Need some advice...

[chazdraves]

Well, I just got my 8800GT in the mail the other day and it's made it very clear to me that the old TForce 550 and AMD X2 3600+ simply are not able to keep up with this thing. Basically, I can change any setting in Crysis without seeing any change in frame rate, which leads me to believe the bottleneck is the CPU. Additionally, Quake Wars is not entirely smooth, which I wouldn't think would be the case seeing as it appears to be based on the Doom 3 engine...

Anyhow, I'm looking for the true "bang-for-your-buck" motherboard. Which is the one to have that is truely the best compromise of price and performance? I know with GPU's it's the 8800GT, so basically I'm looking for the 8800GT of motherboards. If anyone wanted to recommend a CPU to go with it, I wouldn't mind hearing that either, but I understand this is the wrong board for that (for reference: I was looking at the 6000+).

As a note: I upgrade about every 1.5 to 2 years, so I want something that will really have some staying power. I'd like to keep it around $100.

Thanks for your time and advice, everyone!
- Chaz

 

[v8envy]

This probably belongs in the CPUs forum. But.

If you're getting a CPU + motherboard together and your budget for both is under $100, AM2+ it is. But once you start thinking AMD 6000+ you're much better off with a much faster core2 CPU for the same budget.

Think Gigabyte DS3L or Abit P35-E ($90ish) motherboard and an E4500 CPU ($120). That should be 6000+ level performance stock, and lots and LOTS more performance once you overclock a bit. For a 2 year lifespan you'll want an E8400 CPU (20-50% faster than a 6400+ stock depending on application, much faster once OCd).

Even the lowest end core2 cpus (E2xxx series) are worlds faster than the most powerful offering from AMD once they are overclocked to 3 ghz. AMD has nothing to match an E8400 at stock clocks, and an overclocked Phenom only keeps up with a 4 ghz overclocked E8400 on a few highly parallel tasks.

Basically AMD cpus are starting to lag a bit today when faced with the newest crop of piggish games like MS flight sim X, UT3 and Crysis and are unlikely to give you the 2 year upgrade cycle you desire. Think more along the lines of budget core2, overclock, upgrade in 6-12 months instead.

 

[cubeless]

r u willing to do a simple overclock?

if u r u could get an ip35-e, some cheap ddr 400, and a $50 e2180 from tiger direct right now (along with any 775 hsf, since the chip is oem) and have a easy, safe, stable 3.2ghz system for under $200 that should be plenty fast for your 8800...

it all just goes up from there...

if u r not oc'ing, then any cheap mobo that has the features u need is fine (they all run at stock), since u will be spending a lot of $$$ on the chip to get that 3.2ghz performance... if u r not oc'ing then the mobo just don't matter much... i have a $118 ecs945/e4500 box that runs at the chip at 2750 (250mhz fsb) with no voltage or other changes... the chip runs at 3.2 on my ip35-e... at 1440x900 with my 8800gts640 and the 4500@2.75ghz it runs everything great... it's just a little better @3.2...

 

[chazdraves]

I see. Well, OC'ing is not a problem, I'm rather comfortable with that. I was afraid I'd hear that the AMD chips still aren't worth it. The only real reason I wanted to stick with an AMD is because I could by a mobo now and wait a bit and then buy the CPU.

v8: I'm not sure if I understood the last sentence. Are you saying you do or don't think that 8400 would last 2 years?

Thanks, guys. I've got my ears open a bit longer here before I make any decisions.
- Chaz

 

[heyheybooboo]

I don't think Crysis is probably your best measurement

But anyway, I think your best $100 shot would be the X2 5400+ 2.8GHz AM2 65W. The HSF from the X2 3600+ should work fine. At stock volts you should hit around 3.2GHz at less than 30c.

That's a nice mobo yah got ... with the right ram you might hit 2.7-2.8 with your 3600+

 

[error8]

Yes, overclock that little 3600+. If it is a Brisbane core you will have fun hitting 3-3,1 ghz. If it isn't, then like heyheybooboo said, you will get around 2.7 ghz. And Crysis will work like crap no matter if you have a x2 3600+ or the latest Quad from Intel.

 

[chazdraves]

Well, I know I've done some tweaking on it before, but I've never gotten it over 2.4... I actually have an aftermarket cooler on it.. I'm spacing on the name of it, but it's one of the big old towers with the 8 heat pipes...

The other thing is I noticed that Newegg lists my CPU as having a 2000MHz HTT, but I know my board only goes up to 1000MHz. Is that basically considered 2GHz because of the dual core? Either way, I know my SuperPi scores are nothing like my buddy's scores with an E4300 overclocked to 3GHz... I've got 2GB of DDR2 667 for RAM, so I think that's keeping up, but it seems like something's lagging behind, and I just figure it must be the CPU/mobo...

Any ideas? Thanks, guys!
- Chaz

 

[chazdraves]

Yeah, I've done a bit of digging and something's definitely tweaked. The highest overclock I can acheive with manual tinkering is 2.23GHz. This allows for the mermory to also be slightly overclocked (744MHz) and for the HTT to be overclocked to about 1100MHz. If I let the auto-overclocking-app built into my BIOS take control, I can get up to 2.37GHz, but the HTT is only 1000MHz and the RAM is actually about 580MHz or so. I've tried voltages up to about 1.6 (1.3 stock) and I get nothing. I can get an FSB of 230 on stock voltages, and higher voltages allow me to hit 235. I can get the darn thing to load windows (black logo loading screen) all the way up to 280, but I can't get windows to load (at all) until 235. Not even 240... I'm totally stumped. I thought the 3600+ and a TForce 550 were the uber combo? I'm guessing it's the mobo, but I don't have a clue why...

