Phenom II > i7

[palladium]

Linky

Got the link from a friend.

It's in German, but the graphs are quite clear. In low res, i7 pwns PII, but as you crank up to more GPU-dependant res it seems PII starts to gain leadership, in some cases by a significant amount.

My thoughts: The testing methodology must have some flaws somewhere, I mean, in crysis @16x10, the i7 965 is slower than the 920 ( WTF!).

I believe guys at AMDZone are all hyped over this.

 

[jones377]

Yeah this can't really be denied anymore as it shows up not on just one or two sites but in lots of places. And more importantly, no one has yet offered a good explanation for this.

Just throwing some ideas out there..

1) Video driver related
2) QPI latency vs HT latency
3) Hyperthreating
4) Crappy chipset?

I don't claim to know the answer but I am getting really interesting in this now. Like I said, it can't be explained away anymore.

 

[HOOfan 1]

according to their graphs, the faster the clock speed, thelower the minimum FPS....sorry I don't believe it.

Most site benchmarks I have seen still show the Core i7 marginally ahead of the Phenom II X4 in most games tested.....

 

[cusideabelincoln]

Originally posted by: jones377
Yeah this can't really be denied anymore as it shows up not on just one or two sites but in lots of places. And more importantly, no one has yet offered a good explanation for this.

Just throwing some ideas out there..

1) Video driver related
2) QPI latency vs HT latency
3) Hyperthreating
4) Crappy chipset?

I don't claim to know the answer but I am getting really interesting in this now. Like I said, it can't be explained away anymore.

Yeh there's got to be something, and I'll add one more.

5) L2 cache size a problem for Core i7?

I hope someone chimes in with the details regarding Phenom II and i7's memory and cache system, because I can't recall the numbers (latency) off the top of my head. Intel processors have always loved large L2 cache sizes, especially for games, while AMD processors typically see less marginal gains.

 

[sjwaste]

Meh, who cares. At least there's legitimate discussion about these two products being competitive. That prevents either from pricing you out of the market entirely.

We need a return to the back and forth between Intel and AMD. When AMD's products were on top, there were some real performance bargains out there.

 

[Pelu]

I hear i7 is sucking hard... not only for their price.. but also due to some strange issues....

 

[aigomorla]

dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

 

[jones377]

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

And those of us who want to know more?

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: Pelu
I hear i7 is sucking hard... not only for their price.. but also due to some strange issues....

*Sigh*, I could so make a comment here, but I'm scarred of Ban roll-on.

If you ever have anything substantive to say, please post again.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: palladium
Linky

Got the link from a friend.

It's in German, but the graphs are quite clear. In low res, i7 pwns PII, but as you crank up to more GPU-dependant res it seems PII starts to gain leadership, in some cases by a significant amount.

My thoughts: The testing methodology must have some flaws somewhere, I mean, in crysis @16x10, the i7 965 is slower than the 920 ( WTF!).

I believe guys at AMDZone are all hyped over this.

If they want to think that, let them. They probably already did anyway.


Some German site is not going to make any waves...

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

I dunno, IMO Core i7 is starting to look downright reasonable in price for what you get, if you do more than play games.

I know you are accustomed to mostly high-end hardware, but you could easily build a new PC and have the Core i7 unit only around $100-$200 more, which when you look at the total cost of the PC is not that bad, especially if you need to buy everything - case, HDD, etc.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: OCguy

Originally posted by: palladium
Linky

Got the link from a friend.

It's in German, but the graphs are quite clear. In low res, i7 pwns PII, but as you crank up to more GPU-dependant res it seems PII starts to gain leadership, in some cases by a significant amount.

My thoughts: The testing methodology must have some flaws somewhere, I mean, in crysis @16x10, the i7 965 is slower than the 920 ( WTF!).

I believe guys at AMDZone are all hyped over this.

If they want to think that, let them. They probably already did anyway.


Some German site is not going to make any waves...

It already has, especially considering that a couple other sites have posted similar results, with the result that some gamers are looking to AMD to save $$ and invest more in graphics.

Basically, Core i7 doesn't really shine in gaming unless there is an abundance of GPU power. As more GPU power becomes available, Core i7 systems will pull away in gaming. Probably.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: jones377

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

And those of us who want to know more?

Well thats the problem because each website wants to produce new info regardless of its FUD content or not.

(meaning can be or cant be FUD).

If you want more info, google, and ask around. But 90% of the i7 users who have both AMD and i7, do not touch AMD after they had an i7. (could be because the i7 was more expensive or due to its price they think its quicker).

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

I dunno, IMO Core i7 is starting to look downright reasonable in price for what you get, if you do more than play games.

I know you are accustomed to mostly high-end hardware, but you could easily build a new PC and have the Core i7 unit only around $100-$200 more, which when you look at the total cost of the PC is not that bad, especially if you need to buy everything - case, HDD, etc.

The X58 platform by definition of because its a X platform can not be cheap.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

I dunno, IMO Core i7 is starting to look downright reasonable in price for what you get, if you do more than play games.

