Question About the Movie Memento

[NaOH]

So I saw this movie maybe 5 times or something, and I watched it again with a few of my friends because they wanted a more in-depth movie. Anyways, we were discussing it afterward and everything made sense up until one of them asked me, "How did he mix up the story of him killing his wife if he's not supposed to remember anything after the accident?" This boggled my mind and I explained it by saying that he needed to give himself a purpose (kind of like how he tampered with all the police reports and such to keep the game going) so he justifies his existence by continuously telling himself the switched up story (maybe found out from someone else), and telling others until it became a long term memory for him (he had that note on his hand to remember sammy jenkis so that he'd see it all the time). But yeah, it's kind of a stretch, maybe it's open ended in that sense. Discuss

 

[sandorski]

I like Pie, but Love Cake, especially CheeseCake!

 

[TwiceOver]

I would have to watch the movie, again, just to understand what you are talking about. I guess I don't remember it being strictly defined that he was the one that killed his wife, or maybe I just didn't view it that way.

 

[Chiropteran]

Spoilers


The Sammy Jenkins story is true and occurred prior to the accident, which is why he can remember it. Teddy was lying about that. Leonard may or may not have killed his wife, it's unimportant. What is important is that he has killed "John G" multiple times and keeps adding fake facts to keep himself busy.

 

[NaOH]

Originally posted by: Chiropteran
Spoilers


The Sammy Jenkins story is true and occurred prior to the accident, which is why he can remember it. Teddy was lying about that. Leonard may or may not have killed his wife, it's unimportant. What is important is that he has killed "John G" multiple times and keeps adding fake facts to keep himself busy.

The story was true, but Teddy said he didn't have a wife and that the wife in the story he tells is of his own wife. He was lying about that? How do you know?

 

[Glitchny]

Originally posted by: NaOH

Originally posted by: Chiropteran
Spoilers


The Sammy Jenkins story is true and occurred prior to the accident, which is why he can remember it. Teddy was lying about that. Leonard may or may not have killed his wife, it's unimportant. What is important is that he has killed "John G" multiple times and keeps adding fake facts to keep himself busy.

The story was true, but Teddy said he didn't have a wife and that the wife in the story he tells is of his own wife. He was lying about that? How do you know?

Possible Spoilers

You know Teddy was lying because you know that Leonard was an insurance investigator and that he remembers the Sammy Jenkins incident, and because you know that the assault that caused his injury/wife's death was real. The police reports etc do not deny that there was an assault, he just removed all the info about the attacker.

I love that movie, it is kinda nuts though when you think about it, he could have killed many "John G"'s and still doesn't remember it. And at the end when he sees the picture of himself happy after killing one of them and then he burns it. Redic.

 

[HumblePie]

I also watched this movie several times and own it. The conclusion is simple really.

He killed his wife but couldnt deal with the pain and used the Sammy incedent as a way to keep moving on with life. He causes his own mental condition through a form of hypnosis where he uses a loud sound as the trigger.

If you pay real attention throughout the movie you will notice the he only loses his memory on loud sounds like a gun shot or car back fire or an alarm. This is because he mentally makes him flush his memory in an attempt to forget the true cause of his wifes death while giving himself a purpose in life. This way he can live a perfect lie and continue to chase after the "bad guys." The thing is this makes him easy enough to be manipulated by others and their own agendas, like Teddy, to a certain degree.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: HumblePie
I also watched this movie several times and own it. The conclusion is simple really.

He killed his wife but couldnt deal with the pain and used the Sammy incedent as a way to keep moving on with life. He causes his own mental condition through a form of hypnosis where he uses a loud sound as the trigger.

If you pay real attention throughout the movie you will notice the he only loses his memory on loud sounds like a gun shot or car back fire or an alarm. This is because he mentally makes him flush his memory in an attempt to forget the true cause of his wifes death while giving himself a purpose in life. This way he can live a perfect lie and continue to chase after the "bad guys." The thing is this makes him easy enough to be manipulated by others and their own agendas, like Teddy, to a certain degree.

I will have to examine that analysis. If it works out that's a great idea.

 

[Ns1]

Originally posted by: HumblePie
He causes his own mental condition through a form of hypnosis where he uses a loud sound as the trigger.

If you pay real attention throughout the movie you will notice the he only loses his memory on loud sounds like a gun shot or car back fire or an alarm. .

interesting, never noticed that

 

[oznerol]

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: HumblePie
I also watched this movie several times and own it. The conclusion is simple really.

He killed his wife but couldnt deal with the pain and used the Sammy incedent as a way to keep moving on with life. He causes his own mental condition through a form of hypnosis where he uses a loud sound as the trigger.

