It's a two way street

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Dirigible

If you mods are tired of users, it can't be that hard to stop being a mod. I know it hasn't been hard to greatly reduce my visits to AT forums since the moderating has been going to hell.

If you are tired of the way we moderate the forums, it can't be that hard to stop posting.

People are indeed purposefully doing what they know is bannable out of annoyance for the ridiculous moderating and flimsy reasons given.

Welcome to your own ridiculous self pwnage. :laugh:

If being a fair and consistent moderator is such a burden you could step down as well? The old 'If you don't like it, leave' line is old. When you have as many members complaining about this as you guys do, its not the members that are the problem.

Looks like the nuts want to take over the nuthouse.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: esquared

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Dirigible

If you mods are tired of users, it can't be that hard to stop being a mod. I know it hasn't been hard to greatly reduce my visits to AT forums since the moderating has been going to hell.

If you are tired of the way we moderate the forums, it can't be that hard to stop posting.

People are indeed purposefully doing what they know is bannable out of annoyance for the ridiculous moderating and flimsy reasons given.

Welcome to your own ridiculous self pwnage. :laugh:

If being a fair and consistent moderator is such a burden you could step down as well? The old 'If you don't like it, leave' line is old. When you have as many members complaining about this as you guys do, its not the members that are the problem.

What, a handful of members out of 200,000+?

No, the problem isn't with whole membership thinking there a problem here. It's with the <100 members here that do the most complaining. The ones that are yelling the loudest to make everyone think there's a problem.

I don't think the squeaky wheel gets the grease here.

LULZ!

Less than 10% of that number are active. I often log in to see ~100 user online, peaking at ~400 if it's 'busy'.

Big Boards has AT at rank #67, when once it was in the top ten. So maybe the 'vocal minority' is bigger than you think. Maybe you should not act like Parents, but fellow posters. Maybe you shouldn't look at the more flippant posts as childish or an assault on your authority, but posters letting off steam.

But I understand the issues with the steering of your group. At the end of the day the only person to blame for any consternation appears to be Anand, and he couldn't give two hot shits, so nothing will change while there is nobody of any consequence at the helm.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Agentbolt
...snip///

And also, Olds, look I like you man. Your replies to most stuff are concise and thoughtful. But have you EVER, even once, had a bad word to say about the moderation here or the way the site is run? Either you think the site/moderation is perfect in every way, or you're determined to toe the line as a former mod or whatever. In either case, great, we get it. Usually when someone says something retarded, your reply is an instant ace that shuts them up, but the "I'm going to ignore whatever you just said about the mods, call you a name, and suggest you get a life" song and dance isn't impressing anyone anymore.

Finally, and most importantly, Derek's continued silence in this thread is deafening.

I didn't address the complaint because I have (probably literally) addressed it a hundred times.
Part of the reason for the inconsistency is because of so many different Mods and the fact that they have so many different personalities. Something that Mod A sees as a broken rule may seem to Mod B as an almost broken rule so each acts differently.
We don't live in a black and white world and even we (members) are inconsistent in our everyday lives. I don't know why we want to hold the unpaid Mods to a higher standard. But my theory is that we have a group of immature malcontents that get pleasure in stirring up shit.

 

[MotionMan]

Ironical posts are ironic.

MotionMan

 

[MotionMan]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
But I understand the issues with the steering of your group. At the end of the day the only person to blame for any consternation appears to be Anand, and he couldn't give two hot shits, so nothing will change while there is nobody of any consequence at the helm.

There are 75 moderators according to Red, but it seems that there are only 2-4 moderators that seem to be the subject of 90+% of the consistency complaints.

Is there a reason the Senior Moderators could not get together to discuss and figure out how to deal with the problem?

BTW, kudos to the moderation team for not locking this thread.

MotionMan

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Agentbolt


If Harvey's been treated THAT badly, any sane person would've quit a long time ago. Your making it sound like Anand personally whips him with wet leather straps every day. It's a goddamned Internet forum, if it's that bad Harvey can retire. The place isn't going to fall apart without his l33t moderating skillz. The "if you don't like modding you can stop modding here" argument is just as stupid and flawed as the "if you don't like posting, stop posting here" one, so I'm not saying that, but again, it's an internet forum. It's not worth getting upset about anything that happens here.

