Multiple impact bullets

[Ruptga]

i'd rather have my first 2 shots hit and actually do something than hit and bounce off and do nothing.

Have you ever had a paintball bounce off of you? It fucking hurts. Nothing fired from a modern firearm will ever "bounce off and do nothing" unless we're talking about bears or someone so high that nothing short of instant brain disintegration would be sufficient. In either case you're fucked no matter what, so can we stick to reality?

Oh what am I saying, this is a gun thread. Anyone that can't land headshots while diving around a corner and dual-wielding "isn't competent with a firearm and shouldn't have one", and nothing short of Big Bertha will ever have "enough stopping power". Carry on.

 

[jlee]

lol....so basically you're shooting a 3 point net with a tiny slug in the middle.That's cute.

I'll stick with these.

 

[pontifex]

Have you ever had a paintball bounce off of you? It fucking hurts. Nothing fired from a modern firearm will ever "bounce off and do nothing" unless we're talking about bears or someone so high that nothing short of instant brain disintegration would be sufficient. In either case you're fucked no matter what, so can we stick to reality?

Oh what am I saying, this is a gun thread. Anyone that can't land headshots while diving around a corner and dual-wielding "isn't competent with a firearm and shouldn't have one", and nothing short of Big Bertha will ever have "enough stopping power". Carry on.

ok, i'd rather my first 2 shots hit and actually do damage/stop the attack than have them cause a small bruise/give me an ouchie and let the attacker continue.

 

[tynopik]

ok, i'd rather my first 2 shots hit and actually do damage/stop the attack than have them cause a small bruise/give me an ouchie and let the attacker continue.

tell you what, you stand on the other side of the room and charge and i'll shoot you with a couple of these and we'll see how it goes

 

[Ruptga]

tell you what, you stand on the other side of the room and charge and i'll shoot you with a couple of these and we'll see how it goes

Seriously. I use paintballs as an analogy and now he thinks they are paintballs. Every time I lower my standards I find that they're still not low enough.

 

[jlee]

tell you what, you stand on the other side of the room and charge and i'll shoot you with a couple of these and we'll see how it goes

How about he is on the other side of the room with a .45ACP?

I didn't see any proper penetration testing in that video- just a few casual tests. "It hurts" isn't necessarily going to stop someone.

 

[tynopik]

How about he is on the other side of the room with a .45ACP?

What if the other person has an Uzi?

You can come up with all the fantasy scenarios you want, but it doesn't change the simple fact that it's better to hit with something than not to hit at all.

 

[Ruptga]

How about he is on the other side of the room with a .45ACP?

I didn't see any proper penetration testing in that video- just a few casual tests. "It hurts" isn't necessarily going to stop someone.

Know what, I'd take that bet. This gimmick makes it so much easier to hit, I could aim and fire far more quickly. Once you start getting hit with metal moving faster than sound you won't be able to aim worth a damn. It doesn't need to be a howitzer to put someone on the ground.

And yes, I could still lose if I was up against a trained gunfighter, or maybe just an internet badass that likes guns, but all things being equal something like this could be a real advantage.

 

[phucheneh]

LOL @ the thought that someone claiming to be able to hit a person at 10-15 feet away (or less) makes them an 'internet badass.'

Please never own guns.

 

[Fenixgoon]

lol....so basically you're shooting a 3 point net with a tiny slug in the middle.That's cute.

I'll stick with these.

tear a hole big enough to toss a cat through

 

[LTC8K6]

If you can't hit the intruder in your house with a Gold Dot or four, then sell your guns and rely on the police.

 

[Ruptga]

Oh you guys are right, I'm so emasculated that if anything ever really happens I'll just offer the robber my drool cup then call the cops once he's gone.



None of you can promise you can land a shot center of mass on a guy five yards away when they've taken you by surprise. You can try, but you'd be trying to fool either yourself or us. One thing in practically every combat story is the chaos. Things happen too fast keep up with, adrenaline flows and you can't think straight, and sometimes you simply make a mistake with no time to correct it. A mugging or forced entry isn't that much different. You don't really know what you'd do in that situation until you've been in it, but you'll be damned if that stops you from stroking your barrel and talking shit on the internet, right?

Besides all of the above, there are a lot of people without the ability to defend themselves as well as you actually can, never mind what you claim here. The whole point of a defensive gun is that it lets you stop someone regardless of them being a badass and you being somebody's grandma, why is a load that expands on that function a bad thing? Are you concerned that you'll have to find another way to differentiate yourselves from the infirm, or that a weapon/load that puts someone on their ass without necessarily killing them is less macho?

 

[shortylickens]

I get the increased chance of a hit but aren't you reducing overall stopping power by splitting the projectile like that.

Also I figure these would be stopped very easily by body armour.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1Lr-MG3DeU&x-yt-cl=84503534&x-yt-ts=1421914688

What are your thoughts on situations where they would and wouldn't be beneficial?

Edit. Spellimg

The lethality goes up exponentially by square when you are hit with multiple bullets.

For example: If you are hit with two 9mm rounds you are four times as likely to die as if you were hit with just one.
If you are hit with four of those bullets, you are sixteen times as likely to die.

The 00 buckshot found in a 12 gauge shell is .32 caliber. If there are 8 of them in a shell and you get hit by all, you are 64 times as likely to die as if you were shot once with a round nose .32.

Keep in mind, the odds of you dying from a single round nose .32 are actually quite low. But being 64 times as likely to die is now pretty significant.

