Prom in Mississippi

[zsdersw]

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/03/17/mississippi.lesbian.prom/index.html?hpt=Sbin

(CNN) -- The American Civil Liberties Union is pushing for a quick legal decision, hoping to save a high school prom that was allegedly canceled because two lesbians wanted to attend it together.

The rights group filed a motion for a preliminary injunction against a Mississippi school district and high school in federal court Tuesday over the April 2 prom.

The case will be argued before a federal judge in Mississippi on March 22, the ACLU said.

The showdown stems from a complaint by 18-year-old Constance McMillen, who said she was told not to bring her girlfriend to the prom or wear a tuxedo.

The prom was canceled after the ACLU demanded that McMillen's high school change its policy.

"I never thought the school would try to cancel the prom and hurt everyone just to keep me and my girlfriend from going together," McMillen said in an ACLU news release. "A lot of people have made really generous offers to pay for a prom somewhere else, which I really appreciate. But all I've ever wanted was to be able to just go to my own school's prom with my girlfriend."

The motion filed Tuesday is part of a lawsuit that the ACLU has filed against the Itawamba County School District and Itawamba Agricultural High School.

At the center of the lawsuit is a memorandum from the school to students, dated February 5, which says that prom dates must be of the opposite sex.

Also, when McMillen expressed a desire to wear a tuxedo to the prom, the district superintendent told her only male students were allowed to wear them, according to court documents.

Superintendent Teresa McNeece also told McMillen that she and her girlfriend could be ejected from the prom if other students complained about their presence, according to the documents.

School district officials could not be reached for comment. But the county's board of education said in a statement last week that "Due to the distractions to the educational process caused by recent events, the Itawamba County School District has decided to not host a prom at Itawamba Agricultural High School this year."

The ACLU aims to change that.

"We are determined to get the prom back on the calendar and open to all students," said ACLU lawyer Christine Sun. "What this case comes down to is the school taking the extraordinary measure of canceling the prom, rather than live up to its legal obligation to fairly treat all students who want to come to it."

A public school has no business discriminating on this.

I think the school has the right to ask *anyone* to leave if they're causing a disturbance, though, but not to tell two students they can't attend simply because they're lesbians, and cancelling the prom altogether is just stupid.

 

[Deudalus]

but not to tell two students they can't attend simply because they're lesbians, and cancelling the prom altogether is just stupid.

Bear in mind what I'm in full support of equal rights and gay marriage before you read this.......

I think a small part of it is because they are lesbians and the larger part of it is because one of them will be wearing a tuxedo.

I think if they were both going to dress as women there wouldn't be so much of a case. Schools have dress codes that people must follow. This is a school function.

I can guarantee you that if the offensive lineman from the football team wanted to wear halter tops and mini skirts to school (much less the prom) they wouldn't be allowed to either.

Every guy has to wear a tuxedo. Every girl has to wear a dress. Its the rules. If you don't like the rules get your plumbing changed.


I would wager a guess that in this town everyone knew that these two were lesbians before the prom. If it was truly a discrimination case then wouldn't they be trying to kick them out of school? Maybe they would be telling them that they are banned from prom?

I don't hear the school saying that. What the school is saying is wear a dress like every other girl there. I think that's reasonable.

 

[zsdersw]

I think a small part of it is because they are lesbians and the larger part of it is because one of them will be wearing a tuxedo.

I think if they were both going to dress as women there wouldn't be so much of a case. Schools have dress codes that people must follow. This is a school function.

So what if a girl wears a tuxedo? It's still appropriate attire for the function.

I can guarantee you that if the offensive lineman from the football team wanted to wear halter tops and mini skirts to school (much less the prom) they wouldn't be allowed to either.

The offensive lineman for the football team wouldn't fit in a halter top or mini skirt. This girl can fit in a tuxedo. There's a difference.

Every guy has to wear a tuxedo. Every girl has to wear a dress. Its the rules. If you don't like the rules get your plumbing changed.

No, assuming those are the rules, the rules should be changed.

I would wager a guess that in this town everyone knew that these two were lesbians before the prom. If it was truly a discrimination case then wouldn't they be trying to kick them out of school? Maybe they would be telling them that they are banned from prom?

Being kicked out of school is quite a bit different from being banned from prom. Both can be discrimination cases, though.

