Official Terri Schiavo Thread

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CaptnKirk

Lifer
Jul 25, 2002
10,053
0
71
Stick it bone head - 'Besides, it's unusual for someone that young to have a heart attack.'
You can tell it to his widow.
He was 41 years old last September, and had just returned from riding a bicycle with his 15 year old son.

I have seen many people die from heart attacks, some only in their 20's, coronary failure - HEART ATTACKS know no age limit, nor cares to define some little stupid semanic wording.

High School athletes, college players - there are hundreds each year that die from cardiac arrest, which is a TYPE OF HEART ATTACK.

Go play in traffic until you learn to grow up and not get stuck on 'wordmanship',
Heart Attack is a coloquial phrase that means ANY malfunction associated with the heart that leads to trauma of the organism, some - but not all are fatal.

Let me clear something up for you about drowning - my wife's brother and his wife have been the caretakers for 8 years now, for a boy who drown when he was 2.
This 10 year old is PVS - non responsive. He lays where they put him and stares blankly at whatever is in front of him. He doesn't laugh, he doesn't cry, he lays there like a sack of potatoes and stares. They feed him soft foods and water - he doesn't
swallow, just a little substance - slowly, and let it slide down the throat without choking him.
They clean him up, change him, & take him to the doctor each and every week for 'evaluation'. He's about as responsive as a grapefruit with eyes.
Go up and look into those eyes - dialated pools of ink, you can't tell if he has blue, green, brown, or hazel eyes - they don't work.
Does he think ? Probably not, what do the scans tell ? Random synapses firing at anything - anywhere with no rhyme or reason. He will never improve.
He is alive in the sense that moss is alive and growing on the North side of a rock.
Do you think that's a fair lot to this boy ?
I don't want that for myself or my family, and neither do my wife & kids.
We've seen it point blank in front of us. It isn't pretty.
 

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Stick it bone head - 'Besides, it's unusual for someone that young to have a heart attack.'
You can tell it to his widow.
He was 41 years old last September, and had just returned from riding a bicycle with his 15 year old son.

I have seen many people die from heart attacks, some only in their 20's, coronary failure - HEART ATTACKS know no age limit, nor cares to define some little stupid semanic wording.

High School athletes, college players - there are hundreds each year that die from cardiac arrest, which is a TYPE OF HEART ATTACK.

Go play in traffic until you learn to grow up and not get stuck on 'wordmanship',
Heart Attack is a coloquial phrase that means ANY malfunction associated with the heart that leads to trauma of the organism, some - but not all are fatal.

Let me clear something up for you about drowning - my wife's brother and his wife have been the caretakers for 8 years now, for a boy who drown when he was 2.
This 10 year old is PVS - non responsive. He lays where they put him and stares blankly at whatever is in front of him. He doesn't laugh, he doesn't cry, he lays there like a sack of potatoes and stares. They feed him soft foods and water - he doesn't
swallow, just a little substance - slowly, and let it slide down the throat without choking him.
They clean him up, change him, & take him to the doctor each and every week for 'evaluation'. He's about as responsive as a grapefruit with eyes.
Go up and look into those eyes - dialated pools of ink, you can't tell if he has blue, green, brown, or hazel eyes - they don't work.
Does he think ? Probably not, what do the scans tell ? Random synapses firing at anything - anywhere with no rhyme or reason. He will never improve.
He is alive in the sense that moss is alive and growing on the North side of a rock.
Do you think that's a fair lot to this boy ?
I don't want that for myself or my family, and neither do my wife & kids.
We've seen it point blank in front of us. It isn't pretty.
I didn't say that it never happens. I just said that it's unusual, meaning it rarely happens.
She was 27 years old at the time--not 41. And no, cardiac arrest is not a type of heart attack. It's the converse. Read the American Heart Association's article. They said it there directly.

Frankly, that kid's case is irrelevant. I do not know the facts of the case there. However, what I do know is that Terri's medical chart indicates that she does moan and laugh for one. Even the GAL's report concedes that she does moan and laugh. The only question is whether or not she does it randomly (i.e., not as a result of her thought process) as alleged by some.
 

HeaterCore

Senior member
Dec 22, 2004
442
0
0
Try reading, genius. He's talking about his friend who died recently. Or did you think he was referring to Terri Schiavo's 15-year-old-daughter?

