PC DVD playback problem

[Torque79]

Sorry I know it's a big no-no to make your first post on a forum in the tech support section. However, I have been lurking around here for a while and perusing articles on the site for some time, and thought maybe someone might have some ideas to help me.

Here's my setup:
- 1ghz pentium III cpu, 512mb SDRAM, on-board video card, 8x pioneer dvd reader, intel mobo
- this pc hooks up to a home-built projector with a vga only input (built from a 15" LCD monitor and an overhead projector like you used to have at school)
- the on-board sound card used to output to a standard audio cable to an old stereo with a RCA cable splitter.

For christmas, I got a 5.1 surround AUDIO ONLY receiver and speaker system (RCA I think). I saw digital input on it, and thought time to upgrade! I installed an Auzentech Meridian sound card and connected it to the audio receiver via optical SPDIF cable.

- prior to installing the sound card, DVD video playback looked great, and stereo audio was typical what you'd expect sound quality
- now, the receiver recognizes the optical input and dolby digital input signal no problem, and using the manufacturer sound tests the surround works beautifully of a helicopter flying around you, etc.
- any kind of divx video, avi, mpg etc works great, smooth, and sounds awesome. same with any kind of music files, etc.
- dvd playback now spikes the CPU utilization at constant 90-100%, and is pretty choppy and virtually unwatchable with momentary sound interruptions and volume reduction.

I tried putting in a little better video card (ati 9600agp) and it seemed to smooth out just a little, and maybe reduce cpu utilization slightly, though I did not install the catalyst drivers just used the XP SP2 default drivers for that card.

I suspect that the dolby digital audio now being extracted from the DVD's for transmission to the receiver is too much data for the CPU to handle? And before, because it was only outputting stereo, that was not a problem? I'm a little disappointed that a high-end sound card did not take on this processing and actually help reduce CPU utilization if anything, but I guess not?

I have ensured I have the latest drivers for this sound card from the Auzentech website, I have the on-board sound card disabled. I am looking into maybe purchasing a new mobo/processor, but I really can't afford to buy them if I can avoid it. Does anyone have any more suggestions before I have to spend more money?

 

[Torque79]

forgot to mention, tomorrow I am going to add the following to my testing:
- remove current dvdrom and install an alternate
- check to ensure the dvdrom remains actively using DMA mode when a dvd is running
- borrow my gaming pc's x800gto and install the latest catalyst drivers to look for CPU utilization reduction
- attempt to borrow a new power supply from work to try

and anything else random I can come up with in the mean time.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Do you have the auzentech card set to encode DD still?

You should just be doing SPDIF passthrough of the DD / DTS stream now rather than encoding it.

 

[Torque79]

yes, the driver software was still set to Dolby Digital, I was concerned the signal output to the receiver would not contain Dolby otherwise (guess I'm wrong!)

let me see, if I recall correctly the options are:
- Dolby Digital
- DTS Connect
- 42khz
- 48khz
- 98khz
- 192khz (all of these numbers are rough, I can't remember exactly)
- SP/DIF loopback

I think that was it... so, you'd suggest I choose one of the khz numbers? Another thing I found out (and was VERY disappointed by), is that the receiver cannot accept anything above 48khz. set to 98, get some nasty sounding static on the front channels and nothing rear, set to 192khz and hear absolutely nothing.

they also have a setting in the driver that is supposed to help channel additional bass to the subwoofer if you are using small speakers (which I am), this setting does not seem to affect CPU usage either way. you think this setting is worth using, or will it be lost in the optical output anyways?

thx for the response!!!

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Is the Dolby Digital one the Dolby Digital Live option?

You should be letting the reciever do the bass controls if it is capable of doing so.

Were the speakers / sub / receiver all bought together as a system? If so, it should already be set up properly to give the speakers and sub the correct frequencies for their capabilities.

Try setting your DVD playing software to do passthrough of the digital audio signal (not 5.1 or whatever the other options are) and then setting the sound control panel to 48khz. If the receiver kicks into DD, you should be in business.

I'm worried that the issue might be that the card is trying to re-encode a stream that is already DD. It might be fvcking it up.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

This is not totally related to your issues, but you might want to take a look at it if you're new to digital audio stuff.

http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=30&threadid=1940133&enterthread=y

 

[Torque79]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello
Is the Dolby Digital one the Dolby Digital Live option?

You should be letting the reciever do the bass controls if it is capable of doing so.

Were the speakers / sub / receiver all bought together as a system? If so, it should already be set up properly to give the speakers and sub the correct frequencies for their capabilities.

Try setting your DVD playing software to do passthrough of the digital audio signal (not 5.1 or whatever the other options are) and then setting the sound control panel to 48khz. If the receiver kicks into DD, you should be in business.