I do NOT know what the lethality of one of those above shots is. If its something like .0001 percent then even multiplying it is not doing very much.

 

[shortylickens]

lol....so basically you're shooting a 3 point net with a tiny slug in the middle.That's cute.

I'll stick with these.

HydraShoks are rated quite low compared to Gold Dots and HST's. That tiny little rod actually causes more problems than it fixes. Especially with leather and thick heavy denim.

In fact I plan to shoot off the last of my HydraShoks this week at the range. Then all I'll have left is target ammo and Gold Dot.

 

[Subyman]

My house is rigged with explosives. I just jump out the window and blow the robber up.

 

[sa7an1]

what do you guys think of the ones that fold out into an X like this one at 19:24 https://www.youtube.com/watch?featu...0I&x-yt-cl=84503534&x-yt-ts=1421914688#t=1164

 

[pontifex]

Is there any 3rd party ballistics data yet? Has the company even provided anything beyond flashy marketing drivel?
We wont know until its tested, but if history has anything to say, these gimmicky rounds dont stick around very long.

 

[shortylickens]

Is there any 3rd party ballistics data yet? Has the company even provided anything beyond flashy marketing drivel?
We wont know until its tested, but if history has anything to say, these gimmicky rounds dont stick around very long.

Black Talons were a gimmick. They got banned because they were so effective they scared dumb ignorant citizens into calling their congressmen.

 

[jlee]

What if the other person has an Uzi?

You can come up with all the fantasy scenarios you want, but it doesn't change the simple fact that it's better to hit with something than not to hit at all.

I'd still take something that is highly likely to be effective over something that likely has less penetration than a .380ACP. I don't think "fantasy" has anything to do with it.

Know what, I'd take that bet. This gimmick makes it so much easier to hit, I could aim and fire far more quickly. Once you start getting hit with metal moving faster than sound you won't be able to aim worth a damn. It doesn't need to be a howitzer to put someone on the ground.

And yes, I could still lose if I was up against a trained gunfighter, or maybe just an internet badass that likes guns, but all things being equal something like this could be a real advantage.

lol @ four part expanding bullet from a handgun being supersonic. You run what you want, my friend- I'll stick with what has worked for over 100 years. Mass + velocity.

HydraShoks are rated quite low compared to Gold Dots and HST's. That tiny little rod actually causes more problems than it fixes. Especially with leather and thick heavy denim.

In fact I plan to shoot off the last of my HydraShoks this week at the range. Then all I'll have left is target ammo and Gold Dot.

That's leftover duty ammo. I might replace it eventually, but I'm in no rush.

I can't find any ballistics testing on this round, but I found one comment on an article:

Sue Rubright says:
February 26, 2014 at 12:21 PM
I just test fired a multiple impact .45 cal into a 55 gal metal barrel at a distance of 7 steps. The bullet came nowhere near my target and only put a slight dent in the barrel (which I had already fired a .22 into it that penetrated completely). I am very disappointed in this round, and would not bet my life on it.

Read more: http://www.ammoland.com/2013/12/advanced-ballistics-concepts-multiple-impact-bullet/#ixzz3PtmP8zRO

 

[pontifex]

I'd still take something that is highly likely to be effective over something that likely has less penetration than a .380ACP. I don't think "fantasy" has anything to do with it.



lol @ four part expanding bullet from a handgun being supersonic. You run what you want, my friend- I'll stick with what has worked for over 100 years. Mass + velocity.



That's leftover duty ammo. I might replace it eventually, but I'm in no rush.

I can't find any ballistics testing on this round, but I found one comment on an article:

Pretty much what happened with the rip ammo. They could duplicate its effects with 3 .22 lr rounds.

 

[phucheneh]

Some people don't seem to get that bullets are small. We figured out long ago how to take that little object and give it maximum deadliness:

1) Give it at much mass as possible
2) Give it as much velocity as possible.
3) Make it stop as fast as possible.

That's a pretty simple formula for how create lots of kinetic energy (don't nitpick the terminology; I know you don't 'create' energy) and then impart said energy onto a human target.

Unsurprisingly, modern self-defense rounds are meant to do just this. Yes, expansion makes a bigger hole and all that, but the important part is that it slows the bullet and allows it to impart all of its force onto the target.

Rounds that break apart into little bits totally ruin this very simple operation. Period.

 

[tynopik]

Rounds that break apart into little bits totally ruin this very simple operation. Period.

Rounds that completely miss do nothing. Period.

Also, I guess you think shotguns are worthless.

 

[tynopik]

LOL @ the thought that someone claiming to be able to hit a person at 10-15 feet away (or less) makes them an 'internet badass.'

Please never own guns.

http://www.forcescience.org/articles/gaze.pdf

High-pressure situation, elite cops hit a suspect 5 meters (16.4 feet) away 75% of the time

Rookie cops (who had been through their firearms training program) hit the suspect 54% of the time.

And while the scenario was described as 'high-pressure', the cops were never in any actual fear for their lives.

 

[jlee]

Rounds that completely miss do nothing. Period.

Also, I guess you think shotguns are worthless.

Unless you're using slugs or 00 buckshot, pretty much yeah.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-3-the-shotgun-meets-the-box-o-truth/

This round may work in a 12ga, but putting it in a handgun is silly.

 

[mikeford]

Dunno, getting shot with bird shot, essentially a few dozen BBs, might not kill you, but it would really suck, and few people would go for a second dose.