nihilistic teenager who can't be arsed to tidy up the room he messed up?

 

[Stokely]

Did this thread seriously turn into a catholic trying to claim the Catholic church didn't cover up extensive rape and genocide of children? Like, the Catholic church/Pope even admits that shit. Granted the cabal of Cardinals fucking the guys in their little off Vatican complex weren't too pleased, but I mean, they're paying to fuck, hmm, were they 20 year olds or teenagers? Its hard to keep the rampant sexual misconduct perpetrated by clergyman straight.

They finally had to admit it after years of reporting the evidence and a mountain of victims coming forward, but you can take the number they copped to and multiply it by something to get the real numbers.

 

[WelshBloke]

Decades to centuries of scrutiny.

How does that work then?
Like you have two guys that heard voices in their heads a century ago, how do you work out if the voices were god or their brain going wonky?

 

[Ajay]

right...it's the human's fault God created him in His image...Everything good it was due to God, everything bad is human's own damn fault... How convenient.

So, free will sucks? Would you rather not have it? Would you rather have been programmed by God - to essentially become a robot?

 

[pmv]

He could, but He chooses not to. When He gave us free will, He really meant it. He also meant for us to exercise it for the good, and not for evil - even though the consequences can be horrible. Supernatural grace is available to us to avoid or correct such evils - but we do not make good use of it. We are foolish and prideful in thinking the world should be better, even though we ourselves fall short of living genuinely virtuous lives. What do we really expect? We reap what we sow. In a world that, by and large rejects God, we reject God's grace, and then blame him for what are our own selfish acts.

I am sure I'm going to regret taking the bait, as this is the ultimate in futile arguments, arguing over someone's religious faith, but that's the bit that least makes any sense to me about most religions.

Just the sheer arbitrary pointlessness of the whole exercise from God's point-of-view. At least with the "the universe is all a simulation" idea, one can comprehend the possible motivations of the creators - either it's all a game for their amusement, like an Elder Scrolls title (without all the bugs, or at least without most of them), or it's experimental psychology, making bizarre and unpleasant things happen to people in order to study how they react, in order to apply that knowledge in their 'real' world.

But the story above just baffles me - God created us, gave us 'free will', set up an immensely complex set of physical and social circumstances for us to negotiate (each of us starting from seemingly random start points, knowing nothing, and being expected to work out from scratch what the heck is going on and what we are supposed to do, before it's too late), then arbitrarily punishes us for all eternity if we get it 'wrong'. Worst. Game. Ever.

 

[Ajay]

@sdifox Standard retort. In His image means he gave us a soul (spiritual part of our being), which is endowed with a will and an intellect - which are the two ways in which we are most like God (but not equal to Him).

Edit:Quote failed for some reason.

 

[sdifox]

So, free will sucks? Would you rather not have it? Would you rather have been programmed by God - to essentially become a robot?

You would think God would at least keep the church kids safe. Ah yes, the good old God works in mysterious way.

Humans worshipping golden calf, God's reaponse was to wipe them out. Faraoh won't let the Jews leave Egypt? Myriad of plagues, not to mention drowning a whole lot of them. Clergy molesting kids, let the journalists handle it.

 

[WelshBloke]

You would thing God would at least keep the church kids safe. Ah yes, the good old God works in mysterious way.

No! Those kids need to exercise their free will and chose not to be raped or murdered!