Why the fuck would I be involved in a party I hate?@SteveGrabowski I'm going to guess from the lack of response you are not involved in the party. If you want it to change start getting involved at the local level find people who believe as you do.
I think there’s nothing inherent about that the same way there’s nothing inherent about the idea that government run health care leads to communism. These are all choices.
LOL, then just fuck off.Why the fuck would I be involved in a party I hate?
Go fuck yourself too. It's like you're saying if I complain about the Catholics being pedophiles who enable child rape it's durr why don't you join the church.LOL, then just fuck off.
So tired of people bitching about the political system and then refusing to engage in it.
Fucking progressives are so weird.Go fuck yourself too. It's like you're saying if I complain about the Catholics being pedophiles who enable child rape it's durr why don't you join the church.
Real winning strategy here: candidates selling self flagellation by outwardly hating their party as they run to represent them...Why the fuck would I be involved in a party I hate?
As a socialist why would I ever join a liberal party?Real winning strategy here: candidates selling self flagellation by outwardly hating their party as they run to represent them...
In a first past the post system, where realistically only two parties would ever be competitive, why would you ever join or try to improve the side that more closely aligns to what you want? Do you just hate political power? Just want to complain?As a socialist why would I ever join a liberal party?
In a first past the post system, where realistically only two parties would ever be competitive, why would you ever join or try to improve the side that more closely aligns to what you want? Do you just hate political power? Just want to complain?
Remember when you scoffed me for saying inflation was wrecking people and they were pissed and started telling me how great the economy was doing and how awesome Biden was? I'm supposed to change the party that can't even admit they were wrong after yet another crushing defeat to a weak candidate?In a first past the post system, where realistically only two parties would ever be competitive, why would you ever join or try to improve the side that more closely aligns to what you want? Do you just hate political power? Just want to complain?
Nothing like being a doomer because private burrito taxis got expensive.Remember when you scoffed me for saying inflation was wrecking people and they were pissed and started telling me how great the economy was doing and how awesome Biden was? I'm supposed to change the party that can't even admit they were wrong after yet another crushing defeat to a weak candidate?
So what is your plan to implement your preferred agenda?Remember when you scoffed me for saying inflation was wrecking people and they were pissed and started telling me how great the economy was doing and how awesome Biden was? I'm supposed to change the party that can't even admit they were wrong after yet another crushing defeat to a weak candidate?
Well there’s nothing for me to say then. Neoliberalism is a great thing because it acknowledges the uncertainty present in our system where the government is good at some things and bad at others. If another ideology comes along that’s better at addressing this problem I’m all for it but I haven’t seen one yet.I've known plenty of people who would have made the same defence with regard to communism (that there's nothing inherent about it that leads to Stalinism). I've never been convinced by that argument, either. "Actual existing neoliberalism" hasn't gone according to plan, just as "actual existing socialism" didn't.
LOL I'm a doomer because I pointed out the obvious thing that would and did cost the Democrats control and liberals still think it was wrong.Nothing like being a doomer because private burrito taxis got expensive.
Left and right being doomers to defeat the evil Democrats.
Well there’s nothing for me to say then. Neoliberalism is a great thing because it acknowledges the uncertainty present in our system where the government is good at some things and bad at others. If another ideology comes along that’s better at addressing this problem I’m all for it but I haven’t seen one yet.
What is your alternative?
I hear you, and you know I respect you, but if you don’t have a real alternative then it’s hard to have a discussion.I don't have a plan. I grew up around many people who had one - they were all firm believers in revolutionary socialism. It didn't work out. I'm not a believer in that.
I do know that neoliberalism clearly isn't in my interests, or those of almost anyone I know. So I'm never going to support it.
I mean, I'm used to people asking me what's my alternative to democratic socialism or social democracy, it's almost shocking to be asked what's my alternative to Thatcherism, especially after it's become clear that it failed at its intended aims ("a property-owning democracy", yeah, that worked out /s).
I'm guessing many here are fine with neoliberalism because it fits their class-interests as affluent middle-class white technocrats. The problem is it turns out that it doesn't benefit a great many others, hence so many, all over the world, now support the likes of Trump. You need a better plan as this one isn't working out too well.
The best I can come up with is that one has to demand the opposite of what one currently has, so as to try and maintain a kind of unstable equilibrium. Capitalism only behaved itself when it was afraid of the threat of communism. Without that threat the plutocrats have run amok, fighting their top-down class-war (neoliberalism being one of the weapons they employ in that war), and the backlash that has led to, seems to be pushing us towards fascism (some of those plutocrats seem quite happy with that outcome *cough* Musk *cough*, thinking they can live with it - probably mistakenly, as with their predecessors in 1930s Germany).
Thus I guess one should demand socialism, despite not really believing it will work (which makes it a very difficult position to hold, admittedly).
Good luck on your beliefs. Too much money in powerful places for that to ever happen here... peacefully.As a socialist why would I ever join a liberal party?
Pretty much.Good luck on your beliefs. Too much money in powerful places for that to ever happen here... peacefully.
In a first past the post system, where realistically only two parties would ever be competitive, why would you ever join or try to improve the side that more closely aligns to what you want? Do you just hate political power? Just want to complain?
What if I told you that you can disagree without saying "go fuck yourself" to people that agree with you on 90% of things?
I posit that you have no idea whether or not I'm "actually doing anything". What are you doing besides constantly going off on polemics against people here?He's American and partaking in the time honored American tradition of bitching about something you had a role in but acting like you didn't. Kinda like this forum being full of people replying to clownbabies shitting all over you guys and wondering why its so shitty.
Cause when all you're actually doing is jack shit other than replying endlessly to pointless bullshit on a forum, you can go fuck yourself. This forum is full of people like you not actually doing anything but acting like you are. At least they give a shit enough about things to actually give a fuck. Hell, you're the same as Steve, but at least he's fucking honest about it. You might vote but you're not doing jack shit to actually change things. Arguing politely with a jackass that just wants to jackass as Steve is isn't accomplishing anything but wasting your own time. Understand that apathetic assholes like that are just wasting your time because it validates their opinion that politics is pointless worthless shit. Because it is, because even the ones that want to improve it just sit around with their thumbs up their asses instead of even doing the most basic bare minimum. Its worse now because you're doing that while watching assholes wreck things on purpose and then you just go "no, stop, don't" then go back to farting on a forum listening to Steve and even worse right wing dumbfucks and then replying stupidly to all of their posts. What do you think is going to be accomplished by that? Cause it sure as shit isn't gonna change the current course of things, in fact its how we got here.
after all this shit and now we have Trump and people want to double down on the same dishonest bullshit lies that got us here.
Go fuck yourself. You are a part of the problem.
It's worse. He is an adult.You're a fucking child.
When you want to convince other people of liberal values these clowns ruin it.It's worse. He is an adult.
Fully aware of his actions.