-HC-
 

CaptnKirk

Lifer
Jul 25, 2002
10,053
0
71
You have pretty much proved that you don't know diddly squat - so I'm through debating with you.
You can join Rip in Conservative Issue Hell.
 

Originally posted by: HeaterCore
Try reading, genius. He's talking about his friend who died recently. Or did you think he was referring to Terri Schiavo's 15-year-old-daughter?

-HC-
Maybe you should read carefully? He was talking about a 41 year old man who died of a heart attack. Terri was not 41 years old. A 41 year old having a heart attack isn't as mystifying or uncommon as a 27 year old having a heart attack. And then with anecdotes he says that hundreds of high school athletes have heart attacks every year. Then he went on to talk about a kid who was diagnosed PVS. I don't know what's complicated there.

Edit: Oops! I meant to say a 26 year old, since Terri was 26 at the time.
 

Abraxas

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2004
1,056
0
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Why is Michael Sciavo's attorney so eager to point out that there are flowers in the room, soft music, and a teddy tucked under Terri's arrm?

Why not give her what she really needs, FOOD AND WATER.

Because of people like you who want to make him out to be a merciless, pitiless killer bent on seeing his wife die. That is why he is "eager" to show that he is doing everything he can to provide peace and tranquility to this woman.

Because she doesn't need food and water, food and water cannot do her any good. As someone of religious persuasion, I would think you of all people would think she needs to be with God now.

EDIT: Major typo
 
Jan 17, 2005
154
0
0
Originally posted by: Ozoned
Originally posted by: totalcommand
Originally posted by: Ozoned
Originally posted by: mithrandir2001
Originally posted by: Ozoned
The best scientific evidence once indicated that the world was flat and the sun revolved around the earth.
So what's the alternative? Religious "evidence" such as the laughable claim that the Earth is only 10,000 years old?
No.
A conservative approach is in order, if there is any gray area between the boundaries of the issue. I personally am ok with the husband and family resolving the issue within the scope of what the current legal system, affords to them. However, I also believe that people that try to justify their support in one direction or another by saying that they know definitively what is going on in the mind of Terry Schiavo are being less than Intellectually honest...


There is no grey area. Her cerebral cortex is gone, replaced by spinal fluid.
The day before the day that the first person recieved a dose of anti-biotics, there was no cure for bacterial infection, other than the immune system.


Uhhh I don't think science is going to figure out a way to regrow your cortex anytime soon... and even if they could your cortex essentially houses who you are so terri as you know her would have to start from the beginning
 

CaptnKirk

Lifer
Jul 25, 2002
10,053
0
71
Even if you rule out the 'brain' function - look at the crippled non-functional body.
In sixteen years her legs and arms had atrophied away to essentially useless appendages that there was nothing to have control over.

In every way - except breathing, she left this planet in Feburary of 1991 -
when Daddy Bush was in his first year . . .

She was 26.

No more functionally alive than lichen.
 

You all still refuse to read the direct (official) hospital summary discharge, but here's an excerpt of it eliminating a heart attack:

"The rest of the chemistries revealed LDH 376, SGOT 95, calcium 7.4, inorganic phosphorus 7.1, uric acid 8.6, albumin 2.0 and total protein 4.1, suggestive of some malnutrition. Total CPK did go up to 4,000, but isoenzymes were less than 2 percent. Serial CPK and other enzymes did not reveal evidence of myocardial infarction. Compliment studies were within normal range."

The website that has the document is down at the moment, so I used the my cacked copy. Was the hospital mistaken? :roll: I would think Michael would sue them for malpractice if they were.
 

Abraxas

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2004
1,056
0
0
Out of curiosity, does it really matter if it was a heart attack or cardiac arrest?
 

Originally posted by: Abraxas
Out of curiosity, does it really matter if it was a heart attack or cardiac arrest?
Yes it does matter. It matters because a cardiac arrest that is not due to a heart attack leaves open the possibility of many causes. As per the American Heart Association, here are other causes of cardiac arrest:

"Other factors besides heart disease and heart attack can cause cardiac arrest. They include respiratory arrest, electrocution, drowning, choking and trauma. Cardiac arrest can also occur without any known cause."