If you pay real attention throughout the movie you will notice the he only loses his memory on loud sounds like a gun shot or car back fire or an alarm. This is because he mentally makes him flush his memory in an attempt to forget the true cause of his wifes death while giving himself a purpose in life. This way he can live a perfect lie and continue to chase after the "bad guys." The thing is this makes him easy enough to be manipulated by others and their own agendas, like Teddy, to a certain degree.

I will have to examine that analysis. If it works out that's a great idea.

No.. it's really not.

He does lose his memory on loud noises because they make him lose focus.

The question the OP is asking is one you're supposed to be asking - more so, you're supposed to be questioning memories.

What is more reliable - Teddy claim or a memory? Is everything we remember exactly how it happened? Sometimes we remember things (and forget things), because we want to.

I'm pretty sure it's open-ended in what you want to believe - if John G killed his wife or if he did.

Teddy's story is his wife survived John G's attack, but Leonard killed her with the insulin. Leonard remembers John G killed his wife, and Sammy was the one with the insulin.

Teddy was a bit smug at the end, which is why I tend to lean towards thinking he was lying.

 

[zerocool84]

And what have we learned here?? That it's still an awesome mind-numbing movie.

 

[NaOH]

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: HumblePie
I also watched this movie several times and own it. The conclusion is simple really.

He killed his wife but couldnt deal with the pain and used the Sammy incedent as a way to keep moving on with life. He causes his own mental condition through a form of hypnosis where he uses a loud sound as the trigger.

If you pay real attention throughout the movie you will notice the he only loses his memory on loud sounds like a gun shot or car back fire or an alarm. This is because he mentally makes him flush his memory in an attempt to forget the true cause of his wifes death while giving himself a purpose in life. This way he can live a perfect lie and continue to chase after the "bad guys." The thing is this makes him easy enough to be manipulated by others and their own agendas, like Teddy, to a certain degree.

I will have to examine that analysis. If it works out that's a great idea.

No.. it's really not.

He does lose his memory on loud noises because they make him lose focus.

The question the OP is asking is one you're supposed to be asking - more so, you're supposed to be questioning memories.

What is more reliable - Teddy claim or a memory? Is everything we remember exactly how it happened? Sometimes we remember things (and forget things), because we want to.

I'm pretty sure it's open-ended in what you want to believe - if John G killed his wife or if he did.

Teddy's story is his wife survived John G's attack, but Leonard killed her with the insulin. Leonard remembers John G killed his wife, and Sammy was the one with the insulin.

Teddy was a bit smug at the end, which is why I tend to lean towards thinking he was lying.

Yeah, that's what we couldn't get over. Is that he should remember accurately what happened. How could he remember the portion of his life where he killed his own wife (unknowingly) if he had a memory problem? Wouldn't that mean he killed her intentionally?

But what would Teddy gain from lying to him about that? It sounded like he was trying to convince him that he made all that shit up to fit his current vengeance seeking life. Trying to get him to see that he isn't doing this for his wife anymore. That he is happy waking up and pretending to satisfy his urge for revenge.

 

[Chiropteran]

Originally posted by: NaOH

Originally posted by: Chiropteran
Spoilers


The Sammy Jenkins story is true and occurred prior to the accident, which is why he can remember it. Teddy was lying about that. Leonard may or may not have killed his wife, it's unimportant. What is important is that he has killed "John G" multiple times and keeps adding fake facts to keep himself busy.

The story was true, but Teddy said he didn't have a wife and that the wife in the story he tells is of his own wife. He was lying about that? How do you know?

It's hard to know anything for a fact in this case, since the writer never clarified it, but Leonard has distinct memories of Sammy Jenkins & Mrs Jenkins and his own wife as different people, from before the accident- where his memory is supposed to be working fine. If he had them mixed up then there was something a lot more serious going on than simple memory loss. Sure you could come up with some more outlandish explanation, but I think it's easiest to assume that Leonard's memories from before the accident are accurate.

 

[NaOH]

Originally posted by: Chiropteran
Spoilers


The Sammy Jenkins story is true and occurred prior to the accident, which is why he can remember it. Teddy was lying about that. Leonard may or may not have killed his wife, it's unimportant. What is important is that he has killed "John G" multiple times and keeps adding fake facts to keep himself busy.

nm gotcha.

 

[NaOH]

Originally posted by: Chiropteran

Originally posted by: NaOH

Originally posted by: Chiropteran
Spoilers


The Sammy Jenkins story is true and occurred prior to the accident, which is why he can remember it. Teddy was lying about that. Leonard may or may not have killed his wife, it's unimportant. What is important is that he has killed "John G" multiple times and keeps adding fake facts to keep himself busy.

