Kamper starts running in VFFs

[kamper]

So I bought some KSOs this past weekend to try out the whole minimalist running thing. While considering it, I appreciated the writeups of people who were trying them out so I figured I'd do a little log of my own.

Sizing

My measurements said I was a 42 according to the Vibram sizing chart and the official measurement device at the store said I was either a 42 or 43. I think in reality, I'm between a 43 and 44. The 44s are comfy in the toes but have too much spare room in the heels that folds when my foot flexes. In 43s, my big toes are pretty snug against the end.

I usually choose the smaller of two sizes and it usually results in pain. I went with the 43s anyway because these things are supposed to be snug and because the sizing chart indicated that 44s would be too big. So far, no problems though.

Now that I know my size, I can order future pairs online, but I'd definitely recommend going in to the store for the first time.

Walking

I first wore them while walking around for about 2 hours downtown (so all hard, flat surfaces). I wanted to walk another 45 minutes home, but my soles were too sore. They felt like I normally do after walking 8-10 hours/day in regular shoes. I don't know if this is an adaptation thing, or if walking on concrete just sucks

I got two comments from strangers. One was a lady who I think watched me put them on and wanted to know what they were all about. Another was from a guy who was wearing the trek model and just said "nice shoes". So they get noticed.

Running

I'll update this more as I run, but so far I've done a 2k and a 3k run. Both were mostly on concrete sidewalks as I don't have a lot of grass that close to home. I was definitely a heel striker before and while I'm adjusting towards the middle, I think I'm still landing too far back. My goal is to go out and run what feels natural and to try to adjust intuitively if/when things hurt.

I seem to be running pretty much my normal speed, or a bit faster, but that could be because I don't have to worry about tiring on shorter runs.

I have not yet experienced much of the calf pain that a lot of people report. I expect it'll happen in time as I run longer though.

My two feet seem to be adjusting differently. The slapping sound they make (fairly loud!) is noticeably different and my right calf feels like it's working a bit harder. The sole of my left foot is also more sore after today's 3k run. This might be a result of the fact that my left leg is a cm or two shorter but I'm not sure.

And lastly, I have many blisters on my feet and a few busted toenails from other activities but none of these have been agitated or sore at all in the vffs which is pretty impressive given that they're so snug and that I'm not wearing any socks. These things are very nicely built.

Going forward, I will do occasional runs in the vffs, slowly upping the distance, while continuing long distances in normal shoes. I'd like to do a marathon in the fall and that will definitely be in normal shoes

 

[PricklyPete]

Definitely keep us updated and good luck. I'm back to running in regular shoes after my episode with VFF's in May/June. I'm seeing how my feet hold up over the next month, but I'm likely to stick with shoes through next spring to keep my feet "healthy" for marathons. May play around a bit again next summer.

 

[brikis98]

My measurements said I was a 42 according to the Vibram sizing chart and the official measurement device at the store said I was either a 42 or 43. I think in reality, I'm between a 43 and 44. The 44s are comfy in the toes but have too much spare room in the heels that folds when my foot flexes. In 43s, my big toes are pretty snug against the end.

I usually choose the smaller of two sizes and it usually results in pain. I went with the 43s anyway because these things are supposed to be snug and because the sizing chart indicated that 44s would be too big. So far, no problems though.

I'll have to check the sizes when I get home, but I think I'm exactly the same way. That is, 44's are just a touch too big, 43's feel snug in the toes, and I ended up getting the latter. Weird.

I first wore them while walking around for about 2 hours downtown (so all hard, flat surfaces). I wanted to walk another 45 minutes home, but my soles were too sore. They felt like I normally do after walking 8-10 hours/day in regular shoes. I don't know if this is an adaptation thing, or if walking on concrete just sucks

Mostly an adaptation & technique thing. Over time, your feet will get tougher and you'll learn to walk a bit lighter. When I started, my feet got sore pretty quick. Nowadays, I can do 5 hour hikes over rocky terrain in VFFs without any soreness.

I got two comments from strangers. One was a lady who I think watched me put them on and wanted to know what they were all about. Another was from a guy who was wearing the trek model and just said "nice shoes". So they get noticed.

I've had mine well over a year and I still can't wear them outside with getting at least one comment from a stranger. Be prepared to talk about them a lot.

And lastly, I have many blisters on my feet and a few busted toenails from other activities but none of these have been agitated or sore at all in the vffs which is pretty impressive given that they're so snug and that I'm not wearing any socks. These things are very nicely built.

I've had the opposite experience: blisters are actually the one thing I periodically struggle with in my VFFs. It might be a form issue or just the dumb way my feet are shaped (not only do I not have an arch, my foot kind of juts out where there should be an arch), but every now and then I get a nasty blister on my big toe or the ball of the foot. I recently tried them with a pair of Injinji socks, which seemed to help, but I'll need to experiment more to know for sure.