It gives rise to an investigation.
 

jhu

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
11,918
9
81
Originally posted by: DearQT
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Wait a minute !

here's something from your last post:
Secondly, news sources does not mean correct information. For instance, I was watching CNN yesterday on "Who was Terry Schiavo?" Well, I noted that they gave a false information that Terry Schiavo had a heart attack, which she didn't! It immediately made me question other information, in spite of how little the details,

When just about everyone in the entire world, Doctors, Lawyers, Judges, and her family agree that she had a HEART-ATTACK, where did you get the impression that she didn't ?
What is your source for this assumption ? Do you think that she just is faking the PVS ?
No, the official report is that she had a cardiac arrest. Read linked hospital discharge summary.

Originally posted by: jhu
Originally posted by: umbrella39
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Fyi. Michael Schiavo should be investigated. E-mail the Coroner's Office and insist on an autopsy so we can find out the truth.


If Terri ultimately dies, it is the publically stated intention of Michael Schiavo to have her immediately cremated. The Pinellas County Medical Examiner's office (District 6) would need to certify such cremation.

review the policy Link

The Medical Examiner should NOT do so if there is a question about the proximate cause of her death (or face adverse licensing action in Florida).

For future reference, though I hope it need not be used any time soon, the email for the Coroner's office is mailto:wpellan@co.pinellas.fl.us.

Should Terri die, everyone must immediately demand a waiver of certification for cremation and an investigation, including autopsy to determine proximate (and immediate) cause of death. Since Dr. Baden (forensic pathologist) believes the injuries are not consistent with Michael Schiavo's story, an autopsy would perhaps develop evidence that would put Michael Schiavo behind bars, and perhaps "retire" the miserable excuse of a judge, George Greer.

Link


MS has already odered an autopsy upon her death. Next baseless allegation....

also don't forget that the forensic pathologist, after knowing the full history, says the injuries are consistent with falling and resuscitation.
Huh? Could you cite your source? What forensic pathologist said that without examining her?

riprorin had posted a story about how a forensic pathologist, dr. baden, had suggested trauma as the cause of schiavo's condition: link. this was in 10/2003.

however, in a later interview, he acknowledges that bulemia with subsequent hypokalemia is the cause of her condition. this was in 2/2005. link
 

PatboyX

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2001
7,024
0
0
DearQT is coming up with so many evil scenerios its making my head spin. and somehow finds the time to respond to all those who are questioning the logic...
however, i still have yet to see anyone respond to the prevailing idea that no one can figure out what the husband stands to gain if this really is such a dirty trick on his part...
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
Originally posted by: jhu
Originally posted by: DearQT
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Wait a minute !

here's something from your last post:
Secondly, news sources does not mean correct information. For instance, I was watching CNN yesterday on "Who was Terry Schiavo?" Well, I noted that they gave a false information that Terry Schiavo had a heart attack, which she didn't! It immediately made me question other information, in spite of how little the details,

When just about everyone in the entire world, Doctors, Lawyers, Judges, and her family agree that she had a HEART-ATTACK, where did you get the impression that she didn't ?
What is your source for this assumption ? Do you think that she just is faking the PVS ?
No, the official report is that she had a cardiac arrest. Read linked hospital discharge summary.

Originally posted by: jhu
Originally posted by: umbrella39
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Fyi. Michael Schiavo should be investigated. E-mail the Coroner's Office and insist on an autopsy so we can find out the truth.


If Terri ultimately dies, it is the publically stated intention of Michael Schiavo to have her immediately cremated. The Pinellas County Medical Examiner's office (District 6) would need to certify such cremation.

review the policy Link

The Medical Examiner should NOT do so if there is a question about the proximate cause of her death (or face adverse licensing action in Florida).

For future reference, though I hope it need not be used any time soon, the email for the Coroner's office is mailto:wpellan@co.pinellas.fl.us.

Should Terri die, everyone must immediately demand a waiver of certification for cremation and an investigation, including autopsy to determine proximate (and immediate) cause of death. Since Dr. Baden (forensic pathologist) believes the injuries are not consistent with Michael Schiavo's story, an autopsy would perhaps develop evidence that would put Michael Schiavo behind bars, and perhaps "retire" the miserable excuse of a judge, George Greer.

Link


MS has already odered an autopsy upon her death. Next baseless allegation....

also don't forget that the forensic pathologist, after knowing the full history, says the injuries are consistent with falling and resuscitation.
Huh? Could you cite your source? What forensic pathologist said that without examining her?

riprorin had posted a story about how a forensic pathologist, dr. baden, had suggested trauma as the cause of schiavo's condition: link. this was in 10/2003.

however, in a later interview, he acknowledges that bulemia with subsequent hypokalemia is the cause of her condition. this was in 2/2005. link

Just watched an interview with Dr. Baden last night. That's not what he said.
 

