Racism...

[Schfifty Five]

You are all of what 14 or 15 right?

Outside of the color of his skin, how is a black man inherently different than a white man?

Assume each was born at the same time and adopted by say a Native American family. Outside of color, how would they not be the same?

/alkemyst Racist, what does that have anything to do with anything? They aren't visually present so you put value on it.

der der derp durr durr...

moron.

 

[Baasha]

here's a black racist: [imgurl = http://www.frigginrandom.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/black-nazi.jpg][/img]

 

[Baasha]

here's a black racist:

 

[Locut0s]

here's a black racist:

Lol epic fail.

However I don't think anyone has said here that whites are the only ones who can be racist.

 

[theprodigalrebel]

This is relevant to this thread's interests.

 

[rudeguy]

Lol epic fail.

However I don't think anyone has said here that whites are the only ones who can be racist.

ignorance knows no bounds

 

[iGas]

African is a race, Caucasian is a race, Asian is a race, etc...., but Jewish is not a race, hence it is bigotry not racism.

And, disagreeing with Israel and Zionist mentality doesn't mean that the person is antisemitic, racist, or bigot because they follow/observe the teaching of Christian/Judaism and commandment "Thous shall not kill. Thou shalt not steal. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor. Thou shalt not covet."

 

[alkemyst]

Society is such bullshit. Why is it that I get called names if I act black, but my Asian friend doesn't get any shit at all when he talks like a normal person instead of sounding like he just come here on a boat? It's totally a double standard against white people.

You mean because a skinny little dude is trying to act GANGSTA? they get upset and since because your other friend can speak proper english no one seems to mind?

I used to think you were trolling, but it's clear you must have been dropped down stairs a lot as a child. You should consider donations to DCF to help others stop the cycle.

 

[blurredvision]

I think this is in part what Alkemyst is saying:

http://xkcd.com/385/

Here's 3 statements:

1. "...the robbery suspect is a black male, mid-twenties, 185 lbs, tattoo on arm..."

2. "The mexican janitor at work is so lazy..."

3. "That asian driver next to me sucks..."

Statement 1 is not racist; it is a description of a person. Statements 2-3 are racist because race has no bearing on work ethic or driving behavior, and is only mentioned because that's the stereotype. Race wouldn't be mentioned in statements 2-3 if they were white.

But the very definition of racism is thinking your race is superior to another, not being stupid in how you define things. Saying, "The Mexican janitor at work is lazy," is not racist, just a stupid way to state it. Now if you said, "That janitor is a Mexican because that's all they are good at," that is racist. Using a race as a pointless descriptor is not racist, putting down a race because of their race is racist.

The type of thinking you and alkemyst obtain is completely backwards.

 

[alkemyst]

/alkemyst Racist, what does that have anything to do with anything? They aren't visually present so you put value on it.

der der derp durr durr...

moron.

The description is indeed important to the OP's question. The assumption is take one baby of two races and have yet another raise them.

Will the baby's race "show" does it add certain behavioral and personality traits just because of the skin color?

You are trying too hard and lack the mental capability to understand that.

 

[alkemyst]

But the very definition of racism is thinking your race is superior to another, not being stupid in how you define things. Saying, "The Mexican janitor at work is lazy," is not racist, just a stupid way to state it. Now if you said, "That janitor is a Mexican because that's all they are good at," that is racist. Using a race as a pointless descriptor is not racist, putting down a race because of their race is racist.

The type of thinking you and alkemyst obtain is completely backwards.

No no no...racism has nothing to do with superiority always. There are some people that are racist against their own race.

Again you are trying too hard like others. Not all racist comments are hateful nor derogatory. You thinking most of the time when someone uses something like "oh that mexican is being lazy" only because it's a simple descriptor when no one can see that lazy person or even know who he is shows you don't understand the subconscious weightings we do.

Now if you were the foreman of a plant and had a new supervisor then saying something like "there is a mexican janitor, Carlos...keep an eye out for him; he tends to end up taking naps in the broom closet and does half-ass work when he is not sleeping" that is different. Now mexican could have been substituted with Hispanic, but it doesn't change things...even though 'Mexican' is technically a nationality, it's often used at a derogatory to a latin/hispanic person in general.

You venting at lunch to a stranger "yeah these mexicans on my staff are all lazy" is racist.

