Hybrid Trucks

[krunchykrome]

Hybrid passenger cars, and hybrid SUV's; automakers continue to develop and build them. When will we start to see hybrid pickup trucks? Are there any being developed?

If not, is it because a hybrid truck is just not feasible for the everyday demands that a work-truck is used for? In other words, can a hyrbrid engine handle the demands of a heavy-duty truck's payload?

 

[Ktulu]

Yes, they're developing Full Hybrid Silverado's and Sierra's as we speak. Also, the Tahoe/Yukon/Escalade hybrids are technically truck hybrids. There's a video on youtube of a Tahoe hybrid towing and not struggling one bit, so that should give you some reference as to how a hybrid work truck would do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...dWIb6s&feature=related

 

[shekondar]

I heard on the news this morning that Peterbilt is introducing hybrid tractor-trailers - they're claiming mileage will increase to around 10-11 MPG (currently 3-5 MPG). And, nearly all locomotives are diesel-electric now, so I don't think it's an issue of a hybrid drivetrain not being able to handle the payload. Hybrids are probably better suited for these heavy-duty applications - the added weight of the hybrid drivetrain is less of an impact, where on a light-duty pickup truck you would lose more payload capacity.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: shekondar
I heard on the news this morning that Peterbilt is introducing hybrid tractor-trailers - they're claiming mileage will increase to around 10-11 MPG (currently 3-5 MPG). And, nearly all locomotives are diesel-electric now, so I don't think it's an issue of a hybrid drivetrain not being able to handle the payload. Hybrids are probably better suited for these heavy-duty applications - the added weight of the hybrid drivetrain is less of an impact, where on a light-duty pickup truck you would lose more payload capacity.

Locomotives aren't hybrids, though they are diesel electric. The diesel engines in a locomotive are not connected to the wheels in any way at all, they are merely generators to power the electric motors in the train's driveline. This is done because the torque characteristics of electric motors are far superior to diesel or gasoline engines for the type of work that a locomotive does.

ZV

 

[Savij]

Originally posted by: Ktulu
Yes, they're developing Full Hybrid Silverado's and Sierra's as we speak. Also, the Tahoe/Yukon/Escalade hybrids are technically truck hybrids. There's a video on youtube of a Tahoe hybrid towing and not struggling one bit, so that should give you some reference as to how a hybrid work truck would do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...dWIb6s&feature=related

They're still under development? I drove one at a GM event a few years ago and it seemed pretty ready for production to me. I wonder what happened.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: Savij

Originally posted by: Ktulu
Yes, they're developing Full Hybrid Silverado's and Sierra's as we speak. Also, the Tahoe/Yukon/Escalade hybrids are technically truck hybrids. There's a video on youtube of a Tahoe hybrid towing and not struggling one bit, so that should give you some reference as to how a hybrid work truck would do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...dWIb6s&feature=related

They're still under development? I drove one at a GM event a few years ago and it seemed pretty ready for production to me. I wonder what happened.

I'm sure they're just wrapping things up to make sure they get it right the first time. BTW, they should be available this Fall, can't wait.

 

[GoatMonkey]

Electric motors make very good torque. I don't see why it would be a problem.

 

[shekondar]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: shekondar
I heard on the news this morning that Peterbilt is introducing hybrid tractor-trailers - they're claiming mileage will increase to around 10-11 MPG (currently 3-5 MPG). And, nearly all locomotives are diesel-electric now, so I don't think it's an issue of a hybrid drivetrain not being able to handle the payload. Hybrids are probably better suited for these heavy-duty applications - the added weight of the hybrid drivetrain is less of an impact, where on a light-duty pickup truck you would lose more payload capacity.

Locomotives aren't hybrids, though they are diesel electric. The diesel engines in a locomotive are not connected to the wheels in any way at all, they are merely generators to power the electric motors in the train's driveline. This is done because the torque characteristics of electric motors are far superior to diesel or gasoline engines for the type of work that a locomotive does.

ZV

True, they are a series hybrid arrangement, instead of a parallel hybrid.

 

[CptCrunch]

I remember driving a hybrid silverado at a GM drive event in Chicago a few years back. It worked without any issues and I couldn't even tell it was a hybrid until I was pulling out of the track and the engine quit. It seemed fine them, dont know why they're not out yet.

 

[Horsepower]

Originally posted by: CptCrunch
I remember driving a hybrid silverado at a GM drive event in Chicago a few years back. It worked without any issues and I couldn't even tell it was a hybrid until I was pulling out of the track and the engine quit. It seemed fine them, dont know why they're not out yet.

I was at a similar event in LA. They absolutely were ready then. I also drove a couple of hydrogen vehicles. Can you say "oil company lobbyists"

 

[CptCrunch]

Originally posted by: Horsepower

Originally posted by: CptCrunch
I remember driving a hybrid silverado at a GM drive event in Chicago a few years back. It worked without any issues and I couldn't even tell it was a hybrid until I was pulling out of the track and the engine quit. It seemed fine them, dont know why they're not out yet.

