Hospital Execs Making Huge Salaries?

[astrosfan90]

I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

 

[Pens1566]

I'd be interested in hearing Sen. Frist's take on this.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

Oh come on. This is by design by the rich Republicans. Get with the program.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

What a backwards system!

With car insurance the price for repairs goes up if you are insured

 

[astrosfan90]

Originally posted by: Pens1566
I'd be interested in hearing Sen. Frist's take on this.

I'm missing something here. Has he been working on legislation relating to this or something?

I guess what just really gets to me is the idea that I can walk in to the ER and get a blood test run for a certain amount (paid by my insurance company+my copay), but someone else, say, my neighbor walks in, without insurance, and might get charged double or triple what I paid, and there's nothing he/she can do about it! That just doesn't seem right for a "charity" hospital to do.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: Pens1566
I'd be interested in hearing Sen. Frist's take on this.

I'm missing something here. Has he been working on legislation relating to this or something?

Are you a Texan???

Frist makes a ton of money off the current corrupt system you suddenly do not like.

 

[astrosfan90]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: Pens1566
I'd be interested in hearing Sen. Frist's take on this.

I'm missing something here. Has he been working on legislation relating to this or something?

Are you a Texan???

Frist makes a ton of money off the current corrupt system you suddenly do not like.

Ahh. I lived in Houston for a few years as a kid, right around the time I was old enough to appreciate baseball. My loyalty to the Houston Astros is about all the Texan legacy I can claim.

It's not that I "suddenly" don't like the system, I just stumbled across some articles from a while back lately that have really made me think about this issue, and it kinda bothers me. I guess it's one thing when we're talking about for-profit groups, but when it's non-profit groups doing it, it just doesn't seem right.

 

[DVK916]

The poor with no insurance don't pay anything.

 

[Boy Hits Car]

If you are poor, you get Medicaid and don't pay. So this is targeting the middle class with no insurance.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: Pens1566
I'd be interested in hearing Sen. Frist's take on this.

I'm missing something here. Has he been working on legislation relating to this or something?

Are you a Texan???

Frist makes a ton of money off the current corrupt system you suddenly do not like.

Ahh. I lived in Houston for a few years as a kid, right around the time I was old enough to appreciate baseball. My loyalty to the Houston Astros is about all the Texan legacy I can claim.

It's not that I "suddenly" don't like the system, I just stumbled across some articles from a while back lately that have really made me think about this issue, and it kinda bothers me. I guess it's one thing when we're talking about for-profit groups, but when it's non-profit groups doing it, it just doesn't seem right.

Well only lesson I have for you here that there is essentially no difference between profit and non-profit Hospitals or Corporations.

Only the manner in which the profit is paid out used to be different but Republicans have changed business laws that there is no longer any difference. Enjoy

 

[BarneyFife]

Thats odd. I thought that insured people were charged way more.

 

[astrosfan90]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: Pens1566
I'd be interested in hearing Sen. Frist's take on this.

I'm missing something here. Has he been working on legislation relating to this or something?

Are you a Texan???

Frist makes a ton of money off the current corrupt system you suddenly do not like.

Ahh. I lived in Houston for a few years as a kid, right around the time I was old enough to appreciate baseball. My loyalty to the Houston Astros is about all the Texan legacy I can claim.

It's not that I "suddenly" don't like the system, I just stumbled across some articles from a while back lately that have really made me think about this issue, and it kinda bothers me. I guess it's one thing when we're talking about for-profit groups, but when it's non-profit groups doing it, it just doesn't seem right.

Well only lesson I have for you here that there is essentially no difference between profit and non-profit Hospitals or Corporations.

Only the manner in which the profit is paid out used to be different but Republicans have changed business laws that there is no longer any difference. Enjoy

I'm not too familiar with the 501(c)(3) tax laws, but if non-501(c)(3) orgs run just the same as the 501(c)(3)'s, why does one pay taxes as a private business and the other does not?

I mean, they're getting tax breaks to be a charitable organization. Why shouldn't they be?

 

[Boy Hits Car]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: Pens1566
I'd be interested in hearing Sen. Frist's take on this.

I'm missing something here. Has he been working on legislation relating to this or something?

Are you a Texan???

Frist makes a ton of money off the current corrupt system you suddenly do not like.

Ahh. I lived in Houston for a few years as a kid, right around the time I was old enough to appreciate baseball. My loyalty to the Houston Astros is about all the Texan legacy I can claim.

It's not that I "suddenly" don't like the system, I just stumbled across some articles from a while back lately that have really made me think about this issue, and it kinda bothers me. I guess it's one thing when we're talking about for-profit groups, but when it's non-profit groups doing it, it just doesn't seem right.

