New computer time

[P2Mc28]

From the NOTICE thread:

1. Going to be used for gaming.

2. Aiming for $1,500-$1,750 (sans monitors), but my taxes weren't nearly as high as I thought so I might just push that a bit further

3. Probably doing most of my purchasing via NewEgg.

4. I'm currently building an Intel/Nvidia machine.

5. Pretty much just reusing my optical drive (and monitor for now).

6. I haven't looked up a lot, but I have read up on the parts I've listed and, pending new insight here, will most likely be getting them.

7. I plan to overclock, but I'm not going to be pushing the system to it's limits.


Mobo:
MSI P7N Diamond LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 780i w/SoundBlaster X-Fi Extreme Audio
CPU:
Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz
GPU:
MSI NX8800GT 512M OC GeForce 8800GT 512MB 256-bit
Memory:
Patriot Viper 4GB(2 x 2GB) DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500)
HDD:
Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 250GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s

That puts me at about $935 before shipping/taxes assuming those prices stay (I'm betting the E8400 is going to climb a bit before I'm able to find it anywhere)

Few things I was looking for help on:
How much power should I be aiming for? I don't see me running SLI in the near future.
Can someone point me to a few nice cases? Full tower + ventilation = win.
Is there much/any benefit to upgrading from 8800gt to 8800gts?
Thoughts on HDD? I currently run an 80gb drive and it suits me just fine. I basically just need room to install games and hold the entirety of OCRemix's collection. lol.

Lastly - I'm going to be giving Vista a shot, but I've got WinXP64 as well.

 

[chinaman1472]

Not running SLi and getting an SLi motherboard?! Save yourself the $150 bucks and get a simple P35 chipset - Abit IP35-E for $60 or the Gigabyte P35-DS3L for $90.
G.Skill 4GB DDR2-800 for $85 is a better deal. Since you're not going to be pushing it to the limits, it's unlikely you'll ever see a 533mhz FSB for your CPU.
Corsair 620HX is probably the highest you should go. Even the Corsair 450VX should be enough for you.
Antec 900/P180/P182/SonataIII are all good choices. Cooler Master 690 is also a decent case if you find it on sale (not worth $60+ imo).
You get a few more frames out of the 8800GTS. It's up to you whether you think the price is worth the extra performance, take a look at some benchmarks to see.
You're fine on the HDD with 250GB, if 80GB is more than enough.

 

[MarcVenice]

What is it that you need on the mobo ? Do you need firewire/esata/wifi ? If so a abit ip35-e or ds3l won't cut it. You should definately drop the 780i mobo though, and get something cheaper. This is a nice mobo btw, for a good price: http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/...7195&prodlist=celebros

That patriot ram runs at a pretty high voltage. I'd rather get this http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820231145 or the same kit, but then ddr2 800mhz, for 85$ like chinaman said.

Case, why a fulltower ? You don't need THAT much space. I could second the p182 http://www.newegg.com/Product/...2E16811129025&Tpk=p182, got one myself, love it to death. Antec 900 if you want more of a blingy look. If you insist on full tower, then I suggest you check this thread: http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2165186&enterthread=y it's said to be a full tower for a very good price. Don't know to many other full towers though, so perhaps ask on the cases and cooling forum. Oh, and personaly I like the looks of thise case as well: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16811112155 with a removable mobo tray.

PSU, corsair 520hx, coz it's modular. Many people who get modular never want something non-modular again. You can get one here for a good price: http://www.buy.com/prod/corsai...loc/101/203270716.html If you haven't used it allready, use the google checkout, 80$ and free shipping is a very good price.

HDD is fine, double the money gets you 3 times the space though, and it's a fair bit faster, cooler and quieter running HD as well: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16822152100 Just a suggestion I had to make

 

[P2Mc28]

Alright, seems I worded my intentions a bit weakly. I do intend to overclock - I'm just not going to go crazy, pushing voltages thru the roof trying to find that maximum stable overclock.

While I do not intend to run SLi right off the bat, or maybe even a few months from now, I do intend to run it one day. If the life of my current PC is any indication, I'm going to have this system for a long time, and I want to keep upgrade options open.

When I first put all those components together, I was planning on running everything 1:1 on a 1333 FSB - but as I sit here typing this out I am suddenly aware that 1333 sounds like something only DDR3 can reach. I've been out of the loop too long /sigh. So... what should my approach to this be?

As for why full tower? I like the room. My current system is a full tower. I like having the air flow, and I don't like the cramped claustrophobic feeling of a mid tower. BUT... I just looked thru all of the full towers on NewEgg... and they all make me cry. I hate doors. 99.5% of those full towers have doors. Why do they bug me so? Cuz I love my PC Transpo. That being said, I DO like that p182, very clean, nice fan-age... however the door simply would have to come off (ah - the door folds flush with the side? That should be just fine then.) And after looking around NewEgg for an hour or so... I think I just might pick that one up.

Argh! The case has so far been the most frustrating part ever... lol.


However, right now my biggest concern is memory. I will be getting either the e8400 or e8500 (leaning very heavily towards e8400 judging on availability + climbing prices). What should I do in order to get the most out of this chip? Again, I do want to overclock.

Edit: Forgot to give my thanks for the input thus far - has been helpful and finally got me really thinking and moving forward towards finalizing all this! New computer time! *excited*

 

[imported_wired247]

but as I sit here typing this out I am suddenly aware that 1333 sounds like something only DDR3 can reach. I've been out of the loop too long /sigh. So... what should my approach to this be?

no no no


Let me make this simple for you

DDR2-800 will do FSB 1600 (400* x 4). at 1:1 your e8400 CPU will be running at 3.6GHz (400* x 9)
DDR2-1066 will do FSB 2132 (533* x 4). at 1:1 your e8400 CPU will be running at 4.8GHz (533* x 9)

* = "actual" system FSB. The "x 4" and "x 9" indicate how many data transfers the RAM and the CPU do per "actual system clock cycle" respectively. That is why DDR2-800 runs at 400MHz actual, and 1600MHz effective. 400x4.