I know you are accustomed to mostly high-end hardware, but you could easily build a new PC and have the Core i7 unit only around $100-$200 more, which when you look at the total cost of the PC is not that bad, especially if you need to buy everything - case, HDD, etc.

The X58 platform by definition of because its a X platform can not be cheap.

You can get an X58 mobo for $100 more than a good AMD mobo. The additional cost of an i7 + DDR3 vs PhII X4 + DDR2 is less than $100.

 

[jones377]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: jones377

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

And those of us who want to know more?

Well thats the problem because each website wants to produce new info regardless of its FUD content or not.

(meaning can be or cant be FUD).

If you want more info, google, and ask around. But 90% of the i7 users who have both AMD and i7, do not touch AMD after they had an i7. (could be because the i7 was more expensive or due to its price they think its quicker).

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

I dunno, IMO Core i7 is starting to look downright reasonable in price for what you get, if you do more than play games.

I know you are accustomed to mostly high-end hardware, but you could easily build a new PC and have the Core i7 unit only around $100-$200 more, which when you look at the total cost of the PC is not that bad, especially if you need to buy everything - case, HDD, etc.

The X58 platform by definition of because its a X platform can not be cheap.

Well I would still like to know why the Phenom II seems to be a little faster at higher res than i7. BTW I think the C2Q might show the same thing vs i7. There are plenty of sites where this is happening now. But since every thread about it is being (intentionally?) derailed I guess there will never be much discussion about it. I recommended a friend of mine to buy an i7 rig and he did so don't think I'm a fanboy (of either company!)

 

[soonerproud]

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

:thumbsup:

You are spot on.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: jones377

Well I would still like to know why the Phenom II seems to be a little faster at higher res than i7. BTW I think the C2Q might show the same thing vs i7. There are plenty of sites where this is happening now. But since every thread about it is being (intentionally?) derailed I guess there will never be much discussion about it. I recommended a friend of mine to buy an i7 rig and he did so don't think I'm a fanboy (of either company!)

if your friend has the funds for an i7, you gave him the right recomendation.

More cores means future proof. i7 has 4 cores with 8 threads possible so it will keep that machine future proof longer then any AMD.

The reason why im guessing it gamed worse then the AMD is because of HT ON.

Im hearing in games the HT ON blows.

Also an i7 decked out with tri sli will perform faster PERIOD on a i7 over an AMD.

It was shown GPU's benifit from a clock boost up to 4ghz.

which is why i said, if you can afford a decked out i7, its a no competition scenario.

 

[richierich1212]

I guess if you have enough funds to buy 3 graphics cards to TRI SLI then yeah you should have enough to buy an i7 lmao......Anyways who cares about this topic. The E8x00 chips overclocked could probably spank both.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: richierich1212
I guess if you have enough funds to buy 3 graphics cards to TRI SLI then yeah you should have enough to buy an i7 lmao......Anyways who cares about this topic. The E8x00 chips overclocked could probably spank both.

he's not asking a question about a dual core...

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: aigomorla
dude it alway boils down to this.

Unlimited budget: i7
Limited budget: AMD.

A fully decked out i7 machine will spank a fully decked out amd machine but be 3x its cost.

I dunno, IMO Core i7 is starting to look downright reasonable in price for what you get, if you do more than play games.

I know you are accustomed to mostly high-end hardware, but you could easily build a new PC and have the Core i7 unit only around $100-$200 more, which when you look at the total cost of the PC is not that bad, especially if you need to buy everything - case, HDD, etc.

The X58 platform by definition of because its a X platform can not be cheap.

You can get an X58 mobo for $100 more than a good AMD mobo. The additional cost of an i7 + DDR3 vs PhII X4 + DDR2 is less than $100.

I think he's comparing top of the line processors... not just a PhII 940 vs. an i7 920. "Top of the line."

There was another site floating around a while back that showed Phenom doing very well as resolutions increased. That was a PhI vs. C2D though. I don't know if there is or isn't anything to these sites that report that AMD seems to do better at higher resolution then Intel processors. I do know that my platform games very well in my opinion, but I'm sure most of the Intel guys here are equally happy with theirs.

 

[OCGuy]

As soon as developers write games that can actually take advantage of an i7, it wont even be close anyway.

i7-like CPUs are the future.

 

[dmens]

I believe guys at AMDZone are all hyped over this.

they're actually complaining that the setup used is unfairly biased for i7. not kidding.

 

[Smoove910]

German site conveniently releases review stating Phenom II is better than I7, when AMD procs are manufactured in Germany... hmmmm.

Make ya wonder, eh?

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: OCguy
As soon as developers write games that can actually take advantage of an i7, it wont even be close anyway.

i7-like CPUs are the future.

In many ways i7 and Phenom are more alike than i7 and C2D. Any game that can take advantage of i7 strengths, minus HT, should also gain performance on Phenom I would think.

Originally posted by: Smoove910
German site conveniently releases review stating Phenom II is better than I7, when AMD procs are manufactured in Germany... hmmmm.

Make ya wonder, eh?

Err... Intel has locations in Germany also.

 

[lopri]

It has to be some BIOS quirk or X58 bug.