Abraxas

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2004
1,056
0
0
Begging your pardon but that is exactly what he said in this interview.

BADEN: Yes. No. What's interesting about what Mr. Fox is saying, there were lots of diets, especially many years ago, that had bizarre dietary eating habits and got electrolytes mixed up, as Mr. Fox said, mostly the potassium. If you got too high potassium or too low potassium, then the heart stops...

VAN SUSTEREN: And that's what happened.

BADEN: But it's not from a hardening of the arteries. It stops the heart. If there's not enough blood going to the brain for five minutes because of the heart stoppage, then it causes permanent brain damage.
 

preCRT

Platinum Member
Apr 12, 2000
2,340
123
106
Don't waste your time arguing with rip or luvly, neither one is capable of admitting when they are wrong nor capable of seeing the truth.
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
Originally posted by: preCRT
Don't waste your time arguing with rip or luvly, neither one is capable of admitting when they are wrong nor capable of seeing the truth.

Still wondering why Schiavo's attorney argues that Terri is a "vegetable" and then boasts that her room is filled with flowers and soft music and she has a teddy tucked under her harm.

Care to explain?
 

Abraxas

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2004
1,056
0
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: preCRT
Don't waste your time arguing with rip or luvly, neither one is capable of admitting when they are wrong nor capable of seeing the truth.

Still wondering why Schiavo's attorney argues that Terri is a "vegetable" and then boasts that her room is filled with flowers and soft music and she has a teddy tucked under her harm.

Care to explain?

Because of people like you who want to make him out to be a merciless, pitiless killer bent on seeing his wife die. That is why he is "eager" to show that he is doing everything he can to provide peace and tranquility to this woman.
 

Abraxas

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2004
1,056
0
0
Originally posted by: preCRT
Don't waste your time arguing with rip or luvly, neither one is capable of admitting when they are wrong nor capable of seeing the truth.

Perhaps, but I like a challenge.
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
Originally posted by: Abraxas
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: preCRT
Don't waste your time arguing with rip or luvly, neither one is capable of admitting when they are wrong nor capable of seeing the truth.

Still wondering why Schiavo's attorney argues that Terri is a "vegetable" and then boasts that her room is filled with flowers and soft music and she has a teddy tucked under her harm.

Care to explain?

Because of people like you who want to make him out to be a merciless, pitiless killer bent on seeing his wife die. That is why he is "eager" to show that he is doing everything he can to provide peace and tranquility to this woman.

A "vegetable" has a sense of peace and tranquility?

Do you try to soothe your french fries before you gobble them down?
 

Abraxas

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2004
1,056
0
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Abraxas
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: preCRT
Don't waste your time arguing with rip or luvly, neither one is capable of admitting when they are wrong nor capable of seeing the truth.

Still wondering why Schiavo's attorney argues that Terri is a "vegetable" and then boasts that her room is filled with flowers and soft music and she has a teddy tucked under her harm.

Care to explain?

Because of people like you who want to make him out to be a merciless, pitiless killer bent on seeing his wife die. That is why he is "eager" to show that he is doing everything he can to provide peace and tranquility to this woman.

A "vegetable" has a sense of peace and tranquility?

Do you try to soothe your french fries before you gobble them down?

Except people like you act like she is aware and functioning rather than a vegetable. It is pure PR to make him look good in the public eye, not for any benefit to her
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
Originally posted by: Abraxas
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Abraxas
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: preCRT
Don't waste your time arguing with rip or luvly, neither one is capable of admitting when they are wrong nor capable of seeing the truth.

Still wondering why Schiavo's attorney argues that Terri is a "vegetable" and then boasts that her room is filled with flowers and soft music and she has a teddy tucked under her harm.

Care to explain?

Because of people like you who want to make him out to be a merciless, pitiless killer bent on seeing his wife die. That is why he is "eager" to show that he is doing everything he can to provide peace and tranquility to this woman.

A "vegetable" has a sense of peace and tranquility?

Do you try to soothe your french fries before you gobble them down?

Except people like you act like she is aware and functioning rather than a vegetable. It is pure PR to make him look good in the public eye, not for any benefit to her

If his goal is to look good in the public eye maybe he shouldn't STARVE HER TO DEATH.

Does Felos really think that people are THAT stupid?
 
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