On an aside: could a mod please move this to the overclocking forums? This has drifted pretty far from just a mobo conversation. Thanks!

- Chaz

EDIT: Oh! And it is a Brisbane. Super Pi scores are as follows:

Stock 1.9: 1min 51sec.
2.23 GHz: 1min 35sec.
2.37 GHz: 1min 32sec.

 

[fk49]

I have the same board and I have my old single core o/c past what you're getting with ease. Don't use the auto-overclock -- it'll give a 30% overclock maximum.
It sounds more like you're neglecting to turn down your RAM and HT multipliers as you increase the FSB. Try turning your memory down to the DDR2 533 or 400 divider and the HT to the 4x or 3x multiplier. And make sure cool and quiet is off..it'll cause bootup problems if you're heavily overclocked.

 

[Tempered81]

ip35-e at the egg
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...-_-ABIT+USA-_-13127031
$69.99

intel E2160 at e-wiz
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php...281a5758bb5453c573aa29
$61.00

Overclock this setup and you should be fine with any graphics card.

 

[chazdraves]

Originally posted by: fk49
I have the same board and I have my old single core o/c past what you're getting with ease. Don't use the auto-overclock -- it'll give a 30% overclock maximum.
It sounds more like you're neglecting to turn down your RAM and HT multipliers as you increase the FSB. Try turning your memory down to the DDR2 533 or 400 divider and the HT to the 4x or 3x multiplier. And make sure cool and quiet is off..it'll cause bootup problems if you're heavily overclocked.

That's just it... it doesn't make any difference. I cannot get into Windows past 235 unless I set it down to 1X HTT and DDR400. At these settings, I can get to Windows at 250MHz, but that leaves me with 2.37 which is the same as the auto-overclock except I don't have the HTT and DDR speeds that the auto achieves. It's not that I'm relying on the auto-overclocker, it's just that that ah heck seems to get higher speeds than I can tune out of the motherboard even with the same exact settings.

Is it something to do with the BIOS revision? I don't have a floppy drive, so I've never updated that... But the board is only 5 months old or so... Is there some obvious setting elsewhere in the BIOS that needs to be disabled/enabled? I know when I had an E4300, there was something that needed to be disabled to get past 2.4GHz (after which I made 3.2).

To jaredpace: I'll check out those links right now, thanks!

- Chaz

 

[scheibler1]

I was in the same situation as you. I picked these components:

E2180 $80 @ newegg...E2160 will overclock just as good, I'm actually using the 9x multiplier that comes with the e2160
Gigabyte P35-DS3L-$85 @ newegg

and I am using the msi 8800gt oc

Overclocking the cpu is so easy with that setup...there is even a guide here on the forum of how to do it. I have my chip running @ 3ghz (333x9 w/2.4 ram multi, 1.39v in bios)right now on stock cooling with temps idling @ 30-40 degrees and the very highest temps I've got under load was 60. I could probly lower the voltage, but it is stable so I'm not messing with it! I have an arctic cooling freezer 7 pro arriving friday that should get me even further.

 

[nerp]

I built a new system just today (whee!) and can attest to the amazing OC ability of the E2180. I've got it at 320FSB @ 10 multi = 3.2ghz with memory running at DDR2-800 at 1.8v. I've got a Tuniq Tower on there, keeping my 1.36 volted E2180 at a chilly 30C at idle and only about 55C when ORTHOS is pegging it in SFF test.

If I turn on c1e and speedstep, etc, it automaticaly downclocks to a x6 multi to about 1.8ghz and the voltage drops to 1.2 or so and temps at idle dwindle to 24-26C.

Love this rig. At 3.2ghz it destroys my dual opty.

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: chazdraves
EDIT: Oh! And it is a Brisbane. Super Pi scores are as follows:

Stock 1.9: 1min 51sec.
2.23 GHz: 1min 35sec.
2.37 GHz: 1min 32sec.

There's something seriously wrong with your system. My A64 4000 only takes 35.7 sec. @ stock speed, and my 1.2 Ghz Celeron-M takes just a hair over a minute @ 1.2 Ghz. Clear your BIOS, then try overclocking again.

 

[Tempered81]

Originally posted by: myocardia

Originally posted by: chazdraves
EDIT: Oh! And it is a Brisbane. Super Pi scores are as follows:

Stock 1.9: 1min 51sec.
2.23 GHz: 1min 35sec.
2.37 GHz: 1min 32sec.

There's something seriously wrong with your system. My A64 4000 only takes 35.7 sec. @ stock speed, and my 1.2 Ghz Celeron-M takes just a hair over a minute @ 1.2 Ghz. Clear your BIOS, then try overclocking again.

he didn't say 1mb, 2mb or which version of sPI... kinda relative to the results

 

[Erock]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16819115037

 

[chazdraves]

I did space with the SuperPi scores... It's version 1.1, and the calculations were 2M.

In the effort to OC, I've had to wipe the BIOS settings many times, so it shouldn't be that...

That 2180 looks like a good deal, I may have to look into it. I think the 8400 is a bit unreasonable for me at this time

- Chaz