I'm worried that the issue might be that the card is trying to re-encode a stream that is already DD. It might be fvcking it up.

sorry yes I was referring to the dolby digital live option.

yes, the speakers, sub and receiver came as a package. I will leave all driver settings at default then and manipulate the receiver settings if needed.

I will seek out the passthrough digital audio setting in PowerDVD (don't know version off-hand). I do not think I set that option.

The receiver unfortunately has to be manually set to either stereo, 3 stereo or Dolby Digital. Hopefully I'll just HEAR the difference.

thanks for the link, I REALLY need to learn more so it is much appreciated!

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

If those are the only options then it would seem that DD would be the only setting where the surround speakers are doing anything

http://www.videolan.org/vlc/ would be another player to try. The audio menu should be clearer for what the options are.

 

[Auric]

I'm bi-curious why you spent as much on a sound card as the rest of the system? It seems totally inappropriate for your needs since S/PDIF could have been added with the most basic $10 card (or possibly even less for a cable or bracket if the on-board audio has such function).

Anyhoo, yeah, disable all decoders (and encoders) as that is likely what is causing the high CPU useage and interfering with the sound as well. Set PowerDVD audio to SPDIF and likewise the audio card software. 48KHz is DVD movie audio frequency anyway so don't worry about not being able to run the output higher.

If the receiver has a mode to redirect lower frequencies to the subwoofer then it it worth trying but do not bother if it can only be done in software on the PC side since that implies decoding and thus the higher CPU usage and either analog connections or else just mock surround over SPDIF.

Make sure DxVA is enabled in the video decoder (may say Hardware Acceleration or ATI AVIVO) to take advantage of the GPU and minimize CPU usage. I would not recommend VLC due to its decoder lacking DxVA capabilities and Cyberlink's are top notch.

 

[Peter]

First of all, sort out the video drivers. The onboard graphics (if it's VIA or SiS) should be well good enough for 2D video work, provided you installed the latest driver set for them.

And /then/ address the audio. As others have said, your new card may be total overkill for the task, and may require much more CPU power than this box has. Doesn't the onboard audio have an S/PDIF-out option?

 

[Torque79]

Auric:
I know it seems odd to have such a high end audio card in such a low end PC, but they were just leftover parts from here and there which cost me nothing, and I always thought 2D video processing was nothing for ANY modern video card, and I used to watch DVD's on my 600mhz Coppermine processor just fine in the past. It would seem that assumption may be wrong when applying DD and/or SPDIF output to the mix!

also, I don't think optical SPDIF would be present with just any audio card. When I was researching it, I found even the Creative X-fi video cards optical output on the front panel only outputs a 2 channel audio signal, not 5 channel, which seems ludicrous for such an expensive product. I probably should have gone with the Auzentech X-Plosion card, but with new speakers I really wanted to treat myself to the best audio quality I could find.

I am not sure if I set up Hardware acceleration in PowerDVD, I will look and try it. hopefully it will help, though the video is only on-board at the moment. Maybe an ok video card and hardware acceleration enabled will help.

Peter:
You bring up a very valid point. I am quite sure the drivers I am using for the on-board video are only the XP default ones, and have not been updated at all. Maybe that will help as well. I will try to update them.

the on-board audio is still on a Pentium 3 motherboard keep in mind, so it is FAR from having SPDIF optical output. I was not aware that motherboards existed with optical output right on them, but I'd imagine they would cost more than I would ever spend on a motherboard anyways.

I realize it's quite possible I may have to buy a new CPU/mobo to resolve this, but I was hoping to run the full gammut of other options before pulling out my wallet. DVD playback is such a basic thing after all, and used to be fine even with my old 600mhz computer prior to this 1ghz.

 

[Peter]

Audio codecs that have S/PDIF output have been around at Pentium-III times.

Yes please do install the vendor's native drivers for the graphics engine.

No, you should by no means have to buy new hardware - 1 GHz Pentium-III is plenty good enough for DVD viewing, even if paired with a graphics engine that does not have DVD decode-assisting hardware. When the audio setup is correctly configured to just loop the audio stream from the DVD through to the S/PDIF output, then that's not going to take any CPU power either.

So, let's get serious about those drivers. What's the chipset on this mainboard?

Remember that flawless DVD replay is possible with a 233 MHz Pentium-MMX, given a DVD-assisting graphics card and direct audio loopthrough.

 

[Auric]

Barring any Auzentech/C-Media driver issues, when the configuration is corrected the SPDIF pass-through should utilize less CPU than the previously okay decode and downmix to stereo.

Was optical necessary for the audio system or is there a coaxial input too? Even so, such cards can still be had for less than $20.

Creative cards going back almost a decade include various SPDIF outputs -most have coaxial jacks but the headers of course can be used with any optical bracket such as those supplied with mobos (not just their drive bays). Those outputs act the same as any other SPDIF -that is, in general practice they either carry uncompressed 2ch PCM (may be matrixed for faux surround) or compressed (pre-encoded) multi-channel AC3/DTS. So, they will indeed output the 5.1 of DVD or with a software encoder can output same from real-time transcoding (from AAC for instance) or mixing (games).