I was at a similar event in LA. They absolutely were ready then. I also drove a couple of hydrogen vehicles. Can you say "oil company lobbyists"

Absolutely. They didn't have any hydrogen vehicles at my chicago event, what cars did they have, and did you notice any issues power/feel wise versus its gasoline counterpart?

 

[LTC8K6]

Those early Silverado mild hybrids were available from 2004-2007. They were not the hybrids you are thinking of in terms of fuel economy. Those early hybrids only had the starter and alternator replaced by an electric motor/generator and they had the engine cut off feature. IIRC, the eletric motor didn't even contribute to moving the vehicle.

The new 2009 hybrid is a different animal altogether, iirc. It will be a full dual mode hybrid vehicle.

So, nobody kept anything from you that would have saved you fuel.

 

[LTC8K6]

Those 2004-2007 Silverado hybrids:

Hybrid of a different color

The Hybrid option available now in GM's full-size pickups is a little different. Actually, the system, which GM has wisely been terming a "mild" hybrid system, doesn't boast hybridized propulsion at all. The electric system doesn't help the gas engine in acceleration, either. So why is it called a hybrid? Well, the much-stronger-than-usual electrical system handles the load of the accessories, allowing the engine to be safely turned off at stoplights, to save gas, and restarted quickly when they turn green. The model it's offered on still has the same 295-hp, 5.3-liter V-8, same four-speed automatic, and very similar performance.

The key component of this system is a starter/generator unit that's mounted between the engine and transmission. The starter/generator is permanently engaged and moves with the engine crankshaft. For the generator function, the system's rotor is attached directly to the engine crankshaft. When coasting or decelerating, the system goes into generation mode and charges the battery pack. If slowing to a stop, the engine will turn off completely at 13 mph or less, depending on the conditions, and the upgraded electrical system will take over vehicle functions. Simply lift off the brake and - presto - the starter/generator system quickly starts the engine, you apply the gas pedal, and off you go with normal V-8 gusto.

This more powerful 42-volt electrical system uses three large "deep cycle" lead-acid batteries stored together under the back seat. The battery pack is connected to the starter/generator unit, and it also provides power for the steering and braking systems.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: shekondar
I heard on the news this morning that Peterbilt is introducing hybrid tractor-trailers - they're claiming mileage will increase to around 10-11 MPG (currently 3-5 MPG). And, nearly all locomotives are diesel-electric now, so I don't think it's an issue of a hybrid drivetrain not being able to handle the payload. Hybrids are probably better suited for these heavy-duty applications - the added weight of the hybrid drivetrain is less of an impact, where on a light-duty pickup truck you would lose more payload capacity.

Locomotives aren't hybrids, though they are diesel electric. The diesel engines in a locomotive are not connected to the wheels in any way at all, they are merely generators to power the electric motors in the train's driveline. This is done because the torque characteristics of electric motors are far superior to diesel or gasoline engines for the type of work that a locomotive does.

ZV

I think he was referring to the fact that electric motors can handle a heavy load easily enough. I've thought that given the high torque of electric motors that you could equip one near the axle of a truck and use it for low speeds and taking off, as well as giving an optional switch to store power to assist with hills. (ie: charge the batteries to full in the preceding few miles and drain them near empty in the next few) The difficulty I see is that diesels really really like to idle rather than being shut down.

 

[Horsepower]

One hydrogen vehicle was like a 4 seat sports car with a joystick style control pod that you could switch between front seat passengers. It was quick, but like doing a game on a pc, I had to learn to drive all over. The chassis was self contained, so you could put any body style on it. They called the chassis a "skateboard" The other was a European non GM mini van configured like a regular vehicle but gutless.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: Ktulu
Yes, they're developing Full Hybrid Silverado's and Sierra's as we speak. Also, the Tahoe/Yukon/Escalade hybrids are technically truck hybrids. There's a video on youtube of a Tahoe hybrid towing and not struggling one bit, so that should give you some reference as to how a hybrid work truck would do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...dWIb6s&feature=related

Considering they have monstrous V8 engines with more than enough power regardless of hybrid assist, I'm not surprised they have no trouble towing. The harder part for GM was probably figuring out how to program the computer so that it didn't react to the towing load by trying to push hybrid assist all the time until the battery ran out in 5 minutes. It must have a way to sense when it is towing and use a different algorithm for boost/regen.

 

[Throckmorton]

Screw hybrid trucks. I want a hybrid Wrangler. Electric would be incredible on the trail.

 

[finite automaton]

Um, hybrid silverados exist already...

 

[Throckmorton]

Originally posted by: finite automaton
Um, hybrid silverados exist already...

It's not a real hybrid though. The electrical system only powers accessories

 

[potato28]

Originally posted by: GoatMonkey
Electric motors make very good torque. I don't see why it would be a problem.

Probably the problem with all of the torque destroying the transmissions in a short amount of time, a la The Tesla Roadster.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Originally posted by: potato28

Originally posted by: GoatMonkey
Electric motors make very good torque. I don't see why it would be a problem.

Probably the problem with all of the torque destroying the transmissions in a short amount of time, a la The Tesla Roadster.

That would be LESS likely in a truck given that weight isn't much of an issue, and they're already pushing 600+LBft diesels in 3/4 ton trucks and 2000 in the class A's.