Harvey's name pops up in PFI more than any two other mods combined, it seems. Really outrageous stuff. How do I define outrageous? The official answer is Harvey saying "fuck you crybaby" and then another senior mod saying "take it up with Derek" and then locking/deleting the thread.

I've never personally run afoul of him, probably because I don't post all that often, but any conversation about mod inconsistency has to at least bring him up as a point of discussion. I'm definitely sorry Geekbabe's so upset about how this "situation" with Harvey's been handled, but that post screams hyperbole and biased point of view, GB.

And also, Olds, look I like you man. Your replies to most stuff are concise and thoughtful. But have you EVER, even once, had a bad word to say about the moderation here or the way the site is run? Either you think the site/moderation is perfect in every way, or you're determined to toe the line as a former mod or whatever. In either case, great, we get it. Usually when someone says something retarded, your reply is an instant ace that shuts them up, but the "I'm going to ignore whatever you just said about the mods, call you a name, and suggest you get a life" song and dance isn't impressing anyone anymore.

Finally, and most importantly, Derek's continued silence in this thread is deafening.

ohh very well said and 100% right.

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: Agentbolt

If Harvey's been treated THAT badly, any sane person would've quit a long time ago. Your making it sound like Anand personally whips him with wet leather straps every day. It's a goddamned Internet forum, if it's that bad Harvey can retire. The place isn't going to fall apart without his l33t moderating skillz. The "if you don't like modding you can stop modding here" argument is just as stupid and flawed as the "if you don't like posting, stop posting here" one, so I'm not saying that, but again, it's an internet forum. It's not worth getting upset about anything that happens here.

Harvey's name pops up in PFI more than any two other mods combined, it seems. Really outrageous stuff. How do I define outrageous? The official answer is Harvey saying "fuck you crybaby" and then another senior mod saying "take it up with Derek" and then locking/deleting the thread.

I've never personally run afoul of him, probably because I don't post all that often, but any conversation about mod inconsistency has to at least bring him up as a point of discussion. I'm definitely sorry Geekbabe's so upset about how this "situation" with Harvey's been handled, but that post screams hyperbole and biased point of view, GB.

And also, Olds, look I like you man. Your replies to most stuff are concise and thoughtful. But have you EVER, even once, had a bad word to say about the moderation here or the way the site is run? Either you think the site/moderation is perfect in every way, or you're determined to toe the line as a former mod or whatever. In either case, great, we get it. Usually when someone says something retarded, your reply is an instant ace that shuts them up, but the "I'm going to ignore whatever you just said about the mods, call you a name, and suggest you get a life" song and dance isn't impressing anyone anymore.

Finally, and most importantly, Derek's continued silence in this thread is deafening.

That you feel that Harvey's work here for over a decade has been limited to moderating member's postings saddens me greatly. Being the active Admin of a site this large is no walk in the park.

Change obviously occurs, the members are clamoring for this place to become like 4chan or TFFNN, personally I hope you get what what you are all wishing for and that it makes you happy.

 

[MotF Bane]

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: Geekbabe
I stepped down because quite frankly this place and the people in it weren't worth the effort.

text

If Harvey has been mistreated so terribly, unless Anand's basement is anything like Old's, he's free to leave.

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: Geekbabe
I stepped down because quite frankly this place and the people in it weren't worth the effort.

text

If Harvey has been mistreated so terribly, unless Anand's basement is anything like Old's, he's free to leave.

and leave traders on our FS/FT forums hanging? Leave people who make suicidal postings and need help just twisting in the wind? Let these forums buckle under the weight of spammers and DOS attacks?

Be careful what you wish for... there have been, many, many instances that Harvey's quick action has saved these forums from much trouble. Believe it or not, his love of these forums and of the greater collective good of the membership has been what's held him here, that he didn't abandon the place speaks very highly of him. I am very disappointed in how Harvey has been treated in all of this, very disappointed and I feel it says a lot about the values of this organization.

