How do democracies die?

[cytg111]

First they wither.
Then they die.

In the case of Poland, Hungary and Turkey.

Democracy Under Pressure: The Case of Poland, Hungary and Turkey

..

www.omicsonline.org

"In Poland, the party law and justice (PiS), which was successful in the parliamentary elections of October 2015, has set itself the goal of transforming the country’s politics, economy, culture and society according to its national conservative worldview."

"After the Socialists had won the elections in 2002 and 2006, the national conservative Fidesz party of Viktor Orbán succeeded in winning a two-thirds majority."

And Erdogan's AKP is a "democratic conservative" construction.

So what is the take-away here? Besides Authoritarianism?

Conservatism.

The US just had a near miss tango with Authoritarian concepts. And what was the vehicle? Yes. Conservatism.
Someone on here, forgot who and where, joked that if the the GOP cant win a fair election they would opt for dictatorship without thinking twice.

The future has a liberal bias, so the point I am getting at is that, as we progress towards a better tomorrow, there be Talibanian forces in societies, small and large, that will be content with destroying democracies, content with minority rule, if the rulers be them.

Is conservatism in context of modern technology a disease on democracy?

 

[Linux23]

Just put Trump in charge.

 

[jameny5]

He didn't even have to press the "That Was Easy" button. Came straight for the jugular! He

Sent from my Lenovo TB-X606F using Tapatalk

 

[nickqt]

...
The US just had a near miss tango with Authoritarian concepts. And what was the vehicle? Yes. Conservatism.
Someone on here, forgot who and where, joked that if the the GOP cant win a fair election they would opt for dictatorship without thinking twice.
...

It wasn't a liberal who said that. It was David Frum. A conservative.

If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. The will reject democracy.” ― David Frum

David Frum was a conservative who helped get George W. Bush elected President.

And he wasn't joking.

 

[brandonbull]

Democracies die when the government controls the media, speech, thoughts, personal income, and attacks political enemies. Or just let the Progressives have control of the government.

 

[brandonbull]

It wasn't a liberal who said that. It was David Frum. A conservative.

If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. The will reject democracy.” ― David Frum

David Frum was a conservative who helped get George W. Bush elected President.

And he wasn't joking.

Anyone that feels the government no longer represents them, will reject that government. Look what the Democrats did the last 4 years. It's a common sense statement that people think contains some epiphany on human behavior. Why do you think the colonies split from England? Because enough people felt they weren't getting a fair shake in life. The quote is an attempt to label the non Progressheviks as some sort of authoritarians that wish to rid themselves of democracy because their guys didn't win. People are sore losers and, if you lose enough or think the game is rigged, you go play another game.

 

[zinfamous]

Democracies die when the government controls the media, speech, thoughts, personal income, and attacks political enemies.

yes.

so why the fuck do you keep voting for that, you ignorant clown-fucker?

 

[dawp]

Democracies die when the government controls the media, speech, thoughts, personal income, and attacks political enemies. Or just let the Progressives have control of the government.

perfect description of trump.

 

[mikeymikec]

To thunderous applause?

 

[cytg111]

It wasn't a liberal who said that. It was David Frum. A conservative.

If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. The will reject democracy.” ― David Frum

David Frum was a conservative who helped get George W. Bush elected President.

And he wasn't joking.

That was it! And its not just a funny thought of the day kind of thing, its backed up by evidence. Conservatives with a populist agenda is a fucking disease on democracies everywhere.

 

[Jaskalas]

How do democracies die?

When you lose consent of a majority of voters and they shut down cooperation, checks and balances, and opt for tyranny. The majority can always hit the delete button on a form of government, of law and order, of peace and stability.

 

[ivwshane]

Democracies die when the government controls the media, speech, thoughts, personal income, and attacks political enemies. Or just let the Progressives have control of the government.

Hey traitor, welcome back.

Did you have the covid or were you too busy storming the capital trying to overthrow our democracy?

I suggest you take a real hard look at who you think the enemy is because it isn't the people who keep winning the popular vote and who represent the majority of the people.

 

[cytg111]

When you lose consent of a majority of voters and they shut down cooperation, checks and balances, and opt for tyranny. The majority can always hit the delete button on a form of government, of law and order, of peace and stability.