Well only lesson I have for you here that there is essentially no difference between profit and non-profit Hospitals or Corporations.

Only the manner in which the profit is paid out used to be different but Republicans have changed business laws that there is no longer any difference. Enjoy

Does everyone here know that the health care industry is the most regulated industry in the country, right? Regulation, typically, lead to high costs and stagnates competition which drives down costs.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: Boy Hits Car
If you are poor, you get Medicaid and don't pay. So this is targeting the middle class with no insurance.

Actually, if you have Medicaid many private providers will refuse service.

 

[Meuge]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc

Originally posted by: Boy Hits Car
If you are poor, you get Medicaid and don't pay. So this is targeting the middle class with no insurance.

Actually, if you have Medicaid many private providers will refuse service.

Well, they cannot refuse emergency treatment...

 

[TraumaRN]

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

Beyond the fact that they have to pay full price for services rendered can you prove that 2x-3x higher price of care? Unless of course you are referring to the fact that uninsured and poor tend to have more wrong with them because they cant afford a primary care doctor and/or have a perceived lack of access to care?

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: Meuge

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc

Originally posted by: Boy Hits Car
If you are poor, you get Medicaid and don't pay. So this is targeting the middle class with no insurance.

Actually, if you have Medicaid many private providers will refuse service.

Well, they cannot refuse emergency treatment...

I get dinged for this on occasion . . . but . . . I don't consider the ED to be good healthcare. ACLS is great if you are about to croak but once that episode passes . . . you need healthcare . . . by someone that actually practices something other than triage.

 

[astrosfan90]

Originally posted by: DeathBUA

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

Beyond the fact that they have to pay full price for services rendered can you prove that 2x-3x higher price of care? Unless of course you are referring to the fact that uninsured and poor tend to have more wrong with them because they cant afford a primary care doctor and/or have a perceived lack of access to care?

A quick example for you. I can dig up a few more I think given some time, but it's actually pretty common, the more I read on it.

Hospitals accused of price-gouging
Los Angeles: Suit says uninsured charged too much
By PETER PRENGAMAN
Associated Press

LOS ANGELES - Lawyers representing three uninsured Latinos filed a class-action suit Tuesday against Catholic Healthcare West hospitals, alleging price-gouging of patients without health coverage.

The suit claims the San Francisco-based health care provider with 40 hospitals in California, Nevada and Arizona routinely charges uninsured patients up to five times the amount paid by private insurers and government programs for the same services.

The suit seeks to force Catholic Healthcare West to reform billing practices in the three states and reimburse the three Latino plaintiffs -- a woman immigrant from El Salvador and two Mexican-Americans.

''What's fair about paying three to five times more?'' lawyer Archie Lamb said at a news conference. ''The working poor are being run into bankruptcy by this payment system.''

Catholic Healthcare West issued a statement saying it ''was proud of our record of serving those in need, regardless of their ability to pay.''

The nonprofit medical group last year provided $623 million in charity care and community benefits for the poor and uninsured, according to the statement.

Jan Emerson, spokeswoman for the California Hospital Association, said the lawsuit was unfounded.

''The allegation of price-gouging is absurd,'' she said. ''The uninsured on average only pay 4 percent of their hospital bill.''

Emerson said California hospitals lost $6.5 billion by providing care to uninsured and underinsured patients in 2004.

Emerson acknowledged that private insurers and government insurance programs negotiate lower rates for large groups of people that are unavailable to the uninsured.

She pointed out, however, that Catholic Healthcare West was among the hospital groups that agreed to offer discounts to uninsured families who don't qualify for government programs.

Mirna Estupinian, a 35-year-old mother of two from El Salvador living in Los Angeles, told reporters Tuesday that in June an ambulance took her to a Healthcare West hospital for treatment of severe abdominal pain.

She stayed at the hospital two days, had X-rays and was diagnosed with gastritis. A few weeks later, she said, she received a bill for $20,296. Her husband's job as a truck driver didn't provide health insurance.

''The stress of owing $20,000 was enormous,'' she said, wiping back tears. ''I had to take a loan to pay it, and now we are selling my house in El Salvador to pay it back.''

Estupinian's account could not be verified, as hospital officials said privacy laws prevented them from talking about individual patients.

Lamb said the hospital would only have charged a private insurance plan $5,600 for the same service, and even less for federal health programs like Medicare.

Hospital officials could not immediately provide details on different billing costs for the procedures.

