Need help finding the bottleneck

[bjohansen]

Hey there. I'd like to get some help finding the bottleneck in my system.

I'm mainly playing MMORPG's, and while they are playable they are not always enjoyable due to poor performance.

My current rig:
AMD A10-5800K
AMD 7870 1Ghz version
Asus F2A85M-LE
8GB Corsair Vengeance 1866Mhz
120GB SSD
300GB HDD

Here's a picture from Age of Conan:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/zdfy596fyxhhpf1/aoc.jpg

And one from Rift:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/sx1qdse7zzcw4da/Untitled.png

As you can see, the CPU useage is kinda up there while GPU usage is not very high. I'm getting low fps ingame, especially Rift where it's pretty much unplayable when there's an event/rift going on with a few people.

I'm suspecting my CPU to be the bottleneck, since the GPU is barely doing anything. I'd like some feedback, since I don't know much about these kind of things.

 

[krnmastersgt]

The CPU definitely seems like the weakest link in that system to me, while the FM2 based APUs aren't bad for budget systems and the such they aren't exactly that great as CPUs are concerned since a lot of the silicon on the processor is dedicated to the onboard GPU.

Depending on your resolution and settings you may be held back by the 7870 in some games/situations but the weakest link in your system is definitely the CPU, the ram is enough for a good gaming system and you will rarely find an SSD being your bottleneck.

 

[bjohansen]

I'm playing at 1080p. I've been talking to another guy in Rift who's also got the AMD 7870 and he gets alot higher framerate while soloing. In the 60-90 range.
He drops down when raiding, but it's still higher than me. He's using an intel i5 4670k tho..

I tried running at 800x600 with graphics turned all the way down and I got 56 fps in the maincity in Rift.

 

[lehtv]

The 5800K is roughly equal to an Phenom II X4 955. It's definitely the part holding you back.

 

[bjohansen]

So an Intel i5 4670K will be a good upgrade?

How is intel's multicore performance compared to AMD? I've come to understand that most new games will be optimized for multicores.

 

[krnmastersgt]

The i5 4670k would be a fairly large increase in your CPU strength, pretty good upgrade and the go-to CPU of choice for most gaming builds these days. As far as comparing multi-thread performance, that comes to 2 things:
1. Performance per core: Intel at stock settings typically beats it's AMD equivalent consistently here, though they are quite a bit more expensive for doing so.
2. Number of cores: A multi-threaded game doesn't always mean it can make use of all cores, many games today are still dual or quad optimized, meaning an i7 has no advantage over an i5 when all else is the same despite having twice the thread count. So a balance of the max threads your games will support + highest performance across those threads is the key to best performance.

And Intel CPUs are just more powerful but more expensive as well. If you're concerned about your budget and don't mind dabbling in overclocking a bit the FX 6300 is a fairly popular choice with most AMD enthusiasts I know, seems to have better OC headroom than the FX 8*** line perhaps due to lower core count, but overclocked can still handle most games fairly well. Most likely at least well enough that you won't be really bottlenecking your system at least.

 

[monkeydelmagico]

You might see improvements with overclocking.

 

[bjohansen]

I can't overclock with my current motherboard as there's no heatsink on the VRM's and only a 4pin cpu connector with a 3+2 phase power design.
I've tried overclocking, but the bios only allow voltage offset which seem to either bsod or run at very high voltages.

Getting a new AMD cpu is a bit no-no. There are few m-atx boards for AMD and most of the games I play are cpu-heavy.

I'll look into getting an i5 4670k for christmas.

Edit: Budget is not really a concern. It's just a matter of locating the bottleneck and eliminate it without wasting money.

 

[lehtv]

If you're not really into overclocking, an i5-4570 gives you practically the same performance for $25-30 less. Overclocking would also require spendin on aftermarket cooling and a Z87 chipset board. So the total savings when not overclocking can be around $100, and you still get a huge increase in performance over your current CPU.

 

[sm625]

My current rig:
AMD A10-

say no more

 

[bjohansen]

Oh, but I am interested in overclocking I just can't with my current equipment.

The i5 4670k is currently on sale. It's cheaper than the 4570.

Which motherboard should I look for? I'm not interested in the most expensive ones. I'd like some balance between features and price. Overclocking ready.
Preferably with support for CFX/SLI.

Been looking at the Asus Z87 Gryphon, but the GIGABYTE GA-Z87MX-D3H seems to be pretty much the same just cheaper.

 

[lehtv]

You're limited to microATX?

I don't think SLI/CF support is particularly useful for MMORPG's.

 

[bjohansen]

You're limited to microATX?

I don't think SLI/CF support is particularly useful for MMORPG's.

I am limited to m-atx due to my case (Silverstone Sugo SG10).
I'm most likely not gonna run CFX/SLI, but I figured it would be best to keep the option open for the future. But then again, it might be better to upgrade to a newer GPU in the future?

I really like the darkish theme on the Gigabyte card, but the Gryphon has been recommended alot. There's a 30$ price difference tho.

 

[lehtv]

SLI doesn't really make sense for microATX. Too much noise and heat from not having any breathing room between the cards. If you ever decide that you need two graphics cards to run games the way you want, then buy an ATX case and motherboard. Or just upgrade your setup to ATX now if you really want to have the support for SLI.

I'd get Asrock Z87M Extreme4, it's much less expensive than Gryphon, and it's the least expensive Z87 microATX board with ALC1150 sound. Gryphon only has ALC892. It's a good overclocker too. Incidentally it does support SLI but I just consider that an irrelevant feature in any microATX board.

Out of curiosity, what is your PSU?

 

[bjohansen]

SLI doesn't really make sense for microATX. Too much noise and heat from not having any breathing room between the cards. If you ever decide that you need two graphics cards to run games the way you want, then buy an ATX case and motherboard. Or just upgrade your setup to ATX now if you really want to have the support for SLI.

I'd get Asrock Z87M Extreme4, it's much less expensive than Gryphon, and it's the least expensive Z87 microATX board with ALC1150 sound. Gryphon only has ALC892. It's a good overclocker too. Incidentally it does support SLI but I just consider that an irrelevant feature in any microATX board.

Out of curiosity, what is your PSU?

The ASRock board is not being sold from the same store which currently has the sale on i5 4670k, the extra shipping from a 2nd store will nullify the savings from the sale.

My current PSU is a 500W modular, but I'm gonna replace it due to insane coilwhine.

I think I've gotten past the "SLI IS AWESOME; I NEED IT"-stage... So I guess I'm looking for a board that is a solid/stable overclocker and still within reach economicly.

I've set my "budget" to 408$, that's the price of the gigabyte board and the processor.

My current case was kinda expensive, so not gonna replace it.

 

[lehtv]

What store is that? Link?

 

[bjohansen]

Dustinhome.no

 

[lehtv]

Yeah, grab the Z87MX-D3H. Looks like the best bang for buck

 

[bjohansen]

Is it a stable board? I've never had anything besides Asus, a bit skeptical to new brands.

 

[lehtv]

Yes, it's stable. I don't see why any of the major manufacturers would release a board that isn't stable.

What it comes down to is choosing the board which has the features and price tag that suit you

 

[bjohansen]

It seems to have everything I need. No idea how it overclocks, but it's at least got a heatsink thrown on there

Can't think of any other features I really need. USB 3.0 is more or less standard today.

Edit: Went ahead and ordered the GA-Z87MX-D3H and the I5 4670K. Can't wait for it to arrive
It's my christmas present for myself, so hope it gets here before the 24th.