More Broadwell Mobile details revealed

[tamm]

Nothing out of the blue. Intel voiced their Tick tock refresh cycle, and this sits in line.
Innovation on the desktop front is slowing down, as more people are content with APUs and ARMs.

 

[Arkaign]

Maybe today, but just look back 2 years ago. It was either ultrabooks or 3-4kg. Now the entire supply chain is moving towards lighter chassis.



I agree with you, but it's not today that Intel marketing has started to screw us with that number soup that has become their line up. We could say that there isn't much sense in the 4770K 4C Haswell share the same moniker of the IVB 6C 4960X.



That config is around $2.000, far more expensive than some smaller/thiner touch screen ultrabooks like the Acer S7, which goes for $1.400. A fair trade off for most cases, but I can't fathom an attorney making use of such high amount of compute power.

Good point on the 6C/12T Procs. The naming conventions have been bananas for a long time.

One thing I've discovered about supporting lawyers is that they are all quite different. Some are content to peck away at Wordperfect (yes, seriously), and are content with a very long deployment timeframe. Others grew up and went to school in the computer age, and are incredibly intense users. The guy who just got the nice laptop is someone usually running a couple dozen docs at the same time (with plugins like WestLaw), BIG docs quite often, and then you have software that's not always the most efficiently coded, Timeslips, Equitrac, Outlook, Egnyte, and so on.

I've discovered that a physical Gbit connection is almost irreplaceable for such users, and that the dual cores bog much MUCH more quickly than the 4C/8T units. And bog on a system with an SSD is a weird feeling indeed.

I do think I could say that most in the building would be perfectly well provided with an Ultrabook in performance terms.

 

[Roland00Address]

I would have significantly less problem if they labeled them as what they are : modestly clocked i3s, with good battery life and a mediocre SSD most of the time.

They do market them that way. The i3, i5, i7 are telling the user two important things.

1) Relative performance in that market segment
2) Features that create the relative performance. Hyperthreading on i3 vs pentium, turbo boost on i5 vs i3, higher clocks and cache on the i7 vs i5.

You are just complaining they don't market what the cpu absolute performance is so it is easier to compare along lines product lines. Intel also makes it very clear what type of product line a cpu is based on the letter following the model number.

Desktops
K - Unlocked (adjustable CPU multiplier up to 63x)
S - Performance-optimized lifestyle (low power with 65 W TDP)
T - Power-optimized lifestyle (ultra low power with 35–45 W TDP)
R - BGA packaging / High performance GPU (currently Iris Pro 5200 (GT3e))

Mobile
X - 'Extreme'
Q - Quad-core
M - Mobile processor
U - Ultra-low power
Y - Extreme-low power
H - BGA1364 packaging

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You can complain about intel marketing not being clear enough to the end user, but don't misrepresent the marketing that they are doing.

 

[Arkaign]

It's not so much Intel, but simply letting the i7 badge be applied to the dual-cores (let alone super slow ones) is just deceptive.

And they DO get marketed as powerful, look at this Toshiba quote from the Kira (bolded for emphasis, particularly the italic part) :

"ULTRATHIN.
ULTRAPOWERFUL.

Streamline your mobile efficiency with a sleek, elegant design that offers a slimmer profile (only .70” thin) and less weight (starting at 2.6 lbs.) yet doesn’t sacrifice performance. With a 256 gigabyte SSD, Intel’s finest processors and a high-capacity battery, KIRAbook is proof positive that power can be beautiful."

Now you can fairly say that Toshiba is to blame on that, but EVERY SINGLE Ultrabook ad makes it seem like they're not a compromise, and that you are getting something more than a 2Ghz or slower dual core.

 

[996GT2]

The last Intel "Desktop CPU" was the P4. I am sure you upgraded at least twice since.

There were mobile P4s made.

http://www.intel.com/products/processor/mobilepentium4/


And I'm kinda glad the CPU market hasn't really moved that far forward in the past 3 years. Makes mes feel better about the i7-2700K in my desktop and i5-2520M in my laptop

 

[Roland00Address]

Your kirabook marketing reference is stating you get all this power and still having an ultrathin and ultraportable laptop. While both being laptops there is a big difference between a 4.2 lb laptop and a 2.6 lb laptop (a weight difference of 62%), the lenovo business you quoted is also 57% thicker.

If you don't need the graphic card or a quad core with 8 threads, you are getting very similar single and dual thread performance.

[url="http://www.anandtech.com/show/7287/analyzing-the-price-of-mobility-desktops-vs-laptops/2]From anandtech comparing laptops to desktops, cinebench 11.5 single threaded scores.[/url]

The percent is the single threaded performance of this cpu against the current best (non oc) cpu on the market today the i7 4770k
i7 4500u... — 1.33 — 75% — 15w
i7 4702mq — 1.44 — 81% — 37w
i7 4700mq — 1.50 — 84% — 47w
i7 2600k... — 1.52 — 85% — 95w
i7 4770k... — 1.78 — 100% — 84w

So in sum your laptop that is significantly heavier and thicker (while not heavy I will still call it medium weight instead of ultraportable) is 9% faster for single or dual threaded tasks. I would also like to point out the i7 4500u is only 10% slower than the 2600k in single or dual threaded tasks, a smaller difference between those two cpus than compared to the i7 4770k and the i7 2600k (something desktop enthusiast are complaining about for there is very little cpu growth.)

I personally consider your lenovo a very nice machine, but people use computers with different form factors differently. People use ultrabooks for different tasks than people that use normal laptops, people that buy ultrabooks are not doing heavy database work or video editing / rendering. Your example of a lawyer who has dozens of word documents up with plug ins that is citations is effectively a database. If such people need those extra cpu cores they will gladly step up to higher weights and form factors. You need that thicker laptop for by doubling the number of cores you are doubling the tdp.

 

[Arkaign]

All of that is true, though I've come across many buyers who have unrealistic expectations formed about Ultrabooks. Just seeing the i3 listed above the i7U is a telling situation. Of course the reverse situation is also common, I've had people buy 6C/12T workstations effectively to run Wordperfect and webmail (a very common thing with Lawyers that have been working since the 80s, lol). One of them even uses AOL (just the stupid portal software, his ISP is supplied by the building).

The Kira advertisement is pretty clear that you get power without compromise. It doesn't say that it's slower than a regular i3. Or that you're paying a relatively huge sum of money for :

(1)- Thin
(2)- Light
(3)- Good battery life
(4)- Stock SSD (90% of sub $1k notebooks still have spinners it seems)
(5)- Moderate performance specs
(6)- Higher than normal standard for construction quality

I'd just feel better if they were more consistent with their branding, it would make things less confusing.

What we *should* have :

Pentium = Dual Core
i3 = Dual Core w/HT
i5 = Quad Core
i7 = Quad Core w/HT
i9 = Hex Core w/HT

E for Efficient = low clock/low heat/low power/fanless/tablet
S for Standard = standard/vanilla
U for Unlocked = unlocked
X for Extreme = extreme

Along with a gen number. Second part of part number is normal clock speed. Add cache/socket/tdp etc info to the box.

So a 4770k instead would be i7-4U 3.5
An i7 3517u instead would be i3-3E 1.9
An i5 3210m instead would be i3-3S 2.5

You'd get an immediate picture of what the heck is the being offered. Of course, I was spoiled by the good old days before model numbers got out of hand. And at the same time a lot of research is needed for people to figure out just what to buy for their needs anyway. I shouldn't complain too much about Ultrabooks as they've given me a fair amount of extra work migrating people away from them as they disappoint people.