 

[kamper]

Mostly an adaptation & technique thing. Over time, your feet will get tougher and you'll learn to walk a bit lighter. When I started, my feet got sore pretty quick. Nowadays, I can do 5 hour hikes over rocky terrain in VFFs without any soreness.

The funny thing was that by the end of the walk, I was actually looking for rough terrain, paving stones, uneven sidewalk tiles, etc. It felt better to make my foot form to something even if it was hard. It was just the flat ground that hurt.

I've had the opposite experience: blisters are actually the one thing I periodically struggle with in my VFFs. It might be a form issue or just the dumb way my feet are shaped (not only do I not have an arch, my foot kind of juts out where there should be an arch), but every now and then I get a nasty blister on my big toe or the ball of the foot. I recently tried them with a pair of Injinji socks, which seemed to help, but I'll need to experiment more to know for sure.

I've only had them very briefly, so we'll see what wearing them longer brings. I'm betting I'm going to have issues with my big toes being too tight against the front of the shoe.

I tried out the Injinji socks in the store (demo socks are gross, demo toe socks are even worse ). I think that the 43s are tight enough on me that adding socks won't work very well. Also, they are ridiculously expensive!

 

[brikis98]

The funny thing was that by the end of the walk, I was actually looking for rough terrain, paving stones, uneven sidewalk tiles, etc. It felt better to make my foot form to something even if it was hard. It was just the flat ground that hurt.

Heh, yea, I love walking on weird terrain in them.

I think that the 43s are tight enough on me that adding socks won't work very well.

I thought so too until I tried it. They fit just fine, though having your toes separated by the socks feels even weirder than the VFFs.

Also, they are ridiculously expensive!

Sadly true.

 

[kamper]

Sadly true.

I just double checked this. In Canada, I can get the shoes for the same price as in the US, which is a good deal, since our dollar is a bit below yours. The socks however, are $18 in store here, as opposed to $12 on the Vibram website. I may as well have them shipped if I want them.

 

[kamper]

Definitely keep us updated and good luck. I'm back to running in regular shoes after my episode with VFF's in May/June. I'm seeing how my feet hold up over the next month, but I'm likely to stick with shoes through next spring to keep my feet "healthy" for marathons. May play around a bit again next summer.

I'm hoping mixing doesn't keep me back too much in terms of training. Right now I want to run a lot in them because they're new and fun, but your story is a good reminder to take it gradually

 

[PricklyPete]

I'm hoping mixing doesn't keep me back too much in terms of training. Right now I want to run a lot in them because they're new and fun, but your story is a good reminder to take it gradually

Yeah...I'm sure you will be absolutely fine if you take it slowly. I'm still convinced that running barefoot/minimal is the correct route to take...but your body needs time to properly develop the support to run that way.

 

[Megatomic]

Vibram has some trail "shoes" coming out soon called the Bikila. I may try them out, they are the only hope I have of minimalism. I run on some ridiculously rocky/rooty terrain and the protection a trail shoe offers is very important to me.

 

[kamper]

Vibram has some trail "shoes" coming out soon called the Bikila. I may try them out, they are the only hope I have of minimalism. I run on some ridiculously rocky/rooty terrain and the protection a trail shoe offers is very important to me.

They are out, and I may have gone for a pair of those instead, but they don't seem to be available in Canada yet. I think I'd only really want them if the soles lasted longer running on the road than the KSOs though and I figure if I can get somewhere in the neighborhood of 400-500km out of these, then they're cost competitive with my regular shoes anyway.

For trail running, have you considered the Trek model?

 

[kamper]

Ran 3k again today. No soreness in the sole of my left foot this time, but definitely felt the left calf. Also, I really felt the shift away from heel striking when running down slight slopes, which is encouraging.

 

[Megatomic]

For trail running, have you considered the Trek model?

No. They really don't cut it for trails, not for someone with my biomechanics (big) anyways. I recently met and talked with a Vibram rep for a good hour, he told me that the Bikila is really my best bet.

 

[kamper]

I ran 7km yesterday afternoon in my Asics. It was the first time after 3 runs in the vffs and the first thing that came to my mind was that it was like running on a water bed. Of course I reverted straight back to heel striking, but at least now I'm more conscious of what forefoot feels like and I can do it on purpose in my Asics for small stretches.

I really wanted to go back out in the vffs today, but I still have a knot in my left calf from yesterday and I've been reading a lot about the TOFP (top of foot pain) that seems to strike just when you think you're adapting well, so I did 11.5k in my Asics instead.

 

[kamper]

No. They really don't cut it for trails, not for someone with my biomechanics (big) anyways. I recently met and talked with a Vibram rep for a good hour, he told me that the Bikila is really my best bet.

Interesting, I've read a lot about people using Treks for trail running and there's a lot of excitement about Bikilas as a road shoe. But I guess a Vibram rep would know (and probably not to be doubted considering that the Treks are 25% more expensive)

I've never tried either or run on trails...

 

[Megatomic]

I looked at a few Trek reviews and it does have beefier "soles", but I think the Bikila is still, for me, a better Five Finger choice. Thanks for prompting me to look at them again.

