New Epic Store Opened Up

[paperfist]

It's not new. Use taxes have existed right along with sales tax. It has nothing to do with the company you purchase from and whether or not they have representation. If you don't pay sales tax on an item (say, by literally visiting a state such as Delaware that doesn't charge sales tax), you owe it in use tax instead.

I know use tax isn't new, but NYS just started charging this tax on digital game sales and my domain email. I never said it was Steam's fault or Epic's fault, I'm just staying it wasn't charged before and it's for items you don't even own literally in every sense of the word as it's just a bunch of 1001001s...

Sale tax never used to work the way you are saying, that's why people bought from newegg, ebay, amazon, went to another state to buy a boat or a car because it was never enforced until recently.

 

[JujuFish]

I know use tax isn't new, but NYS just started charging this tax on digital game sales and my domain email. I never said it was Steam's fault or Epic's fault, I'm just staying it wasn't charged before and it's for items you don't even own literally in every sense of the word as it's just a bunch of 1001001s...

Sale tax never used to work the way you are saying, that's why people bought from newegg, ebay, amazon, went to another state to buy a boat or a car because it was never enforced until recently.

Use tax has always worked that way, and the reason you're seeing more and more states trying to pass sales tax laws for the Internet is because people don't pay their use tax like they're supposed to, so governments are losing out on billions of dollars. Now theyre forcing the companies to collect sales tax instead of trusting citizens to pay their use taxes.

None of that changes the fact that you have always owed those taxes.

 

[zink77]

MMO is not just a marketing term, it is a type of game.

No it isn't, it was just a way to deceive people like you into giving up ownership rights and covering up the drm and adding a subscription. That's why PC rpg's in development were rebranded mmo's... notice how ultima RPG's stopped being released once internet was fast enough to release ultima online.

The fact that private servers exist for both Ultima online and world of warcraft disprove your thesis.

 

[SMOGZINN]

No it isn't, it was just a way to deceive people like you into giving up ownership rights and covering up the drm and adding a subscription. That's why PC rpg's in development were rebranded mmo's... notice how ultima RPG's stopped being released once internet was fast enough to release ultima online.

The fact that private servers exist for both Ultima online and world of warcraft disprove your thesis.

I'm sorry, but you are wrong, and quite frankly the fact that you think a MMO is just a RPG with DRM tells me clearly that you are in that area where you think you know much more than you actually do.

I can tell you that MMOs and RPGs don't play the same. I've never ran the same dungeon 300+ times in a traditional RPG. MMOs are not about running quests. They are social games. They are about social dynamics. I played hundreds of hours of WoW, Everquest, and DAoC, and I don't think I can tell you more then the most basic story elements of any of them, because it did not matter, it was about the people I was playing with.
I've also played literally thousands of hours of MUDs like AustinMUD and StrangeMUD, and those don't even charge you to play so they obviously were not about 'deceive people like you into giving up ownership rights', because they were community built and maintained.

And once again, the fact that private servers exist tells us nothing. Those private servers were garbage. Few people ever played on them because they were not good. The company ran servers added a ton of value to the game, that is why people paid for them. There are multiplayer mods for single player RPGs as well as MMOs that allow private servers. Look at what games like 7 Days to Die is doing. That kind of blows your concept of MMOs are just RPG DRM out of the water, doesn't it?

 

[DrMrLordX]

notice how ultima RPG's stopped being released once internet was fast enough to release ultima online.

Ultima? Are you kidding? The last two entries in that series were terrible. There were a few fans but not enough to save the franchise. OSI had to sell its soul to EA to stay alive. Ultima Online was the only thing left from OSI making any money, so of course they stopped development of games in the Ultima series.

It's probably for the best that they killed off Ultima Nothing they did approached the quality of Black Gate or Serpent Isle. LB has gone partly mad, trapped between insanity and whatever bizarre dimension is now occupied by Peter Molyneux. I don't think it'll be possible for a series reboot (unlike Bard's Tale that has been rebooted twice).

 

[BSim500]

The Division 2 will be on Epic store (and uPlay) but not Steam:-
https://www.theverge.com/2019/1/9/18174004/the-division-2-ubisoft-epic-game-store-launch

 

[nakedfrog]

Hm, I guess it's convenient that I decided to go for the Subnautica freebie, since I'll have a copy of The Division 2 coming to me from my GPU purchase.

 

[Aikouka]

I can tell you that MMOs and RPGs don't play the same. I've never ran the same dungeon 300+ times in a traditional RPG. MMOs are not about running quests. They are social games. They are about social dynamics. I played hundreds of hours of WoW, Everquest, and DAoC, and I don't think I can tell you more then the most basic story elements of any of them, because it did not matter, it was about the people I was playing with.