 

[MotF Bane]

Originally posted by: MotionMan

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
But I understand the issues with the steering of your group. At the end of the day the only person to blame for any consternation appears to be Anand, and he couldn't give two hot shits, so nothing will change while there is nobody of any consequence at the helm.

There are 75 moderators according to Red, but it seems that there are only 2-4 moderators that seem to be the subject of 90+% of the consistency complaints.

Is there a reason the Senior Moderators could not get together to discuss and figure out how to deal with the problem?

BTW, kudos to the moderation team for not locking this thread.

MotionMan

Red Dawn, Hayabusa Rider, Evadman, Harvey, Perknose, Schadenfroh, esquared, Common Courtesy, rio rebel, DrPizza, allisolm, and minendo. I don't think I missed anyone.

When was the last time there was a complaint against some of them? I don't think I've ever seen a public complaint about Hayabusa, Schadenfroh, or DrP, but it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: Geekbabe
I stepped down because quite frankly this place and the people in it weren't worth the effort.

text

If Harvey has been mistreated so terribly, unless Anand's basement is anything like Old's, he's free to leave.

He wasn't mistreated, he was unappreciated. Big difference. One day he may walk and when he does I would never think of trading in the FS forum again as it would be totally unsafe.

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: MotionMan

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
But I understand the issues with the steering of your group. At the end of the day the only person to blame for any consternation appears to be Anand, and he couldn't give two hot shits, so nothing will change while there is nobody of any consequence at the helm.

There are 75 moderators according to Red, but it seems that there are only 2-4 moderators that seem to be the subject of 90+% of the consistency complaints.

Is there a reason the Senior Moderators could not get together to discuss and figure out how to deal with the problem?

BTW, kudos to the moderation team for not locking this thread.

MotionMan

Red Dawn, Hayabusa Rider, Evadman, Harvey, Perknose, Schadenfroh, esquared, Common Courtesy, rio rebel, DrPizza, allisolm, and minendo. I don't think I missed anyone.

When was the last time there was a complaint against some of them? I don't think I've ever seen a public complaint about Hayabusa, Schadenfroh, or DrP, but it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

Politics and News?

IMHO, the biggest problem there is the fact that aside from monitoring for clear death threats against members or against public officials the forum shouldn't be moderated at all. Hang a sign on it like "abandon hope all yee who enter here" and have done with it

There's no real way to moderate such a forum that won't generate complaints IMHO the best you can hope for is that conservatives and liberals are complaining about moderation in equal numbers.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: MotF Bane
it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

Usually from some red assed Right Wing Whackjob in P&N:laugh: Hey I'm just saying!

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: Geekbabe
I stepped down because quite frankly this place and the people in it weren't worth the effort.

text

If Harvey has been mistreated so terribly, unless Anand's basement is anything like Old's, he's free to leave.

He wasn't mistreated, he was unappreciated. Big difference. One day he may walk and when he does I would never think of trading in the FS forum again as it would be totally unsafe.

Having the official power and keys turned over to Derek, a paid member of the staff... basically demoting/hobbling Harvey in front of everyone but then allowing Harvey to stay on
and cheerfully accepting him filling in for the often MIA Derek is constitutes mistreatment IMHO.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Having the official power and keys turned over to Derek, a paid member of the staff... basically demoting/hobbling Harvey in front of everyone but then allowing Harvey to stay on
and cheerfully accepting him filling in for the often MIA Derek is constitutes mistreatment IMHO.

Yes dear, right as usual.

 

[MotionMan]

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: MotionMan

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
But I understand the issues with the steering of your group. At the end of the day the only person to blame for any consternation appears to be Anand, and he couldn't give two hot shits, so nothing will change while there is nobody of any consequence at the helm.

There are 75 moderators according to Red, but it seems that there are only 2-4 moderators that seem to be the subject of 90+% of the consistency complaints.

Is there a reason the Senior Moderators could not get together to discuss and figure out how to deal with the problem?