 

[kalrith]

if I can get somewhere in the neighborhood of 400-500km out of these

I think people typically get a lot more miles out of VFFs than normal running shoes:

VFFs at 350 miles
VFFs at 900 miles
​

 

[kamper]

I think people typically get a lot more miles out of VFFs than normal running shoes:

VFFs at 350 miles
VFFs at 900 miles
​

Wow, that's impressive! I don't plan on nursing and repairing them like he does, but then again, I'm not planning on doing ultras on rugged terrain either.

 

[kamper]

I ran 2k today in my vffs. Afterward I jogged around a bit on some fairly bumpy grass and I was pleased with how safe my ankles felt. Partially it's that the foot just bends around bumps until something hits solid ground, but I think it's also that with the heel a couple centimetres closer to the ground, there's much less leverage when your ankle does bend.

The more I read online, the more I notice just how many people making a transition seem to get stress fractures and it has me a bit concerned. Some people are recommending ramp ups of up to a year before you can run without shoes as hard as you would with shoes, although nobody really has any good science that specifies how long it really takes a foot to strengthen up. I think I'm going to keep it to 2 runs per week, no longer than 3k, and just try to walk as often as possible.

 

[PricklyPete]

I ran 2k today in my vffs. Afterward I jogged around a bit on some fairly bumpy grass and I was pleased with how safe my ankles felt. Partially it's that the foot just bends around bumps until something hits solid ground, but I think it's also that with the heel a couple centimetres closer to the ground, there's much less leverage when your ankle does bend.

The more I read online, the more I notice just how many people making a transition seem to get stress fractures and it has me a bit concerned. Some people are recommending ramp ups of up to a year before you can run without shoes as hard as you would with shoes, although nobody really has any good science that specifies how long it really takes a foot to strengthen up. I think I'm going to keep it to 2 runs per week, no longer than 3k, and just try to walk as often as possible.

Glad to hear you are progressing well. I wish I had your discipline to keep my runs short and slowly ramp up. Hope it continues to progress well...I definitely think it ultimately helps your form whether you stick with it or not (or at least makes you more conscious of how you are running).

 

[kamper]

Well, I used up one of my 2 weekly vff runs today (read: I'm probably not going to be able to keep it to 2/week...). Just 2k though, so at least I'm controlling that

I wore them to work on Friday and will again tomorrow.

Now that they've broken in a bit, size 43 is no longer so tight so I think I'm happy with the size choice.

 

[kamper]

3.5k today. I'm noticing a few things in terms of form and feel.

First, for the first time ever, I can feel the difference in length between my two legs while running. I've been told before that I visibly swing my right (longer) leg out to the side a bit but I've never been conscious of it. Now I can tell that it's easier for me to land on the front of my left foot, while my right foot still tends to come down towards the middle or back a bit more. I notice this in regular shoes as well when I try to run forefoot. This results in a bit more soreness in the balls of my left foot and in my left calf.

Secondly, over the course of my 3.5k run, I found it progressively harder to stay on the fronts of my feet without concentrating specifically on it. I assume this is due to my calves tiring which means I've got some strength to build up there as well.

I also have a dumb little anecdote. The other day I was waiting at a bus stop and a pretty looking girl behind me started asking about my shoes, so I was all like . I mentioned that I run in them and she asked if they were comfortable so I was like "yeah, but it takes some time to get used to the impact of running without padding and shifting how you land and stuff" and then she was like "yeah sometimes when I feel like running but don't have my shoes with me, I just go for 12k runs barefoot on the sidewalk" and then I was like

 

[kamper]

3 & 3/4 km today. I was up on my forefeet for the entire run today. My natural feel seems to be to run with a more or less straight leg, which I doubt is very good form. I experimented a little with kicking up my heels in the back while trying to keep my strides short.

I don't really have any idea whether my feet are landing in front of me or under me. I guess I should try recording myself.

 

[kamper]

My feet have been sore lately, partly due to my recent increase in mileage in normal shoes but also probably due to running in vffs. Nothing bad, but I haven't wanted to get it confused with ToFP, so I've only been walking in the vffs this week.

However, this morning I went for a little 3k leg shake in my regular shoes and I'm feeling a sharp pain on the outside/top of my right foot when I step a certain way. Seems like it could be ToFP but it's weird that it would show up almost a week after last having run in vffs. Anyway, I'll probably lay off the vffs completely for a week or so, maybe 2 for running and I'm going to take it easy for a few days in regular shoes.

 

[kamper]

I tried on some flows today, in hopes that they would make a good cold / slushy weather shoe. They were unfortunately not comfortable enough so I didn't get them.

They fit pretty much the same as the ksos, except that the toes are tighter. Not length-wise, but in diameter. My toes felt very constricted with or without socks. The soles are also a bit more rigid and I found I couldn't curl my toes in them which was kind of annoying.

 

[kamper]

3k today, after which my right foot was a bit achy. Probably should have kept it to 2, but it's so much fun