Yeah, the VIA/S3 or SiS decode assist should be good but ATI is likely better as well as better quality so the 9600 would certainly provide better bang for the rupee than that sound card for the task at hand.

Still, there should be no need to compensate for or try overpowering an audio problem with the video. Certainly there should be better drivers (and maybe even a useful control panel) available than those included with Windows. The latest aren't always the greatest in practice though depending upon how old the hardware is -maybe that's not a problem for integrated but for discrete "unified" drivers it can be.

Bottom line is it worked fine before and adding a sound card should not make it worse. So... fix it or ditch it and try a $20 card (maybe pass on C-Media and try a VIA based one).

 

[Torque79]

Originally posted by: Auric
Barring any Auzentech/C-Media driver issues, when the configuration is corrected the SPDIF pass-through should utilize less CPU than the previously okay decode and downmix to stereo.

Was optical necessary for the audio system or is there a coaxial input too? Even so, such cards can still be had for less than $20.

Creative cards going back almost a decade include various SPDIF outputs -most have coaxial jacks but the headers of course can be used with any optical bracket such as those supplied with mobos (not just their drive bays). Those outputs act the same as any other SPDIF -that is, in general practice they either carry uncompressed 2ch PCM (may be matrixed for faux surround) or compressed (pre-encoded) multi-channel AC3/DTS. So, they will indeed output the 5.1 of DVD or with a software encoder can output same from real-time transcoding (from AAC for instance) or mixing (games).

Yeah, the VIA/S3 or SiS decode assist should be good but ATI is likely better as well as better quality so the 9600 would certainly provide better bang for the rupee than that sound card for the task at hand.

Still, there should be no need to compensate for or try overpowering an audio problem with the video. Certainly there should be better drivers (and maybe even a useful control panel) available than those included with Windows. The latest aren't always the greatest in practice though depending upon how old the hardware is -maybe that's not a problem for integrated but for discrete "unified" drivers it can be.

Bottom line is it worked fine before and adding a sound card should not make it worse. So... fix it or ditch it and try a $20 card (maybe pass on C-Media and try a VIA based one).

I'll be working on this tonight and will report back what I can accomplish. starting with getting the proper updated video drivers (I will let you know what graphics chip), changing the auzentech driver settings to 48khz output and ensuring I set hardware acceleration in the PowerDVD software.

I am disappointed to hear that spdif output can only send 2-channel signals. Another (amateur) review I read said the creative optical output was only netting him 2 channel on his receiver, while the auzentech was detecting a 5.1 input signal on his receiver from the optical spdif cable. Still, my hand was a bit forced into digital since the audio receiver only has stereo and digital (optical and coax) inputs, so the only way to get non-emulated (fake) 5.1 is via optical/coax.

guys, stop depressing me that I spent so much on this card! are you saying I could have the SAME dolby digital sound quality input from a $20 sound card? then why would anyone ever buy a more expensive card? the analog software encoding to run PC speakers maybe instead of a receiver? I can't even make use of the DTS Connect support on the soundcard right now because my receiver seems to have no DTS support, but I'll eventually upgrade the receiver obviously. Is there no future-proofing advantage to this sound card?

 

[Peter]

Most cheap and/or old audio solutions can only GENERATE stereo onto S/PDIF, true. However, the vast majority of these solutions can do digital PASSTHROUGH the audio stream from the DVD, how many channels it may have.

 

[Torque79]

ok here's an update. the hard drive died in my htpc, so I reloaded windows on a new drive and reinstalled all my video codecs, windows media player 11, powerdvd 6, etc.

The dvd video and audio are looking great now using the audio driver from Microsoft's website, so I wonder if the beta driver from auzentech's site was causing issues for me. with only the optical cable connected to my receiver, my audio receiver detects the incoming dolby digital signal and it sounds GREAT.

HOWEVER, I am having difficulty getting any audio besides DVD to come out via spdif now. I have installed codecs for divx, ac3, media player classic, quicktime, etc. I have a number of TV shows and old cartoons in various video file formats, and whenever I play these they will ONLY output to analog from the sound card. I can even open some of these files in powerdvd, which I KNOW is set properly to spdif sound output because DVD's work properly, and yet only get analog output.

any thoughts on this? I know windows itself cannot be set to all audio output being spdif so I have to find a setting for it in each player software. I found the setting in Media Player 11, but could only get analog audio in there as well as media player classic.

I'd very much appreciate your thoughts. I can't believe how complicated it has been to hook up a good sound card and speakers.

 

[Steve]

There should be a setting if you dig around somewhere that allows both digital and analog to play through S/PDIF.