BTW, kudos to the moderation team for not locking this thread.

MotionMan

Red Dawn, Hayabusa Rider, Evadman, Harvey, Perknose, Schadenfroh, esquared, Common Courtesy, rio rebel, DrPizza, allisolm, and minendo. I don't think I missed anyone.

When was the last time there was a complaint against some of them? I don't think I've ever seen a public complaint about Hayabusa, Schadenfroh, or DrP, but it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

You did not leave a particular mod off your list, but you missed identifying that mod as a being complained against repeatedly. That is all I will say since I do not want to get banned for a mod callout. It should not be hard to figure out, though.

MotionMan

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

If being a fair and consistent moderator is such a burden you could step down as well? The old 'If you don't like it, leave' line is old. When you have as many members complaining about this as you guys do, its not the members that are the problem.

Like you, a few of other lying right wingnut looney tunes and who else?

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Looks like the nuts want to take over the nuthouse.

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

Usually from some red assed Right Wing Whackjob in P&N:laugh: Hey I'm just saying!

Fear No Evil is one of our resident lying, fear and hate mongering right wingnut jackasses, and his posts in P&N Are Exhibit A. Read them if you have the stomach to do so. He still has a bug up his mean spirited ass because he was given time outs for such mild offenses as wishing someone would shoot me in the back of the head. No shit! He really posted that and more directed at me. :Q

Hey -- FNE -- Here's a clue and a suggestion -- The actions of all of our mods are under constant scrutiny the rest of the mods. When I take some action that has any chance of controversy, I post it for discussion in our closed mod forum.

That's the way I set up the mod crew from the beginning. That's still the way we do it, today. We don't always agree, but we keep each other pretty much on the straight and narrow, and we learn and grow from each event.

If you don't like what I do, write Derek or Anand to object. Until then, you can follow these instructions:

1. Stick one thumb in your mouth, and suck on it.
   
2. Sit on your other thumb and twirl.
   
3. At the count of three, exchange thumbs.

Ready... 1..... 2...... 3! :shocked: :laugh:

 

[Red Dawn]

PFI, we do Drama!!!

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: MotF Bane
it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

Usually from some red assed Right Wing Whackjob in P&N:laugh: Hey I'm just saying!

even those that agree with harvey on some fo what he says in P&N are amazed at some of the stuff he gets away with.

wich brings us back to what most are talking about consistancy. Many get banned for less then waht harvey has said in some threads.

of course there is nobody for us to complaine to. derek is as usless as tits on a bull.

and to be honest we all know who the true "power" (sorry been reading adventure books again..) is of AT. we know its not really derek at all. Sad thing is taht he is in "charge" when my last turd was more help to people. While i have issues with harvey and perknose i also think they are amazing when it comes to the sight. Harvey has a great reputation hunting down thieves (wich is why i still use FS/FT..now if someone would post something i want!). while i argue with perknose i know i can call him an asshole in a thread and i will get it back BUT he will also agree with me if i am right.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

If being a fair and consistent moderator is such a burden you could step down as well? The old 'If you don't like it, leave' line is old. When you have as many members complaining about this as you guys do, its not the members that are the problem.

Like you, a few of other lying right wingnut looney tunes and who else?

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Looks like the nuts want to take over the nuthouse.

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

Usually from some red assed Right Wing Whackjob in P&N:laugh: Hey I'm just saying!

Fear No Evil is one of our resident lying, fear and hate mongering right wingnut jackasses, and his posts in P&N Are Exhibit A. Read them if you have the stomach to do so. He still has a bug up his mean spirited ass because he was given time outs for such mild offenses as wishing someone would shoot me in the back of the head. No shit! He really posted that and more directed at me. :Q

Hey -- FNE -- Here's a clue and a suggestion -- The actions of all of our mods are under constant scrutiny the rest of the mods. When I take some action that has any chance of controversy, I post it for discussion in our closed mod forum.

That's the way I set up the mod crew from the beginning. That's still the way we do it, today. We don't always agree, but we keep each other pretty much on the straight and narrow, and we learn and grow from each event.

