I havent touched a joystick is so long the rubber on them has eroded and fell apart last time I touched it. I use my Logitech RumblePad II or my Xbox 360 wired controller for all my jopad/joystick games. I even tossed out my Saitek stick and throttle combo and my steering wheel ages ago. They took up too much room! I still have the first Logitech Rumble Joystick tho. Had to plug it into the wall for the rumble to work. Thing is huge by todays standards, but I kept it because I took me ages to find it in a store.