Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.



Comparison of upcoming Intel's U-series CPU: Core Ultra 100U, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

Model	Code-Name	Date	TDP	Node	Tiles	Main Tile	CPU	LP E-Core	LLC	GPU	Xe-cores
Core Ultra 100U	Meteor Lake	Q4 2023	15 - 57 W	Intel 4 + N5 + N6	4	tCPU	2P + 8E	2	12 MB	Intel Graphics	4
?	Lunar Lake	Q4 2024	17 - 30 W	N3B + N6	2	CPU + GPU & IMC	4P + 4E	0	8 MB	Arc	8
?	Panther Lake	Q1 2026 ?	?	Intel 18A + N3E	3	CPU + MC	4P + 8E	4	?	Arc	12

Comparison of die size of Each Tile of Meteor Lake, Arrow Lake, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

	Meteor Lake	Arrow Lake (20A)	Arrow Lake (N3B)	Arrow Lake Refresh (N3B)	Lunar Lake	Panther Lake
Platform	Mobile H/U Only	Desktop Only	Desktop & Mobile H&HX	Desktop Only	Mobile U Only	Mobile H
Process Node	Intel 4	Intel 20A	TSMC N3B	TSMC N3B	TSMC N3B	Intel 18A
Date	Q4 2023	Q1 2025 ?	Desktop-Q4-2024 H&HX-Q1-2025	Q4 2025 ?	Q4 2024	Q1 2026 ?
Full Die	6P + 8P	6P + 8E ?	8P + 16E	8P + 32E	4P + 4E	4P + 8E
LLC	24 MB	24 MB ?	36 MB ?	?	8 MB	?
tCPU	66.48
tGPU	44.45
SoC	96.77
IOE	44.45
Total	252.15

Intel Core Ultra 100 - Meteor Lake



As mentioned by Tomshardware, TSMC will manufacture the I/O, SoC, and GPU tiles. That means Intel will manufacture only the CPU and Foveros tiles. (Notably, Intel calls the I/O tile an 'I/O Expander,' hence the IOE moniker.)

 

[jpiniero]

Ice Lake didn't even have 4 GHz turbo if I'm not mistaken.

That may have been a design flaw that Intel didn't bother fixing.

 

[SiliconFly]

Those are all gaming or beefy laptops. I hope this is facetious about how piss poor AMD is on mobile laptops 15-35W that the average person might want to use lol. It’s still atrocious honestly especially in the US.

I think those beefy laptops are were the real margins are.

 

[SpudLobby]

I think those beefy laptops are were the real margins are.

For AMD, yep. Sucks but whatever

 

[FlameTail]

Intel 1st Gen Core Ultra 7 185H ~30% Faster than the 13th Gen 13700H, Twice as Power Efficient

Fresh benchmarks of Intel’s upcoming Meteor Lake processors, also known as the 1st Gen Core Ultra family, have leaked out. The Cinebench R20 scores of the Core Ultra 7 185H indicate a focus on multi-threaded performance with largely unchanged single-threaded capabilities. It’s worth noting that...

www.hardwaretimes.com

Twice as power efficient?

 

[SiliconFly]

Twice as power efficient?

It's very much possible under everyday use conditions. Most of the people around the world typically use only browsers or some simple business apps most of the time. And the new MTL design can make a major difference in these cases.

(The cpu & gpu tile will be in a powered down state most of the time with only the LP E cores active.)

 

[Geddagod]

I think those beefy laptops are were the real margins are.

Don't think so. The thin and light laptops are the ones that are getting sold as "premium products" with high prices. And for good reason too, a lot of engineering prob goes into designing laptops that are as small as possible, while also performing well and staying cool.
The only beefy laptops that are being sold as premium products are desktop replacement level laptops, with the highest tier components. The rest of the regular gaming laptops aren't seen that way.

 

[trivik12]

If we suddenly care what MLID says... let's quote him.


Personally I would be far more interested in the absolute attributes of MTL rather than relative positioning versus AMD's product stack. Let's see the massive improvement in battery life, the strong MT improvement due to higher base clocks, let's see the GPU come to life with Intel's mature driver stack, let's see it come together as a well rounded tiled design to justify the price premium. After that we can start looking around for any challenger.

It does not matter when Hawk Point "launches". Question is how fast OEMs launch and how is the general availability. I am skeptical when it comes to latest gen AMD laptops. Its almost impossible to find them. Especially in store.

 

[coercitiv]

It does not matter when Hawk Point "launches".

I'm glad we agree.

 

[SiliconFly]

It does not matter when Hawk Point "launches". Question is how fast OEMs launch and how is the general availability. I am skeptical when it comes to latest gen AMD laptops. Its almost impossible to find them. Especially in store.

Actually, the last couple of years, I've seen more AMD laptops than before. The availability has improved a lot. Even though they have a long way to go, I think they're in a far better position now to compete with Intel in the mobile space. The competition is heating up. Not to be dismissed lightly. I think they're doing fine.

 

[igor_kavinski]

What is the possibility of Intel introducing a Core Ultra 9X Arrow Lake CPU with 256MB HBM3e on-package L4 cache? Would it be profitable for them at the $699 price point?

 

[Mopetar]

What is the possibility of Intel introducing a Core Ultra 9X Arrow Lake CPU with 256MB HBM3e on-package L4 cache? Would it be profitable for them at the $699 price point?