If you don't like what I do, write Derek or Anand to object. Until then, you can follow these instructions:

1. Stick one thumb in your mouth, and suck on it.
   
2. Sit on your other thumb and twirl.
   
3. At the count of three, exchange thumbs.

Ready... 1..... 2...... 3! :shocked: :laugh:

Well.. I think this is exactly what we are talking about. You can't even avoid personal attacks in the PFI forum. I have made no such attacks against you in this forum and only suggested you QUIT if your job is too difficult. Is there any doubt that you can't be objective in your position? This post is proof. Is there a reason to attack me personally here and use crude sayings like telling me to stick my thumb up my ass and spin? In that type of language, crudeness, and unprofessionalism even remotely necessary for this thread? I would expect more maturity from a 15 year old working at McDonalds. Yet you can't help yourself, you do it repeatedly.

You are a seriously bitter and angry person who can't even follow a minimal level of decency in the PFI forum let alone P&N. You conduct here speaks volumes. Even staff members have contacted me personally and said they believe your behavior often crosses the line. You say Moderator actions are 'under constant scrutiny'. That may apply to everyone else, but it certainly does not apply to you. If I can paraphrase YOU, :music: who's watching over who watching over the mods? :music:

Sure, I've had incidents where I've taken things too far in P&N.. we all do it occasionally who participate there. The difference is you hide behind your position to get away with it while the rest of us get vacations for things you yourself do. As others have posted in this thread they have proof of it, but are afraid to post because they know the consequences of crossing you publically on this forum. You abuse your position in this forum for trivial and petty things like trying to win arguments in P&N. I absolutely cannot respect you at any level because of that.

Thanks for completely making the point of so many posters in this thread. Your one reply just about sums it all up.

 

[MotionMan]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

If being a fair and consistent moderator is such a burden you could step down as well? The old 'If you don't like it, leave' line is old. When you have as many members complaining about this as you guys do, its not the members that are the problem.

Like you, a few of other lying right wingnut looney tunes and who else?

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Looks like the nuts want to take over the nuthouse.

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

it seems that every couple of weeks there's something in PFI about Harvey.

Usually from some red assed Right Wing Whackjob in P&N:laugh: Hey I'm just saying!

Fear No Evil is one of our resident lying, fear and hate mongering right wingnut jackasses, and his posts in P&N Are Exhibit A. Read them if you have the stomach to do so. He still has a bug up his mean spirited ass because he was given time outs for such mild offenses as wishing someone would shoot me in the back of the head. No shit! He really posted that and more directed at me. :Q

Hey -- FNE -- Here's a clue and a suggestion -- The actions of all of our mods are under constant scrutiny the rest of the mods. When I take some action that has any chance of controversy, I post it for discussion in our closed mod forum.

That's the way I set up the mod crew from the beginning. That's still the way we do it, today. We don't always agree, but we keep each other pretty much on the straight and narrow, and we learn and grow from each event.

If you don't like what I do, write Derek or Anand to object. Until then, you can follow these instructions:

1. Stick one thumb in your mouth, and suck on it.
   
2. Sit on your other thumb and twirl.
   
3. At the count of three, exchange thumbs.

Ready... 1..... 2...... 3! :shocked: :laugh:

Well.. I think this is exactly what we are talking about. You can't even avoid personal attacks in the PFI forum. I have made no such attacks against you in this forum and only suggested you QUIT if your job is too difficult. Is there any doubt that you can't be objective in your position? This post is proof. Is there a reason to attack me personally here and use crude sayings like telling me to stick my thumb up my ass and spin? In that type of language, crudeness, and unprofessionalism even remotely necessary for this thread? I would expect more maturity from a 15 year old working at McDonalds. Yet you can't help yourself, you do it repeatedly.