Wrong. Did 100% of Trump voters vote to end up democracy? No. Of course not. That is why populism is the catalyst, these sociopaths will lie and scheme their way to power and once there break down the structures, rule of law, to ensure them rule forever.

 

[Vic]

Democracies die when the government controls the media, speech, thoughts, personal income, and attacks political enemies. Or just let the Progressives have control of the government.

When was the last time we saw a progressive US govt official lead a crowd in a chant to lock up a political enemy? Or tweet that Americans that didn't support him were human scum? Or call the media the enemy of the people and threaten to yank broadcasting licenses of media that wasn't perpetually favorable towards him?
Can you describe a time when a progressive in control of govt did any of those things?

Anyone that feels the government no longer represents them, will reject that government. Look what the Democrats did the last 4 years. It's a common sense statement that people think contains some epiphany on human behavior. Why do you think the colonies split from England? Because enough people felt they weren't getting a fair shake in life. The quote is an attempt to label the non Progressheviks as some sort of authoritarians that wish to rid themselves of democracy because their guys didn't win. People are sore losers and, if you lose enough or think the game is rigged, you go play another game.

Which is why you label 'Progressheviks' as authoritarians as you storm the Capitol in violent insurrection because your guy didn't win.

Serious question: is there a reason why you're always accusing Democrats for whatever the Republicans are doing? Are you just trolling for attention, or are you a liar, or are you just that clueless?

 

[theeedude]

One man, one vote, one time.

 

[cytg111]

When was the last time we saw a progressive US govt official lead a crowd in a chant to lock up a political enemy?

Socialists and communists at the gate !!!!

 

[nickqt]

Anyone that feels the government no longer represents them, will reject that government. Look what the Democrats did the last 4 years. It's a common sense statement that people think contains some epiphany on human behavior. Why do you think the colonies split from England? Because enough people felt they weren't getting a fair shake in life. The quote is an attempt to label the non Progressheviks as some sort of authoritarians that wish to rid themselves of democracy because their guys didn't win. People are sore losers and, if you lose enough or think the game is rigged, you go play another game.

Yes, you're right.

David Frum: Arch Progressive

 

[bshole]

It wasn't a liberal who said that. It was David Frum. A conservative.

If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. The will reject democracy.” ― David Frum

David Frum was a conservative who helped get George W. Bush elected President.

And he wasn't joking.

I would say it is when corporations own the means of communication and begin silencing the voices of opposition. The boiling of the frog on right wing voices has expanded quite dramatically to left wing voices. The overton window is shrinking down to only what conforms to the narrative of the billionaires who control the entire world's communication systems.

Glenn left the company he cofounded because they refused to publish a factually accurate article he created because the paper thought the article would harm their preferred political candidate.

Facebook's Ban on Far-Left Pages Is an Extension of Trump Propaganda

Facebook announced a sweep to ban some user groups — and it equated violent white supremacist militias with antiracist organizing.

theintercept.com

One of the most interesting factoids I ran across lately was with regards to the New York Times. The month after Occupy Wallstreet ended, the New York Times dramatically moved the attention away from the monied class onto racism (500 mentions to 2500 mentions in the space of a few years) and has been ramping that narrative ever since. Why would that be? In the eight years since that event, wealth inequality has gotten only worse.



Trust in media has fallen to 55% among Democrats and 8% among Republicans. I don't believe it is above 10% for the zoomers. What is going on now is an attempt by the elites to force a narrative onto the people. That can only be accomplished by force. Currently there are dozens of narratives and a general rejection of the narrative of the elites (accepted by only 25-30% of population). Why is it so important to the elite that we accept their narrative and that all other narratives be censored?

PS. I believe in my last post here I predicted Biden would win. I also predicted Biden would start one or two major wars in the Middle East. I anticipate talk of "freedom fighters" to crop up in the next 12 months or so. I tried to talk my relatives out of re-enlisting for this reason (they didn't listen). Lets see if my bold prediction comes true. If it doesn't, that will prove that I don't have a very good grasp on the desires of the elite. If it does, it will prove that the elites are the most predictable people on earth.

 

[Indus]

yes.

so why the fuck do you keep voting for that, you ignorant clown-fucker?

He's a low info, believe everything facebook tells him bleach drinking Trumpanzee. You know this.. so why ask a rhetorical question you already know the answer to?

