Man .... those G5s

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Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
Originally posted by: rnp614
Originally posted by: Lyfer
G5's do look damn nice, but so does a Viper GTS, .

Eh, the R/T10 looks better....I own one

Viper's are way sexier than their truck brethren. And won't you be sad when the 2005 Lightning comes out, and gives the SRT10 a stompin?

Anyways, I could buy a G5... but as I said above, why would I want to? They have nothing to offer me, at all. I don't need ease of use, which to me, is the one thing mac has going for it.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
Originally posted by: fredtam
The mac doesn't have a window because nobody wants to look in and see nothing. It is way to clean. I like to see what I spent my money on even when I'm not using it. The Mac looks like some futuristic kitchen appliance.

Pics of mine.

Sorry about the window. I guess I'm a poser. Oh yeah and the lighted fans. If your going to pose you might as well do it right.
Cost:$1800 (self built) including Samsung 191T
Not having you computer mistaken for a cheese grater- priceless.



we all have that case now cathodes off, leds bright enough, only turn em on to see dust buildup better


i still like the cheese grater better.
 

Samsonid

Senior member
Nov 6, 2001
279
0
0
Originally posted by: LethalWolfe

The only thing you can't upgrade is the mobo. You can buy CPU upgrade cards to get yer clock speed up. Some, for older Macs, fit into PCI slots while others are brand new daugther cards (Newer Macs have their CPU's on daugther cards connected to the mobo). You can get single and dual proc upgrades as well. At work we have an ancient 9600 (welcome to 1997) that has a G4 500mhz upgrade card running OS 10.2 (thanx to some 3rd party software). Now, it's not a speed demon by any means but it's definetly fast enough to be usable. Anyway, I think this point is rather moot as you are forgetting your geekness. How many typical end users upgrade their mobo and proc? How man businesses upgrade by stripping down the computer down and replacing the mobo and proc?

Lethal

Hey Lethal,

I didn't know this about the Macs. Thanks for pointing this out.
Always thought you have to throw away the whole thing (or the Applephile argument would be that a Mac will not need to be upgraded for 4-5 years at which point it is good idea to change the whole thing any way).

Anyway, I think this point is rather moot as you are forgetting your geekness.

True, but we are forgeting that this thread was very egotistical; it was about **my** depression for why am **I** not using a Mac.
Your point is absolutely valid though. Real people (non geeks) with legitimate businesses with real ambitions and aspirations understand the importance (and time savings) of **not** having to fiddle with your computer. Spending several hours upgrading Mobo/CPU/Graphics card and reinstallling the OS, reinstalling applications, reinstalling data files from back-up and have a business running at the same time is an exercise that only a geek will appreciate and brag about

--
 

draelon

Member
May 12, 2003
57
0
0
Originally posted by: HeraclitusCan you show me a PC comparable to the dual G5 that costs US$1000?

No.

Can you show me a G5 for US$1000?

The G5 case looks very nice and Apple has a history of making cases that are very easy to upgrade parts in, but it seems to me like the G5 has serious limitations in terms of expansion. Where do I add a second cd drive? or a dvd drive? or a 3rd and 4th hard drive?

I like the lack of cables all over the place, but I wonder how someone with a high end scsi raid card is going to connect the cables from their raid card to their scsi drives seeing as the PCI expansion slots are in a different zone from the drive bays.

I guess I'd have to see the case in person to dertmine if it is feasable for expansion or only good as shipped.
 

addragyn

Golden Member
Sep 21, 2000
1,198
0
0
Firstly the G5 is aimed at pro markets where re: serious storage presumably Apple wants to sell an Xserve RAID. The enthusiast market is a very distant second.

I have no doubt you can install PCI cards. When used as a DAW this thing will be full up with cards. I do agree that expandibility is very limited but most businesses don't upgrade HW anyway.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
G5 has serious limitations in terms of expansion. Where do I add a second cd drive? or a dvd drive? or a 3rd and 4th hard drive?

the superdrive is cd/dvd burner.

their explanation for the two hd slots is that drives are past 250? gb now. if you want capacity, 2 can go very far. unlike pc users who bring their old equipment over, buying a new g5 doesn't really have that problem. firewire external drives are also quite fast now, so backup or adding excess capacity really isn't a problem.
 