 

[TraumaRN]

So we're got one example and we dont know all the services provided to her besides the x-ray's, bed, she could have had other procedures obiviously, but the price does seem high.

I will say there are shady practices that some hospitals use and being in nursing school i've seen my fair share of good hospitals and bad. I tend to believe I work in a good hospital, almost all the patients we see are uninsured because we're an inner city trauma hospital first and foremost. And we're not Catholic. Heck last night at work we admitted a homeless man with hypertension and mental issues just to give him 3 squares a day, a bath and a warm bed for a few days.

However your point about executive salaries is warrented.

 

[MonkeyK]

Originally posted by: DeathBUA

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

Beyond the fact that they have to pay full price for services rendered can you prove that 2x-3x higher price of care? Unless of course you are referring to the fact that uninsured and poor tend to have more wrong with them because they cant afford a primary care doctor and/or have a perceived lack of access to care?

You must be very healthy or very young. Look for an Explanation of Benefits sent to your parents by their health insurance company. You will see a column for "Billed" and a column for "Negotiated". I frequently see the billed amount as twice negotiated amount and have seen it as high as 4x. This is per service performed.

 

[zephyrprime]

Originally posted by: DeathBUA
Beyond the fact that they have to pay full price for services rendered can you prove that 2x-3x higher price of care? Unless of course you are referring to the fact that uninsured and poor tend to have more wrong with them because they cant afford a primary care doctor and/or have a perceived lack of access to care?

Haven't you ever seen a medical bill? If you have insurance that a medical provider agrees to accept, the medical provider will charge a certain amount for a certain service (this price is analagous to a MSRP in the world of retail) and then when the insurance company gets the bill, they will unilaterally decide what they will pay based upon some schedule that they have worked out. The amount they agree to pay for a particular service is often less than the amount the medical provider charges. Then, some parts of the bill may or may not be forwarded to the patient to collect the remainder. If you have no insurance, you get charged MSRP for everything and no insurance "discount".

 

[astrosfan90]

Originally posted by: MonkeyK

Originally posted by: DeathBUA

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

Beyond the fact that they have to pay full price for services rendered can you prove that 2x-3x higher price of care? Unless of course you are referring to the fact that uninsured and poor tend to have more wrong with them because they cant afford a primary care doctor and/or have a perceived lack of access to care?

You must be very healthy or very young. Look for an Explanation of Benefits sent to your parents by their health insurance company. You will see a column for "Billed" and a column for "Negotiated". I frequently see the billed amount as twice negotiated amount and have seen it as high as 4x. This is per service performed.

Sorry I lost track of this thread.

I get the negotiated vs. billed, I just don't understand why we have charity organizations operating like this. If you're a Catholic hospital founded on a mission of charity, why should you be wheeling and dealing with your patients? Doesn't sound too charitable.

 

[Snoop]

This also goes on within Dentistry. From my research you pay on average ~40%-50% markup on medical procedures without insurance. Some doctors will cut you a break but most will not as it just provides extra cash for them. Its a horribly messed up industry.

 

[MonkeyK]

Originally posted by: astrosfan90

Originally posted by: MonkeyK

Originally posted by: DeathBUA

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

Beyond the fact that they have to pay full price for services rendered can you prove that 2x-3x higher price of care? Unless of course you are referring to the fact that uninsured and poor tend to have more wrong with them because they cant afford a primary care doctor and/or have a perceived lack of access to care?

You must be very healthy or very young. Look for an Explanation of Benefits sent to your parents by their health insurance company. You will see a column for "Billed" and a column for "Negotiated". I frequently see the billed amount as twice negotiated amount and have seen it as high as 4x. This is per service performed.

Sorry I lost track of this thread.

I get the negotiated vs. billed, I just don't understand why we have charity organizations operating like this. If you're a Catholic hospital founded on a mission of charity, why should you be wheeling and dealing with your patients? Doesn't sound too charitable.

My response was to DeathBUA wanting proof that uninsured are billed so much more than insured patients.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: astrosfan90
I've been mulling this over, and it really bugs me. I've heard time and time again about people getting charged 2x or 3x the price for medical care if they are uninsured (as compared to what an insurance company pays), and it bothers me. What bothers me even more though is the fact that while the middle class folks who can't afford medical coverage pay these insane prices, the executives of these NON-PROFIT hospitals are making seven-figure salaries.

I'm not at all surprised. A great many self-proclaimed "non-profit" businesses and charities are really "non-profit" only in name and for tax purposes. In the meantime, the people running it profit tremendously in the form of high salaries, awesome benefits, company cars, paid vacations to fancy resorts for "seminars" and conferences, etc.