routan... we're talking about Martin Luther, not about Martin Luther King.
My apologies. Terrible mixup.
routan... we're talking about Martin Luther, not about Martin Luther King.
Martin Luther was indeed a whackjob by today's standards, including such behaviors as smearing his own feces on church doors and throwing it at corrupt priests. However he also took on corruption at a time when it was rampant within the Church, leading not only to the Protestant movement but also to the Catholic Church reforming, cleaning up a lot of the worst corruption. Like most such pivotal societal figures, he was neither purely good nor completely crazy, but he accomplished a lot of good and left the world a better place. And of course, the Jews have always been Europe's whipping boy, as far as I can tell for no good reason.Interesting quote at #146 PJABBER. As someone who grew up Protestant I had no idea Martin Luther entertained such wackjob ideas as the imminent apocalypse. I guess the Protestants do as good a job as any other religion in whitewashing what isn't convenient.
That is pretty ridiculous. How many fundamentalists believe that the Bible takes precedence over the Constitution? I dare say all, or pretty close to all, of them yet our constitutional government has stood up pretty well.
The basic problem is a most Americans have no real life contact with any Muslims and they have been led to believe by TV alarmists that all Muslims are radical, OBL types who want to return the world to some sort of Middle Ages paradise. That is not true. The fact of the matter is Judiasm, Christianity and Isalm are all closely related religions. We even revere the same ten commandments, the same early religious prophets-Moses, for example. In Islam Jesus is viewed as a respected prophet/teacher.
I still say this feverent anti-Sharia law campaign is a cynical political ploy, a solution to a nonexistent problem-and if the problem ever does arise, one that can be easily handled by our current constitutional and legal system.
Kadarin: you are a complete idiot. There is simply no other way to look at it.
Instead of being the simpleton who's only capable of attacking the messenger, why not compose an intelligent response and explain to me why you believe I'm wrong?
may I also ask members supporting this ban to please inform me of the reasons behind opposing Sharia Law? I may be able to address some of their concerns. If you could list out what you dislike about Sharia Law in points, I would be grateful.
Sharia does not incorporate US law because, coming from Muhammed*, Sharia is already perfect and only those who don't understand it oppose it. Therefore imposing Sharia is only for the good of these ignorant people.Because Sharia law has not been passed by the Legislature and signed into US Law by the Executive branch(or a supermajority vote to override a veto) nor is it listed in the US Constitution.
May I ask you why Sharia law does not incorporate US law? I assume it is for the same basic reason I listed above but I figured I would ask.
Because Sharia law has not been passed by the Legislature and signed into US Law by the Executive branch(or a supermajority vote to override a veto) nor is it listed in the US Constitution.
May I ask you why Sharia law does not incorporate US law? I assume it is for the same basic reason I listed above but I figured I would ask.
The actual law
The best to learn about Sharia law is to examine the actual laws. The best source is Reliance of the Traveller, translated by Nuh Ha Mim Keller, by Amana Publications, 1994. The Sharia is organized in an outline form and each case quoted below will be referenced by the index number
Imitating the kafir
Even if the kafir has a better way, a Muslim should not imitate it.
e4.1 It is kufr (unbelief) to turn from the Sunna to imitate the kafir, when one believes that the kafir way is superior to the Sunna.
Forced marriage
A woman may be forced to marry a person whom she does not want.
m3.13 Whenever the bride is a virgin, the father or the fathers father may marry her without her permission, though it is recommended to ask her permission if she has reached puberty. A virgins silence is considered as consent.
Forced sex
The wife must have sex whenever her husband demands it.
m5.1 It is obligatory for a woman to let her husband have sex with her immediately when:
(a) He asks her;
(b) At home;
(c) She can physically endure it.
Wife Beating
The Koran says that a wife can be beaten. Mohammed recommended wife beating in his last sermon at Mecca. Here is the Sharia:
DEALING WITH A REBELLIOUS WIFE
m10.12 When a husband notices signs of rebelliousness in his wife whether in words as when she answers him coldly when she used to do so politely. or he asks her to come to bed and she refuses, contrary to her usual habit; or whether in acts, as when he finds her averse to him when she was previously kind and cheerful), he warns her in words without keeping from her or hitting her, for it may be that she has an excuse
So after seven pages of "discussion", I'm still unclear on the basic premise of this topic. Except for pundits trying to scare idiots, and politicians trying to get votes from the same idiots, is this even a problem that remotely needs addressing? Religious law of any type is fundamentally outlawed in the very 1st amendment to the US constitution, period.
I don't mean that opposing Sharia law is bad. As a staunch agnostic, I believe religion should begin and end within your own head. Any attempt to oppose your beliefs on me or anyone else is totally unacceptable, WHATEVER those beliefs might be. But lucky for me I live in America, where we have ample protections against religious assholes trying to make us all listen to their God. So I have a hard time understanding the epic angst over Sharia, when Christians (the vast majority of this country) have to fight tooth and nail to even keep things like "In God We Trust" on the money. Is ANYONE honestly thinking Sharia law stands a chance?
Honestly, I think this is blatant manipulation of easily manipulated (ie, stupid) voters. A politician or pundit can drum up a lot of support pretending to protect idiots from the threat of the day, whether or not said "threat" is actually a problem.
So a wife being denied a protective order against a serial rapist and wife beater by a New Jersey state court on the grounds that he is within his rights under Sharia is okay? I guess she should just hide until her lawyer can win on appeal then. No biggy.
I bet she would have liked a New Jersey law prohibiting the family court judge from denying her a protective order because her husband owns her under Sharia. But maybe like myself she's merely "easily manipulated".
Yeah, how about a link to that case...I find you summary highly suspect. In any case, if the 1st amendment isn't enough to prevent the judge from being an idiot, what else is going to help?
So after seven pages of "discussion", I'm still unclear on the basic premise of this topic. Except for pundits trying to scare idiots, and politicians trying to get votes from the same idiots, is this even a problem that remotely needs addressing? Religious law of any type is fundamentally outlawed in the very 1st amendment to the US constitution, period.
Honestly, I think this is blatant manipulation of easily manipulated (ie, stupid) voters. A politician or pundit can drum up a lot of support pretending to protect idiots from the threat of the day, whether or not said "threat" is actually a problem.
The original verdict was overturned during Appellate review. But the fact that a judge ever ruled that way in the first place was the reason for this bit of legislature. YES, the legislation is Fear mongering. But there was a reason why it was written.
Nope, you are right. This is just for the idiots out there to shout "USA" some more and scare people about those evil muslims (that are all terrorists, don't you know). Good to see so many posters here that have fallen for this, hook, line and sinker.
Again,.as noted by all the partisan posters here, they all have bought into it, and have no wish to decide anything based on things like "facts". They "know" they are right, so any proof is immediately dismissed as nonsense.
See this for proof as how people won't change their minds even when presented with factual evidence contrary to their position.
Republicans know this, and have been exploiting this for 8 years now. And now the Dem's are trying to catch up as well, so both parties are in a race to the bottom of the barrel.
Ever since the "southern strategy", it seems like a large part of Republican electoral strategy consists of claiming to protect their supporters from the hordes of whoever threatening them. In the absence of actual hordes, we get promised protection against really questionable threats like monogamous gays and Muslims.
What's interesting about Muslims is that the fight against them started out as opposition to terrorism, with people like GWB being very careful to make the distinction. But now that terrorism has lost its threatening power, the focus has shifted to Muslims in general.