Are you high or are you just trying to baitpost to see if MLID picks this up and talks about sources mentioning a new "high-power" Intel CPU utilizing HBM?

 

[FlameTail]

Are you high or are you just trying to baitpost to see if MLID picks this up and talks about sources mentioning a new "high-power" Intel CPU utilizing HBM?

MLID is on this forum?

 

[igor_kavinski]

Are you high or are you just trying to baitpost to see if MLID picks this up and talks about sources mentioning a new "high-power" Intel CPU utilizing HBM?

The thought occurred to me coz Intel is shipping server CPUs with HBM RAM in gigabytes! Surely, they could put a teensy weensy 256MB HBM cache on a chip and be in a position to beat AMD?

 

[FlameTail]

*Exclusive leak*

Fellow forum members, I have obtained exclusive information that Intel's next generation Arc Broadwell GPUs will use HBM3e memory. With upto 69 GB of capacity and more than 2.9 TB/s bandwidth, the next gen Arc GPUs will obliterate the competition. My second source reports that Nvidia has gotten wind of these going-ons within Intel's GPU division, and reports to me that Nvidia is working on an RTX 5090 Ultra with 128 GB of HBM3N (custom Nvidia) memory with bandwidth exceeding 2.99 TB/s.

/s

 

[DrMrLordX]

With upto 69 GB of capacity

Elon Musk has already ordered 420 units.

 

[dullard]

What is the possibility of Intel introducing a Core Ultra 9X Arrow Lake CPU with 256MB HBM3e on-package L4 cache? Would it be profitable for them at the $699 price point?

I admit that I don't follow HBM3e memory, but isn't the smallest DIMM chip in a stack of HBM3e memory 2 GB (SK Hynix) or 3 GB (Micron)? So not only would 256 MB be far too small for any announced product, but with just one chip would lose any benefit of the 2.5D memory stacks.

 

[mikk]

MSI Core Ultra 100H “Meteor Lake” AI laptop series available for preorder, pricing starts at $1049

MSI Core Ultra 100H "Meteor Lake" AI laptop series available for preorder, pricing starts at $1049 - VideoCardz.com

MSI AI laptop series to feature Intel Meteor Lake Today, some retailer listings, as uncovered by hardware investigator @momomo_us, have confirmed that the upcoming Intel Meteor Lake processor series is set to drive MSI’s AI laptops. These laptops are said to be launched next month. The revealed...

videocardz.com

 

[FlameTail]

We got AI laptops ?

 

[SiliconFly]

We got AI laptops ?

It's above $1000. Gotta be AI laptops.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Look pretty thin. What's the bet? 10 hour battery life?

 

[trivik12]

MSI Core Ultra 100H “Meteor Lake” AI laptop series available for preorder, pricing starts at $1049

https://videocardz.com/newz/msi-cor...ble-for-preorder-pricing-starts-at-1049[/URLN

Newegg probably went overboard having the preorder ready so early. They have now taken down the links. I guess Intel does not want anyone getting the laptop before 12/14. Prestige 16 had listed availability as of 12/8 !!

 

[mikk]

In this store there is a MSI Prestige 13 AI Evo with an Ultra 7 155H in stock but might be incorrect.

MSI Prestige 13 AI Evo A1MG-029US - 13.3" QHD+ OLED - Ultra 7 - 155H - Intel Arc - Stellar Gray

MSI Prestige 13 AI Evo A1MG-029US Ultra Thin and Light Professional Laptop - 13.3" QHD+ (2880 x 1800) OLED Display w/ Intel Arc Graphics - Intel Core Ultra 7 - 155H - 1 TB M.2 NVMe PCIe Gen4 SSD, customizable: 1 x M.2 NVMe PCIe Gen4 SSD - 16 GB LPDDR5-6400MHz onboad RAM - Windows 11 Pro -...

www.hidevolution.com

 

[igor_kavinski]

In this store there is a MSI Prestige 13 AI Evo with an Ultra 7 155H in stock but might be incorrect.

MSI Prestige 13 AI Evo A1MG-029US - 13.3" QHD+ OLED - Ultra 7 - 155H - Intel Arc - Stellar Gray

MSI Prestige 13 AI Evo A1MG-029US Ultra Thin and Light Professional Laptop - 13.3" QHD+ (2880 x 1800) OLED Display w/ Intel Arc Graphics - Intel Core Ultra 7 - 155H - 1 TB M.2 NVMe PCIe Gen4 SSD, customizable: 1 x M.2 NVMe PCIe Gen4 SSD - 16 GB LPDDR5-6400MHz onboad RAM - Windows 11 Pro -...

www.hidevolution.com

They tryin' to make an early bird profit. I wonder if someone here will buy and benchmark it for the AT community Come on, guys! It's cheaper than Macbook Pro, got 16GB RAM and most importantly, it has Intel's first ever NPU! It will be a collector's item one day!

 

[trivik12]

I think a well done review on youtube could get tons of views. Early bird will get the worm for sure.

 

[igor_kavinski]

So MSI not only finished their homework in advance, they also shipped hardware to retailers!

Come on, Intel! Launch it already. Don't be shy. There's not much worse you can do after Raptor Lake Refresh