Megatomic

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
20,127
6
81
Originally posted by: draelon
The G5 case looks very nice and Apple has a history of making cases that are very easy to upgrade parts in, but it seems to me like the G5 has serious limitations in terms of expansion. Where do I add a second cd drive? or a dvd drive? or a 3rd and 4th hard drive?
USB 2.0 or Firewire 800 come to mind. There are some nice external drives on the market today.
 

wetcat007

Diamond Member
Nov 5, 2002
3,502
0
0
Apples are basically crapm they really do not outperform PC's in any way, and most games, and applications are for Linux and Windows anyhow. Apples used to have purpose I think over the last few years they have lost any purpose though. Linux is now a far more viable alternitive to windows than MacOS will ever be.

For the case, macs in my opinion look ugly as hell and have all plastic cases.

The inside of the case looks very crowded to me, maybe organized LOOKING, but they got giant box heatsink deals, so we'll never know I guess. If you want organized, and much cooler looking get a Falcon-NW, because DAMN those things look nice. At a ridiculus price of $3000 you get a ATI Radeon 9000, I mean cmon? we're talking 3 grand!

The most powerful PC ever claim makes no sense, since Apple has made an effort to make themselves not considered PC's which they really arnt by x86 standards. The 64bit claim makes no sense, the opitron is used in workstations all the time as has been around since april, and if u can claim a mac is not considered a workstation type computer considering it uses Dual CPU's, you got issues.

The benchmarks they had were completly fake. The quake 3 running barly over 200fps on a P4 3ghz and a Radeon 9800? cmon, I can beat that on my crappy ti4200. I think they were using a MacOS emulator on Linux or something and then trying to play quake inside that or something really messed up, or the underclocked the computer by a large margin. If mac is so great for games, why do they not have titles like Battlefield 1942, and Counterstrike for mac, and sell low end video cards in the majority of their computers?

If anyone here has actually used a Mac, it takes too long to open up IE or Mozilla, and really feels slow overall, the OS is rather bloated feeling, probabily worse than XP on it's default theme in my opinion, add that to the fact, you're stuck with it's bloatiness you can change ur theme however u want in XP.

Something that is very ironic is that IBM makes the G5's, IBM the company that was involved in the very beginning of the PC with the x86 archatecture and all, now has to make second rate CPU's for mac, that need dual CPU's to even come the least bit close to a single Intel or AMD chip.

Apple the company isn't nessisarily bad, it's just that their computers suck! They have good idea's that take off like iTunes and other things like that, but seriously, the switch compaign? I know far more people that have gotten to sick of a mac that they switch to windows, and never heard of a person switching from windows to a mac, except on those commercial where they hire a bunch of AOL users to use a mac, and they probabily got it for free, so they didn't have to pay the $3000+ pricetag at all or anything like that, and are probabily limited, to using AOL on it anyhow.

Using a Mac is like using AOL, it is pointless and makes you look like a idiot. Anyone who honestly tries to claim Macs are better than PC's uses a crappy HP or Packard Bell computer, and in that case may have a few things they can claim, however the truth is Macs are falling farther behind in the race, and are selling far fewer than ever, and are a very hard sell. I wouldn't be surprised if the G5 isthe last CPU they ever use.

Oh yeah on mac u gotta pay for service packs over 100 dollars for 10.2 to 10.3, on windows you dload them from Windows Update, hell if you compare Windows to Mac, windows looks to great it's amazing, but when you bring Linux in, only then can u possibly start to make windows have downsides.
 

wetcat007

Diamond Member
Nov 5, 2002
3,502
0
0
Originally posted by: Samsonid
Originally posted by: LethalWolfe

The only thing you can't upgrade is the mobo. You can buy CPU upgrade cards to get yer clock speed up. Some, for older Macs, fit into PCI slots while others are brand new daugther cards (Newer Macs have their CPU's on daugther cards connected to the mobo). You can get single and dual proc upgrades as well. At work we have an ancient 9600 (welcome to 1997) that has a G4 500mhz upgrade card running OS 10.2 (thanx to some 3rd party software). Now, it's not a speed demon by any means but it's definetly fast enough to be usable. Anyway, I think this point is rather moot as you are forgetting your geekness. How many typical end users upgrade their mobo and proc? How man businesses upgrade by stripping down the computer down and replacing the mobo and proc?