It's sad to say, but I feel like you're talking about the past at this point. MMOs seem to care to focus more on quick, bite-sized content, and conveniences that forgo the idea of social. What's worse is that this sort of gaming conditions people to expect these aspects in their games. So, the idea that you can't just queue for some dungeon and get put in a group in insane. I think MMO developers forget that their game being a living world is what gets people addicted and coming back... and dailies do not a living world make!

Hm, I guess it's convenient that I decided to go for the Subnautica freebie, since I'll have a copy of The Division 2 coming to me from my GPU purchase.

It'll likely just be a uPlay key.

 

[DrMrLordX]

I think MMO developers forget that their game being a living world is what gets people addicted and coming back... and dailies do not a living world make!

That just replaced solo/small group content and prevented people from having to compete over spawns. Raid content is still very much the same, though not all games have raid timers.

 

[Aikouka]

That just replaced solo/small group content and prevented people from having to compete over spawns. Raid content is still very much the same, though not all games have raid timers.

I'm not trying to suggest that it's just dailies that are the problem in these games. Albeit, I do think repetitive content like that is boring, but that's another problem in and of itself. The problem is adding in convenience features that look good on the outside, but you realize that they end up making it so you don't really have to talk to anyone. WoW sort of went from being like Cheers -- where everyone knows your name -- to a quasi-solo experience.

 

[DrMrLordX]

I'm not trying to suggest that it's just dailies that are the problem in these games. Albeit, I do think repetitive content like that is boring, but that's another problem in and of itself. The problem is adding in convenience features that look good on the outside, but you realize that they end up making it so you don't really have to talk to anyone. WoW sort of went from being like Cheers -- where everyone knows your name -- to a quasi-solo experience.

That is true, to an extent. I haven't played MMOs seriously in a long while (probably won't be going back, either) so I do not know from personal experience. It does seem that games like ESO, SWTOR, and even WoW have stronger solo content than MMOs from days of yore. There's good and bad to that. The good part is that you don't have to deal with anyone else if you don't want to, at least not cooperatively (and some folks have been like that since the 90s. I knew a few dedicated soloers). The bad part is, as you say, the sense of community is shattered. Hell, in WoW, you don't even really have dedicated servers anymore. There's no telling what server you're on when queuing for a 5-man. Barrens chat is basically dead.

Now it's all about having a friends list to connect to people and play with them in groups, instead of being forced to deal with whoever happened to be available at your level. Many players got fed-up fighting over spawns or getting stuck LFG which is why things are the way they are now with instance queuing and the like.

 

[Aikouka]

That is true, to an extent. I haven't played MMOs seriously in a long while (probably won't be going back, either) so I do not know from personal experience. It does seem that games like ESO, SWTOR, and even WoW have stronger solo content than MMOs from days of yore. There's good and bad to that. The good part is that you don't have to deal with anyone else if you don't want to, at least not cooperatively (and some folks have been like that since the 90s. I knew a few dedicated soloers). The bad part is, as you say, the sense of community is shattered. Hell, in WoW, you don't even really have dedicated servers anymore. There's no telling what server you're on when queuing for a 5-man. Barrens chat is basically dead.

Now it's all about having a friends list to connect to people and play with them in groups, instead of being forced to deal with whoever happened to be available at your level. Many players got fed-up fighting over spawns or getting stuck LFG which is why things are the way they are now with instance queuing and the like.

To a degree, I think even Vanilla WoW has a nice balance of solo vs. group content. The nice part is that you didn't usually have to do the group content to proceed to something else, which was nice in case you had trouble finding other people. This is unlike FFXIV where the MSQ takes you into plenty of dungeons and you cannot proceed until that's done. I actually ran into issues with that a few times when I was playing later at night, and I couldn't find a group for a dungeon.

I do think spawns could sometimes be an issue, but I wonder how much of that was left in intentionally to try to get players to group? When I tried the WoW Classic demo, I just used the old Vanilla quest technique... invite whoever you see doing the quest. When you do this, chances are you'll end up with a group of people that are on the same chain as you, and you can all end up doing it together. I think the spawns became a bit of a problem when players sort of lost the mindset of grouping, and then Blizzard removed the concept of tagging (within your faction). Of course, if an area was popular, spawns were an issue there regardless as you were limited to five people per group -- as most quests could not be completed in a raid -- and consequently, you ended up with groups fighting against each other for tags.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Spawns were a big problem in early products like EQ where certain zones would get so crowded that individuals and groups were fighting over mobs as soon as they would pop. There were spawn camping issues in FFXI as well.