You can defend this all you want as "everyone does it", it doesn't change the fact that these subtle racist expressions begin adding good and bad values to a race in people's minds (including that race's own)...this then leads to racism.

 

[blurredvision]

No no no...racism has nothing to do with superiority always.

Sure it does, that's what racism is. There is no grey in my definition. Either you make a statement that implies race superiority or you only use race as a descriptor. If you're not implying race superiority, then it's not racism, just a stupid adjective.

Maybe our raising has a lot to do with our differing definitions of racism. I grew up in the hills of eastern Kentucky, where many people hate anybody that isn't white or redneck. I've seen racism, I've seen the actual hatred for other races. I'm going to guess you grew up in a much more diverse environment where your take on racism is completely different, possibly where you've not actually seen it first-hand, so just saying a race as an adjective is considered sin.

 

[airdata]

Here is the deal again...since no one is getting it out of trying to push so hard at this.

Let me break it down *again*.

Saying "my black friend" when talking about a friend that is not present vs "that black guy over there" are two different things.

Once you say something like the former, you have now put a value on what 'black' means (and it becomes more than just color, since your friend is not present and the color of him has no bearing)...

Now this doesn't mean one hates that race, it just means that one separates races.

If you said "that guy over there'' you'd then have to specify when whoever you were talking to asked, which guy? The black one, of course.

Nothing racist about discussing race.

Racism is purely about context. The problem is that nobody has any idea what context is. Most people would probably consider you a racist if you said the infamous N word, regardless of how it was used.

When it comes to skin color, how can you not automatically register that person as being a black guy if that's the case?

The difference is all in knowing that there are all sorts of different people within any group, and therefore hating an entire group for the negitive aspects of a few is simply retarded. This goes beyond race to things like politics.

If you hate an entire political part because of things a few of the people belonging to it say... you're probably retarded.

 

[edro]

Racism, prejudice, stereotype... all very different things.
Using stereotype and prejudice is a natural behavior and is part of our genes.

If a subgroup has a higher percentage of behavior, it is natural to assume such behavior if a member of the subgroup is encountered.

People are too sensitive these days and think everything is racist.

 

[Zen0]

Holy Christ this thread is a mess.

Alkemyst is right on basically everything. The rest of you lack the IQ to comprehend the very simple line of reasoning.

The OP (Rudeguy) is racist if he insists on qualifying someone based on race if that aspect of their character is actually irrelevant. By adding the qualifier, you are implying... nay... fairly explicitly adding that the race matters in the conversation.

If someone asked me about my friend, I would tell them about the kind of person they are, what they do, what they like to do. If I added that they were white, black, asian, latino or whatever as if that actually defines as a person or a friend, that would clearly be racist.

If someone asked me to describe my friend physically for whatever reason, their race would actually be relevant and thus, it would not at all be racist to say "White, 5'10, 185lbs, brown hair, etc etc".

If YOU can not grasp this simple concept, there is no point in having intelligent conversation. I mean, it's like, do you think people really like having conversations with a bonobo? Or their dog?

 

[purbeast0]

so much fail in this thread.

i think the quote of the thread though is alkemyst telling dude he is racist because he hates white trash and hip hop culture.

i dispise the "ghetto/thug" culture with the passion, and it has nothing to do with race. i see whites, blacks, spanish, and asians all acting this way in the DC metro area and i can't stand it when I see it, regardless what color they are.

cry all you want but that does not make me racist.

a couple people in this thread really need to go re-read the definition of racism.

saying "my black friend can dance but my white friend cant" is not a racist statement in the least, especially if it is true. where am i saying that my race is better than either of those, which is infact the definition of racism?

and for the record since some people can't grasp this ... racial != racism

 

[Zen0]

I'd also like to make a second point on Racism - and how it is automatically a "bad" thing.

Well, Racism is simply a human mental process of grouping - which has been essential for survival. If our experience gives us bad impressions of white people, black people, or asian people, it would highly illogical to ignore those experiences and repeat those bad experiences.

It is no different than learning from experiences with oddly colored or poisonous plants, inhospitable environments, or positively, methods for harvesting, hunting etc. We want to generalize because that allows us to pattern and trend to develop our survival - and all living things generally do this.