 

[Vic]

I would say it is when corporations own the means of communication and begin silencing the voices of opposition. The boiling of the frog on right wing voices has expanded quite dramatically to left wing voices. The overton window is shrinking down to only what conforms to the narrative of the billionaires who control the entire world's communication systems.

Glenn left the company he cofounded because they refused to publish a factually accurate article he created because the paper thought the article would harm their preferred political candidate.
View attachment 38546
View attachment 38548

Facebook's Ban on Far-Left Pages Is an Extension of Trump Propaganda

Facebook announced a sweep to ban some user groups — and it equated violent white supremacist militias with antiracist organizing.

theintercept.com

One of the most interesting factoids I ran across lately was with regards to the New York Times. The month after Occupy Wallstreet ended, the New York Times dramatically moved the attention away from the monied class onto racism (500 mentions to 2500 mentions in the space of a few years) and has been ramping that narrative ever since. Why would that be? In the eight years since that event, wealth inequality has gotten only worse.
View attachment 38547


Trust in media has fallen to 55% among Democrats and 8% among Republicans. I don't believe it is above 10% for the zoomers. What is going on now is an attempt by the elites to force a narrative onto the people. That can only be accomplished by force. Currently there are dozens of narratives and a general rejection of the narrative of the elites (accepted by only 25-30% of population). Why is it so important to the elite that we accept their narrative and that all other narratives be censored?

PS. I believe in my last post here I predicted Biden would win. I also predicted Biden would start one or two major wars in the Middle East. I anticipate talk of "freedom fighters" to crop up in the next 12 months or so. I tried to talk my relatives out of re-enlisting for this reason (they didn't listen). Lets see if my bold prediction comes true. If it doesn't, that will prove that I don't have a very good grasp on the desires of the elite. If it does, it will prove that the elites are the most predictable people on earth.

Imagine actually believing that high-ranking govt officials, with all the publishing power of the federal govt at their disposal, could actually be censored by private media.
Or that the reason that right-wing extremists were banned off some private platforms was because they're "conservatives," and not because they used those platforms to plot violent insurrection against the Constitution in order to overturn an election they lost.

 

[brycejones]

I would say it is when corporations own the means of communication

You have never in the entire history of the United States had the right to force anyone to distribute your speech.

 

[nickqt]

I would say it is when corporations own the means of communication and begin silencing the voices of opposition. The boiling of the frog on right wing voices has expanded quite dramatically to left wing voices. The overton window is shrinking down to only what conforms to the narrative of the billionaires who control the entire world's communication systems.

Glenn left the company he cofounded because they refused to publish a factually accurate article he created because the paper thought the article would harm their preferred political candidate.
View attachment 38546
View attachment 38548

Facebook's Ban on Far-Left Pages Is an Extension of Trump Propaganda

Facebook announced a sweep to ban some user groups — and it equated violent white supremacist militias with antiracist organizing.

theintercept.com

One of the most interesting factoids I ran across lately was with regards to the New York Times. The month after Occupy Wallstreet ended, the New York Times dramatically moved the attention away from the monied class onto racism (500 mentions to 2500 mentions in the space of a few years) and has been ramping that narrative ever since. Why would that be? In the eight years since that event, wealth inequality has gotten only worse.
View attachment 38547


Trust in media has fallen to 55% among Democrats and 8% among Republicans. I don't believe it is above 10% for the zoomers. What is going on now is an attempt by the elites to force a narrative onto the people. That can only be accomplished by force. Currently there are dozens of narratives and a general rejection of the narrative of the elites (accepted by only 25-30% of population). Why is it so important to the elite that we accept their narrative and that all other narratives be censored?

PS. I believe in my last post here I predicted Biden would win. I also predicted Biden would start one or two major wars in the Middle East. I anticipate talk of "freedom fighters" to crop up in the next 12 months or so. I tried to talk my relatives out of re-enlisting for this reason (they didn't listen). Lets see if my bold prediction comes true. If it doesn't, that will prove that I don't have a very good grasp on the desires of the elite. If it does, it will prove that the elites are the most predictable people on earth.

The oligarchs who own and operate everything do not want a class war, because they would either win and prevail over a smoldering pit, or lose, remain absurdly wealthy, but not as wealthy or powerful.

With you I can agree.

That said, my response was just that it was a CONSERVATIVE who said that CONSERVATIVES would abandon democracy for autocracy if they started to lose the ability to win fair elections.