Lethal

Hey Lethal,

I didn't know this about the Macs. Thanks for pointing this out.
Always thought you have to throw away the whole thing (or the Applephile argument would be that a Mac will not need to be upgraded for 4-5 years at which point it is good idea to change the whole thing any way).

Anyway, I think this point is rather moot as you are forgetting your geekness.

True, but we are forgeting that this thread was very egotistical; it was about **my** depression for why am **I** not using a Mac.
Your point is absolutely valid though. Real people (non geeks) with legitimate businesses with real ambitions and aspirations understand the importance (and time savings) of **not** having to fiddle with your computer. Spending several hours upgrading Mobo/CPU/Graphics card and reinstallling the OS, reinstalling applications, reinstalling data files from back-up and have a business running at the same time is an exercise that only a geek will appreciate and brag about

--

You don't need to upgrade a PC it never really gets any slower, it just seems that way when you use faster ones, although it's rare you get a chance to actually use another mac since they are far and few lol.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
The person who posted above me makes us Mac haters look bad... My God, the grammar!!
 

AtomicDude512

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2003
1,067
0
0
Originally posted by: lchyi
I say give it up to Apple and IBM for sticking in there. They're the underdogs now but with 64-bit weapons.

Acutually it's not a weapon, if you read around (say Google) you can discover that current Mac OS's dont support 64-Bits. The upcoming 10.3 dosent either, that's a majro dent isnt it?
 

Samsonid

Senior member
Nov 6, 2001
279
0
0
c'mon wetcat,

Your post was big rant/flamebait.

I am an x86 user thru and thru.... but... I do see the elegance in other platforms.

You mentioned a $3000 PC... but that is how much a G5 costs.
(A falcon MachV starts at $5600... which is more expensive than the G5)

... and to be honest I find OS-X to be awesome as well.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
The Falcon Mach V does NOT start at $5600... that's like, an uber decked out one.
 

Samsonid

Senior member
Nov 6, 2001
279
0
0
Originally posted by: Nebor
The Falcon Mach V does NOT start at $5600... that's like, an uber decked out one.

I was trying to compare a high end x86 PC with a high end G5.
(people keep trying to compare sub-$1000 PCs with the G5s... which I think is unfair)

---
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
Put OverVolts, or my PC up against the G5, and watch the g5 fall to the ground, clutching it's groin and screaming in a high pitched manner. My PC doesn't have more than... maybe 2k in it? I dunno, do you count monitors and speakers? Who knows, my pursuit of technology costs thousands a year.
 

Samsonid

Senior member
Nov 6, 2001
279
0
0
Originally posted by: Nebor
Put OverVolts, or my PC up against the G5, and watch the g5 fall to the ground, clutching it's groin and screaming in a high pitched manner. My PC doesn't have more than... maybe 2k in it? I dunno, do you count monitors and speakers? Who knows, my pursuit of technology costs thousands a year.

Doubt that.
I saw the specs of your "Rig"
You can overclock that until you turn blue in the face but you will not reach G5 performance levels.

I don't think I can reach G5 levels myself; until I built a dual Opteron machine. (even then it will be a close call)

--
 

Pariah

Elite Member
Apr 16, 2000
7,357
20
81
Originally posted by: Samsonid
c'mon wetcat,

Your post was big rant/flamebait.

I am an x86 user thru and thru.... but... I do see the elegance in other platforms.

You mentioned a $3000 PC... but that is how much a G5 costs.
(A falcon MachV starts at $5600... which is more expensive than the G5)

... and to be honest I find OS-X to be awesome as well.



The Falcon Mach systems do not start anywhere near $5600. That price includes what appears to be a $700 case custom painted and a 21" monitor. You get no monitor with a G5.

Edit: It should be added as well that MachV systems come with a 3 year warranty standard, while Apple only gives one year.
 