So, is racism... good or bad? Well, it is clearly NATURAL. Race is afterall, just one aspect that helps us to perceive the world better in order to survive.

IN Modern day society, many things that are... natural... may or may not be relevant. It is natural to out-compete other males for survival (by murdering each other if necessary), it is natural to mate with as many females as possible, it is natural for many things - but social development has, for better or worse, civilized us to put some intellectual ideals before basal level instincts.

In modern day society, racism can be strictly and scientifically beneficial - at least statistically. It tells us to avoid Bed-Stuy, areas in Oakland etc. I will freely admit to racism because I do not want to increase my chance of being shot, mugged, or caught in a gang related crossfire.

However, racism always tends to hurt the races that are stereotyped against, because the ones that are most visible damage the reputation to the ones who are not. Obama or Deval Patrick are high profile, highly intelligent Black men, but those two alone can't undo the much higher number of Blacks who are visible in the media for less noble endeavors. What happens to the 18 year old Black man who goes to Harvard on scholarship? He becomes the victim of racism.

It it thus important for us to approach individuals as individuals, not with preconceptions as members of a group. It is, in my opinion, an anti-racist approach that is difficult to accomplish for most people.

Sadly, for most people, the racist approach is much easier (on their limited intelligence) as well as on their social lives, and so this is the approach they use.

 

[Zen0]

so much fail in this thread.

i think the quote of the thread though is alkemyst telling dude he is racist because he hates white trash and hip hop culture.

i dispise the "ghetto/thug" culture with the passion, and it has nothing to do with race. i see whites, blacks, spanish, and asians all acting this way in the DC metro area and i can't stand it when I see it, regardless what color they are.

I also despise this culture, because it tends to be destructive, unenlightening, degrading to women, superficial, and unintelligent. It does not mean I am inherently hateful of their skin color, no matter what they behave like.

cry all you want but that does not make me racist.

That is up to you. The reasons behind your contempt would dictate this.

a couple people in this thread really need to go re-read the definition of racism.

saying "my black friend can dance but my white friend cant" is not a racist statement in the least, especially if it is true. where am i saying that my race is better than either of those, which is infact the definition of racism?

and for the record since some people can't grasp this ... racial != racism

It is a VERY Racist statement. Do you know what implicit, or inductive logic is? By pointing out the race of your black friend who can dance, and the white friend who can't, you are saying something related to dancing in relation to their race.

I believe you need to read the definition of Racism, which is not limited to superiority, but also human behavioral traits.

 

[purbeast0]

It is a VERY Racist statement. Do you know what implicit, or inductive logic is? By pointing out the race of your black friend who can dance, and the white friend who can't, you are saying something related to dancing in relation to their race.

I believe you need to read the definition of Racism, which is not limited to superiority, but also human behavioral traits.

so my friend cordel can dance, and my friend michael cant. if i told you that it isn't racist. but the minute i say cordel is black and michael is white, it becomes racist?

there is a big difference between streotyping and racism. i can tell the difference between the two, apparently some people can't.

let me ask you all something. do you think that chris rock and dave chappelle are racists?

 

[ss284]

Sadly, for most people, the racist approach is much easier (on their limited intelligence) as well as on their social lives, and so this is the approach they use.

Zeno, I think you made an excellent post, but I have to add that the racist approach is much easier for pretty much everyone in that it saves time, regardless of intelligence.

If you had 5 seconds to pick between a random black guy and a random Jewish guy walking down the street to file your taxes, who do you pick?

Granted this is an extreme case, but there are simliar situations that people deal with everyday. I'm not saying its ideal, but like you said, its natural and selfish thought process that typically benefits the one person making the decision..

 

[blurredvision]

I believe you need to read the definition of Racism, which is not limited to superiority, but also human behavioral traits.

You're the one who is taking purbeast's statement about his black friend being able to dance as a behavioral trait, not purbeast. If you interpret his comment as racist because you believe dancing to be a behavioral trait of blacks, that's your own issue, not purbeast's.

 

[Zen0]

so my friend cordel can dance, and my friend michael cant. if i told you that it isn't racist. but the minute i say cordel is black and michael is white, it becomes racist?

there is a big difference between streotyping and racism. i can tell the difference between the two, apparently some people can't.

let me ask you all something. do you think that chris rock and dave chappelle are racists?