The story was true, but Teddy said he didn't have a wife and that the wife in the story he tells is of his own wife. He was lying about that? How do you know?

It's hard to know anything for a fact in this case, since the writer never clarified it, but Leonard has distinct memories of Sammy Jenkins & Mrs Jenkins and his own wife as different people, from before the accident- where his memory is supposed to be working fine. If he had them mixed up then there was something a lot more serious going on than simple memory loss. Sure you could come up with some more outlandish explanation, but I think it's easiest to assume that Leonard's memories from before the accident are accurate.

The scene in the movie where he is talking to Natalie he talks about memory as being unreliable.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: sandorski
I like Pie, but Love Cake, especially CheeseCake!

I wish people would stop stealing my line and adding a ton of crap on the end of it.

 

[Crono]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: sandorski
I like Pie, but Love Cake, especially CheeseCake!

I wish people would stop stealing my line and adding a ton of crap on the end of it.

Don't believe the lie, cheesecake is pie

 

[NaOH]

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: sandorski
I like Pie, but Love Cake, especially CheeseCake!

I wish people would stop stealing my line and adding a ton of crap on the end of it.

Don't believe the lie, cheesecake is pie

Cheesepie sounds fucking gross.

 

[Oscar1613]

Originally posted by: Chiropteran

Originally posted by: NaOH

Originally posted by: Chiropteran
Spoilers


The Sammy Jenkins story is true and occurred prior to the accident, which is why he can remember it. Teddy was lying about that. Leonard may or may not have killed his wife, it's unimportant. What is important is that he has killed "John G" multiple times and keeps adding fake facts to keep himself busy.

The story was true, but Teddy said he didn't have a wife and that the wife in the story he tells is of his own wife. He was lying about that? How do you know?

It's hard to know anything for a fact in this case, since the writer never clarified it, but Leonard has distinct memories of Sammy Jenkins & Mrs Jenkins and his own wife as different people, from before the accident- where his memory is supposed to be working fine. If he had them mixed up then there was something a lot more serious going on than simple memory loss. Sure you could come up with some more outlandish explanation, but I think it's easiest to assume that Leonard's memories from before the accident are accurate.

IIRC, the special edition DVD and website both point to the fact that his wife survived the attack and died later. This suggests that Teddy was telling the truth at least about that part.

The truth about Sammy and his wife is unclear. We know Lenny could condition himself to remember things, as evidenced by the electro-shock stories, and obviously conditioned himself to believe his wife died in the initial attack, so he could have conditioned himself to change the story about Sammy.

I don't remember the details, but I believe there were hints in the scenes dealing with the Sammy story that pointed to an altered memory. I think the watch that Sammy's wife wore was also worn by Lenny's wife in the flashbacks. I believe there were other objects duplicated, such as the brush and teddy bear. I really need to watch it again some time...

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: sandorski
I like Pie, but Love Cake, especially CheeseCake!

I wish people would stop stealing my line and adding a ton of crap on the end of it.

Don't believe the lie, cheesecake is pie

depends on how it's made. it can be either imo.

 

[SSUSeaWolf]

Lenny killed his wife. It shows him for a split second in the mental hospital sitting where Sammy was sitting just before someone walked in front of the camera. It's maybe 1/8 to 1/4th of a second long, so very easy to miss

 

[mAdMaLuDaWg]

Originally posted by: SSUSeaWolf
Lenny killed his wife. It shows him for a split second in the mental hospital sitting where Sammy was sitting just before someone walked in front of the camera. It's maybe 1/8 to 1/4th of a second long, so very easy to miss

I remember watching this on the computer and had to pause the video just so I could catch it. Its impossible to catch without pausing, IMO. Just 1-2 frames.

 

[SSUSeaWolf]

Originally posted by: mAdMaLuDaWg

Originally posted by: SSUSeaWolf
Lenny killed his wife. It shows him for a split second in the mental hospital sitting where Sammy was sitting just before someone walked in front of the camera. It's maybe 1/8 to 1/4th of a second long, so very easy to miss

I remember watching this on the computer and had to pause the video just so I could catch it. Its impossible to catch without pausing, IMO. Just 1-2 frames.

Except that I clearly caught when watching on a 19 inch tv from 8 feet away the first time I saw it on VHS, knowing nothing of the movie ahead of time.

 

[NaOH]

I saw the same thing watching it on a 22 inch screen from 7 feet away.

 

[SSUSeaWolf]

Originally posted by: NaOH
I saw the same thing watching it on a 22 inch screen from 7 feet away.

The two people I was with didn't see it at all, and one of them had seen the movie just a few weeks prior. You probably have to be a little lucky to see this important scene.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ri0aJC3mBGM


Looks clear as day to me