I don't hear the school saying that. What the school is saying is wear a dress like every other girl there. I think that's reasonable.

The school has no right to say that, though.. nor is it reasonable. What is reasonable is saying that prom is a formal night, meaning dresses and tuxedos. What is not reasonable is saying who can and cannot wear one kind of formalwear.

 

[n yusef]

Bear in mind what I'm in full support of equal rights and gay marriage before you read this.......

I think a small part of it is because they are lesbians and the larger part of it is because one of them will be wearing a tuxedo.

I think if they were both going to dress as women there wouldn't be so much of a case. Schools have dress codes that people must follow. This is a school function.

I can guarantee you that if the offensive lineman from the football team wanted to wear halter tops and mini skirts to school (much less the prom) they wouldn't be allowed to either.

Every guy has to wear a tuxedo. Every girl has to wear a dress. Its the rules. If you don't like the rules get your plumbing changed.


I would wager a guess that in this town everyone knew that these two were lesbians before the prom. If it was truly a discrimination case then wouldn't they be trying to kick them out of school? Maybe they would be telling them that they are banned from prom?

I don't hear the school saying that. What the school is saying is wear a dress like every other girl there. I think that's reasonable.

What is this, 1920? Women have been wearing tuxedos for years now.

 

[Hacp]

Prom is a privilege, not a right.

 

[RearAdmiral]

Prom sucks. I went to vegas for one of my proms.

 

[Throckmorton]

Prom is a privilege, not a right.

Not being discriminated against is a right, not a privilege.

 

[jacc1234]

I agree that prom is a privileged not a right, I was not allowed to go to my prom for example. On the other-hand these girls have done nothing to loose that privilege. Being gay is not like being suspended, they have just as much right to be there as any other student in good standing.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

School makes mountain out of a molehill. Everybody loses...how nice.

 

[zsdersw]

Prom is a privilege, not a right.

Totally missing the boat again, I see.

 

[Deudalus]

The offensive lineman for the football team wouldn't fit in a halter top or mini skirt. This girl can fit in a tuxedo. There's a difference.

You have never seen a huge bitch in skinny bitch clothes? You are living a truly blessed life.

The school has no right to say that, though.. nor is it reasonable. What is reasonable is saying that prom is a formal night, meaning dresses and tuxedos. What is not reasonable is saying who can and cannot wear one kind of formalwear.

So basically you can require people to wear formal attire but you can't decide what attire is formal for who?

How about you are required to use a bathroom, men's or women's doesn't matter. You are just required to use one?

A football player is required to wear a uniform. It doesn't matter which team's uniform he wears, he can wear their team's and play for our team, so long as he has a uniform on.

Public officers can wear whatever uniform they want. Cops can dress like firefighters. Firefighters can dress like city councilmen. City councilmen should dress like meter maids.


What you should be arguing is that it is discriminatory to have a dress code. That we could find a lot to agree on.

But if you are going to have a dress code then you must follow it regardless of what plumbing you prefer.

 

[Slick5150]

Totally missing the boat again, I see.

It's best not to try to infiltrate the bizzaro-world Hacp lives in.

 

[zsdersw]

You have never seen a huge bitch in skinny bitch clothes? You are living a truly blessed life.

Oh yes I have. We have them in our "community". They're called "bears".

So basically you can require people to wear formal attire but you can't decide what attire is formal for who?

As a compromise, sure.

How about you are required to use a bathroom, men's or women's doesn't matter. You are just required to use one?

No argument from me on that one.

A football player is required to wear a uniform. It doesn't matter which team's uniform he wears, he can wear their team's and play for our team, so long as he has a uniform on.

A different situation than this. There's no gender/sexual orientation discrimination involved.

Public officers can wear whatever uniform they want. Cops can dress like firefighters. Firefighters can dress like city councilmen. City councilmen should dress like meter maids.

See previous response.

What you should be arguing is that it is discriminatory to have a dress code. That we could find a lot to agree on.

But if you are going to have a dress code then you must follow it regardless of what plumbing you prefer.

"Plumbing preference" has nothing to do with it. Public entities discriminating within the bounds of a dress code, making it specific to gender or sexual orientation, is what's wrong.

 

[Danube]

Gender dysphoria is still recognized as a disorder and schools shouldn't have to cater to cross-dressers (ACLU is pushing that too) homosexuals etc. In UK teachers can't even say "mum and dad" anymore because it might upset a tiny group of students with homosexual parents. All this gender and sexual dysphoria is a symptom of social decay and family breakdown. Signs of collapse are everywhere.