Now "not pushing the system to the limits" means you definitely won't be going to 4.8GHz so skip the DDR2-1066.

DDR3 will go even beyond this, which is why you definitely don't need it.



My suggestion is to get DDR2-800 and overclock the e8400 to 3.6GHz. You will have a happy healthy low voltage and FAST system. I'm even doing it on the stock cooler but I wouldn't necessarily tell everyone to do what I did.

As for the rest, I would tell you to get 2x9600GT's in SLI if you want to do SLI, or for a little more money 2x8800GT's

You can start with 1 card if you wish, but it's best just to decide on it NOW or just get a
non-SLI mobo.


This case will kick ass, plenty of cooling, have tons of room inside for the biggest video cards (much bigger than most mid towers), has all the IO ports you could want, has a removable mobo tray, excellent cable routing inside, has the best HD mounting solution I've seen, and no door.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16811112154

 

[P2Mc28]

Originally posted by: wired247
DDR2-800 will do FSB 1600 (400* x 4). at 1:1 your e8400 CPU will be running at 3.6GHz (400* x 9)
DDR2-1066 will do FSB 2132 (533* x 4). at 1:1 your e8400 CPU will be running at 4.8GHz (533* x 9)

So basically, higher FSBs are better suited for CPUs with lower/unlocked multipliers, huh?

And damn, I had my multiplier off, I was thinking 1333MHz was 666.5 * 2 - bah, thanks for straightening all that out tho, feel much better about getting DDR2 800

 

[sacco20]

If willing to spend that much on a CPU why not go Quad core?

 

[P2Mc28]

e8500 Review
Intel has also worked hard to make all of this performance affordable. Many US retailers now stock the 65nm Q6600 quad-core CPU at less than $200, which places it squarely in the 45nm dual-core price range - something to think about as you make your next purchasing decision. However, if it comes down to the choice between a 65nm and 45nm CPU we would pick the latter every time - they are just that good.

With the prices on the e8400 scaling up so high maybe I will go with the quad - but so long as I can get it for under $300 I think I'm going to stick with the Wolfdale.

 

[Roguestar]

Drop the "SLI as an upgrade" idea; the money you save now on not buying an SLI-compatible board and the money you'd spend later buying another card, combined, will buy you a single card that will beat the SLI in a year's time (or whenever).

 

[theYipster]

The P7N is a great board, but getting an SLI motherboard so that you can upgrade to a second card in the future is a terrible idea and a foolish waste of money. By the time you are ready to get that second card, a newer single card solution will inevitably be out that will offer better performance than two of your older cards in SLI. Cost isn't much of an argument either, as you can mitigate the difference between a new card and a second older card by selling the original. By keeping to one card, you keep to a simpler, cooler running system (which is always a plus.) Furthermore, you have more (and arguably much better) motherboard options at your disposal.

SLI is worth considering only under limited circumstances. If you're gaming at a resolution of 1920x1200 and can afford to get two cards now, then it will prove to be of benefit. Otherwise, it isn't worth consideration. An Intel board and one graphics card will serve your needs perfectly well, and you will avoid many of the potential headaches SLI brings to the table.

 

[P2Mc28]

Alright - thanks a lot for everyone's input. Has been very helpful!

I'm off to do more research!

 

[Ika]

Guys, I wouldn't be so sure on the "drop the SLI idea". A year or two ago I would've heartily seconded the recommendation, but with the state of things in the GPU world now... who knows. The 8800 architecture is getting really long in the tooth, and probably won't run the next generation of games well at all (heck, they barely run this generation of games). It won't be like the 7800 or 6800 series, which both ran well for probably 2 years after the next gen was released. If he gets an 8800GT(S) now, he might not be satisfied with performance when the tail end of 2008 comes around and the next batch of games come out. Unless GT200 really rocks the GPU world, SLI might be a pretty good idea.

Just thought I'd give my 2c and play devil's advocate

 

[chinaman1472]

I don't know about that. Until SLi shows huge performance gains, I'm still with the idea that money saved from a cheaper motherboard and the second video card months later would be better off spent on a newer card that would likely beat the SLi performance. If he wants to SLi in the future, he is tied down to buying another 8800GT or shelling out [big] bucks for 2 new video cards.

Even at a more expensive motherboard, say $150 price range, that's about $70 he can save. Let's say he gets an 8800GT at $190 right now, and months later the 8800GT price drops to $150 (continuing a typical trend of a $40 price drop over 4 months, which is probably an overestimate), that totals to $220. So, months later, he has the option to spend $150 to get another 8800GT for SLi, or to spend $220+ on any card of his choice. At a cheaper motherboard, he has upwards to $280-300. On top of that, he has a spare 8800GT which he can either sell for even more cash towards a newer video card, use in another machine, or even give away to a buddy.

I'd gamble my money that a $300 card at the end of 2008 will probably outperform 8800GT SLi.

 

[imported_wired247]

Anyone coming in here saying they want to spend $1500 on a rig, absolutely go with SLi. why not.

Just because they can save money, doesn't mean they want to. It's their money to spend, and IMO the budget is the determining factor here.

Just because it's not necessarily DOUBLE the fps doesn't mean it isn't a huge performance gain.

 

[chinaman1472]

True that, but spending $1500 doesn't necessarily mean they want to have SLi either .

 

[imported_wired247]

Originally posted by: chinaman1472
True that, but spending $1500 doesn't necessarily mean they want to have SLi either .

yep... I spent a bit more than that just to get a decent raid setup