Samsonid

Senior member
Nov 6, 2001
279
0
0
Originally posted by: Pariah

The Falcon Mach systems do not start anywhere near $5600. That price includes what appears to be a $700 case custom painted and a 21" monitor. You get no monitor with a G5.

Edit: It should be added as well that MachV systems come with a 3 year warranty standard, while Apple only gives one year.

Ok, no joke, I built a Falcon MachV to match a G5 spec for spec.

*******************
Apple G5
? Dual 2GHz PowerPC G5
? 512MB DDR400 SDRAM (PC3200) - 2x256
? 160GB Serial ATA - 7200rpm
? ATI Radeon 9800 Pro
? 56k V.92 internal modem
? SuperDrive (DVD-R/CD-RW)
? Apple Keyboard & Apple Mouse - U.S. English
? Mac OS X - U.S. English
TOTAL= $3270

*********************
Falcon Mach5
ATC-201 Aluminum Mid Tower
Enermax Whisper 450 Watt Power Supply
Microsoft Windows XP Professional
Asus P4C800-E Deluxe i875P
Intel Pentium 4 3.2GHz 800
Zalman Silent P4 CPU Cooler
Corsair TwinX 512MB 3200LL-PT (2/256MB)
ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB AGP 8X
Seagate ST3160023AS 160GB 7200RPM SATA
Sony DRU510A DVD-RW
Creative Labs Audigy2 Platinum External
Logitech Deluxe Access 104 KYBD
Logitech Optical Wheel Mouse

Known issues with this configuration: None

System Price: $ 3,367.00
***********************************

Please note: The Falcon is **NOT** a dual CPU system
 

Pariah

Elite Member
Apr 16, 2000
7,357
20
81
The Apple system has some crappy onboard audio, the Mach V system has onboard audio as well with the Asus board. Why did you include a $302 sound card with the Mach V? Again, the Mach V comes standard with a 3 year warranty. Add another $249 to the Apple system for the Apple Care. Because the Intel system is single CPU, it doesn't require that the application be SMP capable. We all know most applications aren't. In more cases than not the Intel system will be faster. The Sony burner on the Falcon system is dual format while the Apple is DVD-R/RW only. You can also save $43 going with a more conservative 350W PS which is still more than enough for that system.

Apple G5 - $3519
Falcon - $3022
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
Then consider that most of us could build a comparable system for even less.
 

Samsonid

Senior member
Nov 6, 2001
279
0
0
Originally posted by: Pariah
The Apple system has some crappy onboard audio, the Mach V system has onboard audio as well with the Asus board. Why did you include a $302 sound card with the Mach V? Again, the Mach V comes standard with a 3 year warranty. Add another $249 to the Apple system for the Apple Care. Because the Intel system is single CPU, it doesn't require that the application be SMP capable. We all know most applications aren't. In more cases than not the Intel system will be faster. The Sony burner on the Falcon system is dual format while the Apple is DVD-R/RW only. You can also save $43 going with a more conservative 350W PS which is still more than enough for that system.

Apple G5 - $3519
Falcon - $3022


<?>crappy onboard audio<?>
How did you make the assessment of "crapy" ?

<?>Why did you include a $302 sound card with the Mach V
It likely needs it to reach the quality of the "onboard" G5 sound.

<?> Again, the Mach V comes standard with a 3 year warranty
Apple doesn't need long waranties (it has higher stability and higher quality)
(Toyota only gives 36month warranties, whereas Hyunday (or VW) give 10year waranties.
Now look at Consumer Reports and you will find out why Toyota doesn't need a long warranty).

<?>Add another $249 to the Apple system for the Apple Care
Apple systems are designed from the ground-up to be user-friendly.... no support is needed.

<?>In more cases than not the Intel system will be faster
Unsubstantiated assessment

Your price adjustements were not realistic
The price comparizon (IMHO) stays at $3270 vs $3367
 

Samsonid

Senior member
Nov 6, 2001
279
0
0
Originally posted by: Nebor
Then consider that most of us could build a comparable system for even less.

Read several posts above... this has already been covered. (we are repeating ourselves)
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
Samsonid said:
Unsubstantiated assessment

But say that the G5 has amazing sound and is more stable with and of higher quality than a Wintel machine?

Pot, meet kettle.
 
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