 

[zsdersw]

Gender dysphoria is still recognized as a disorder and schools shouldn't have to cater to cross-dressers (ACLU is pushing that too) homosexuals etc. In UK teachers can't even say "mum and dad" anymore because it might upset a tiny group of students with homosexual parents. All this gender and sexual dysphoria is a symptom of social decay and family breakdown. Signs of collapse are everywhere.

Since when is not discriminating against a group "catering" to them?

 

[Deudalus]

"Plumbing preference" has nothing to do with it. Public entities discriminating within the bounds of a dress code, making it specific to gender or sexual orientation, is what's wrong.

So for example a private catholic school, you have no problem with a female student wearing the slacks and polo shirt and a male wearing the sweater and school girl skirt?

Bear in mind just earlier you said.......

The offensive lineman for the football team wouldn't fit in a halter top or mini skirt. This girl can fit in a tuxedo. There's a difference.

So basically you have no problem discriminating against large people but you do have a problem with discrimination against cross dressers?

Or am I confused.

So you'd be OK with this at prom right?

and this.......

See that's the funny thing most guys are OK with the girl in a tuxedo thing. I particularly don't have a problem with it. But you can't allow the cute people to cross dress and the fat ugly dudes not to.

 

[Hacp]

Not being discriminated against is a right, not a privilege.

They canceled it for the whole school. I don't see any discrimination.

 

[zsdersw]

So for example a private catholic school, you have no problem with a female student wearing the slacks and polo shirt and a male wearing the sweater and school girl skirt?

Bear in mind just earlier you said.......

I wouldn't have a problem with that, but the school administration might. Private entities are well within their rights to be discriminatory about those things.

So basically you have no problem discriminating against large people but you do have a problem with discrimination against cross dressers?

Or am I confused.

I don't really care if large people want to wear clothing that's too small for them. I also don't think a public entity has a right to object to that, same as with cross dressers.

So you'd be ok with this at prom right?

Yes, I've seen just about everything there is to be seen. I don't have a problem with it. And, again, as I said, public entities should not ban stuff like this. In the case of a prom, they have a right to throw anyone out if a disturbance occurs, but they don't have a right to assume one will and pre-emptively discriminate, or to discriminate in general.

 

[Slick5150]

They canceled it for the whole school. I don't see any discrimination.

Is there a way to do the equivalent of talking slower on here so that Hacp has a hope and prayer of following along with a rational thought?

 

[zsdersw]

They canceled it for the whole school. I don't see any discrimination.

After the ACLU filed a lawsuit. Their first action was to ban them from the prom because one was going to wear a tuxedo. That's discrimination.

 

[zsdersw]

See that's the funny thing most guys are OK with the girl in a tuxedo thing. I particularly don't have a problem with it. But you can't allow the cute people to cross dress and the fat ugly dudes not to.

I never said only one group of people should be allowed to cross-dress.

 

[zsdersw]

Bear in mind what I'm in full support of equal rights and gay marriage before you read this.......

No, I don't really think you are. That has not been demonstrated by your posts in this thread.

 

[actuarial]

So for example a private catholic school, you have no problem with a female student wearing the slacks and polo shirt and a male wearing the sweater and school girl skirt?

Bear in mind just earlier you said.......

When I was in catholic high school some guys wore kilts to school because it was against the dress code.

Eventually the policy was changed and no guys wore kilts anymore.

I'm quite sure there would have been parents at the school who would be pissed if they were told their daughter HAD to wear a kilt every day (not all the girls wore kilts, and non wore them 100% of the time), which is essentially what this school was doing for prom.

 

[Hacp]

When I was in catholic high school some guys wore kilts to school because it was against the dress code.

Eventually the policy was changed and no guys wore kilts anymore.

I'm quite sure there would have been parents at the school who would be pissed if they were told their daughter HAD to wear a kilt every day (not all the girls wore kilts, and non wore them 100% of the time), which is essentially what this school was doing for prom.

I also went to a parochial school. If I was caught in a kilt, I would have been kicked out. Schools have rules, follow them.

 

[zsdersw]

Schools have rules, follow them.

Public schools cannot have rules that discriminate on gender or sexual orientation (among other things).