YES. You are attributing dancing (a behavior trait) to race in one example, and in another example, you are not (merely giving their names).

That is the definition of racism.

Put it more bluntly:

My black friend is stupid in math, and my Asian friend is smart in math.

vs

My friend Mike is stupid in math, and my friend Dave is very smart in math.

You are making 2 very distinct statements, one is merely a description of your friends' mathematical aptitudes, the OTHER is a judgment/statement (whether you intended to make it or ignorantly did not realize you were making it) on the intellectual merits of your friends' races.

Of course, I did not need to point that out, I'm sure you were well aware of the difference.

I don't know enough of Chris Rock or Dave Chapelle to know if they are personally racist. I know their humour is based heavily on racism or satirical commentary on such. Regardless, the central theme of their comedy is... racism.

Does that reflect on their own personal racism? I can't make that judgment without knowing them personally, but I would say that they recognize racism as it exists in many walks and areas in life, and are able to make a career out of it.

 

[Zen0]

Zeno, I think you made an excellent post, but I have to add that the racist approach is much easier for pretty much everyone in that it saves time, regardless of intelligence.

If you had 5 seconds to pick between a random black guy and a random Jewish guy walking down the street to file your taxes, who do you pick?

Granted this is an extreme case, but there are simliar situations that people deal with everyday. I'm not saying its ideal, but like you said, its natural and selfish thought process that typically benefits the one person making the decision..

That's correct, maybe statistically reasonable answer (I don't know so I won't say for sure) would be to choose the random Jewish guy.

But real life is not that simple. When we choose an accountant, hopefully we would check his credentials, references, and reputation.

Some people, I'll admit, won't bother, for a variety of reasons, and just pick the Jewish one. They might end up with a good tax guy, they might end up with a bad one, or they might end up having given up a better Black tax guy.

This is why I said that racism hurts the minority, and some have a hard time trying to understand how and reject concepts like Affirmative Action.

 

[purbeast0]

YES. You are attributing dancing (a behavior trait) to race in one example, and in another example, you are not (merely giving their names).

That is the definition of racism.

Put it more bluntly:

My black friend is stupid in math, and my Asian friend is smart in math.

vs

My friend Mike is stupid in math, and my friend Dave is very smart in math.

You are making 2 very distinct statements, one is merely a description of your friends' mathematical aptitudes, the OTHER is a judgment/statement (whether you intended to make it or ignorantly did not realize you were making it) on the intellectual merits of your friends' races.

Of course, I did not need to point that out, I'm sure you were well aware of the difference.

I don't know enough of Chris Rock or Dave Chapelle to know if they are personally racist. I know their humour is based heavily on racism or satirical commentary on such. Regardless, the central theme of their comedy is... racism.

Does that reflect on their own personal racism? I can't make that judgment without knowing them personally, but I would say that they recognize racism as it exists in many walks and areas in life, and are able to make a career out of it.

in my first statement, I am not attributing a race to dancing. i am attributing the race to my friend. YOU are the one attributing the race to dancing. it's how you are interpreting it. that makes you the one who is racist IMO.

i see a huge difference between stereotyping and being racist, you seem to not be able to distinct the two. chappelle and rock tell a ton of jokes based on racial stereotypes, they are not making racist comedy.

i guess growing up in a very diverse area where i have friends of all races and cultures has exposed me more to this so i can tell the difference between the two. when in a group of all our friends of all ethnic racses (spanish (from varius latin countries), black, asian, armenian, indian, white) we ALWAYS joke around with eachother on racial stereotypes to eachothers faces and we all know it isn't racist in the least.

we'll just have to agree to disagree.

EDIT:

oh and through highschool i had a black girlfriend (and i'm white) and i was on the end of racism a few times from black people. never from white people though.

 

[Zen0]

You're the one who is taking purbeast's statement about his black friend being able to dance as a behavioral trait, not purbeast. If you interpret his comment as racist because you believe dancing to be a behavioral trait of blacks, that's your own issue, not purbeast's.

It is not an "issue", unless you mean my intelligence and reasoning capability is an "issue".

I think purbeast knows the difference in effect the two statements make.

Obviously, who you make the statement matters as well. A lower intelligence human, or perhaps a non-native speaker, may not be able to differentiate the two.