You are a seriously bitter and angry person who can't even follow a minimal level of decency in the PFI forum let alone P&N. You conduct here speaks volumes. Even staff members have contacted me personally and said they believe your behavior often crosses the line. You say Moderator actions are 'under constant scrutiny'. That may apply to everyone else, but it certainly does not apply to you. If I can paraphrase YOU, :music: who's watching over who watching over the mods? :music:

Sure, I've had incidents where I've taken things too far in P&N.. we all do it occasionally who participate there. The difference is you hide behind your position to get away with it while the rest of us get vacations for things you yourself do. As others have posted in this thread they have proof of it, but are afraid to post because they know the consequences of crossing you publically on this forum. You abuse your position in this forum for trivial and petty things like trying to win arguments in P&N. I absolutely cannot respect you at any level because of that.

Thanks for completely making the point of so many posters in this thread. Your one reply just about sums it all up.

Like there is a way to win an argument in P&N? LOL.

Maybe the solution to a lot of the problems is to close down the P&N section and not allow such discussions. I never post there, but I have read many threads and I am always shocked by the behavior there. Perhaps the tone in P&N is spilling into OT and other sections?

In any event, this brings us full circle back to moderation consistency, it seems.

MotionMan

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Well.. I think this is exactly what we are talking about. You can't even avoid personal attacks in the PFI forum. I have made no such attacks against you in this forum and only suggested you QUIT if your job is too difficult.

Maybe YOU are the one who should be looking for other forums that are willing tolerate the blatant ignorance, stupidty, meanness and hate you post. I'll reply to your posts, there, but I'm not quitting until I want to do so.

You have an exteme minority opinion, and I have no intention of quitting as a mod.

Don't like it? I'll refund you double what you paid for your account. :laugh:

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Well.. I think this is exactly what we are talking about. You can't even avoid personal attacks in the PFI forum. I have made no such attacks against you in this forum and only suggested you QUIT if your job is too difficult.

Maybe YOU are the one who should be looking for other forums that are willing tolerate the blatant ignorance, stupidty, meanness and hate you post. I'll reply to your posts, there, but I'm not quitting until I want to do so.

You have an exteme minority opinion, and I have no intention of quitting as a mod.

Don't like it? I'll refund you double what you paid for your account. :laugh:

I guess referring to me as publically as a subhuman piece of shit publically is not any of the same things you claim I do? But thanks for completely ignoring the entire point of my post. You can't avoid breaking down into personal attacks, flames, vulgarity, and insults in this thread - To say this doesn't impact your ability to act impartially as a moderator is 'blatently ignorant' to again quote YOU.

I don't really want you to step down, I'm sure you have done a lot for AT (See! I can put aside my differences with you long enough to give you kudos).. I just want you to be held to the same standards you hold members to. I won't even go so far as to say you should be held to a HIGHER standard as I know I would be asking for the impossible.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

I guess referring to me as publically as a subhuman piece of shit publically is not any of the same things you claim I do?

Good guess. Remember, you brought up this subject so don't blame me for replying to it, but since you did, I reserve that particular comment for the subhuman pieces of shit who publicly support acts of TORTURE committed by the Bush administration.

You are one. I've said the same thing about others who have posted similar comments. Actually, that's probably praising anyone who has posted that particular horror too highly, and I make no apologies for saying it. There's a reason why the world has labeled TORTURE as a CRIME AGAINST HUMANITY. :shocked:

I won't go deeper into it, here. Anyone who really cares to know about who you are and what you believe can search for your posts in P&N.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

I guess referring to me as publically as a subhuman piece of shit publically is not any of the same things you claim I do?

Good guess. Remember, you brought up this subject so don't blame me for replying to it, but since you did, I reserve that particular comment for the subhuman pieces of shit who publicly support acts of TORTURE committed by the Bush administration.

You are one. I've said the same thing about others who have posted similar comments. Actually, that's probably praising anyone who has posted that particular horror too highly, and I make no apologies for saying it. There's a reason why the world has labeled TORTURE as a CRIME AGAINST HUMANITY. :shocked:

I won't go deeper into it, here. Anyone who really cares to know about who you are and what you believe can search for your posts in P&N.

(Shakes Head).. I guess there is a reason Anand felt the need to put Derek in charge here. Its just too bad he isn't available. But I do thank you for pretty much summing up this entire thread and what people are complaining about in like 2 posts.