Well, now do we know who is "partisian and close-minded"? Or who belongs to a group comprised of a "sickening bunch of partisian hacks"?Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
None of you moronic right-winters have proved a damn thing aganist CBS or Rather. Please continue beating your chests and showing how partisian and close-minded you really are. CBS aired a story that was backed up by a lot different evidence, including people who were there and would know.
If you have any real proof, show it. If all you have are opinions, then STFU and quit whining like a bunch of little girly boys. Until you can show some concrete evidence that CBS did anything illegal, your just a sickening bunch of partisian hacks engaged in a sick circle jerk.
If you want to do something constructive, you might try aslking your fearless leader to address the issues and concerns regarding the reasons why an already trained pilot with a million dollars woth of training was flying in a 2 seat trainig jet and why he never got his scheduled or ordered flight physical.
If we can get a straight answer to those questions (LMAO) then maybe we can find also find out why he had 6 months added to his 6 year military service commitment??? If GWB is so "proud" of his service, then let him defend it. Instead he blocks every effort to shed light on it while claiming "all the documents are released". LMAO again. What a phony SOB he is, a real ChickenHawk. Cock-a-doddle-doo!!
My physical and mental health are fine, and that's not paranoia; it's fact. It is well documented by the 9/11 Commission and others that the administration was prioritizing plans to invade Iraq since they first came to office. They viewed on any scant, questionable hint of intelligence with an eye that would support for their position, they actively solicited and encouraged others to write reports slanted toward their views, and they ignored any input that ran contrary to thier goals.Originally posted by: Buz2b
Harvey,
You need to take a chill pill my friend because all that paranoid activity is going to drive up your blood pressure. Not good for your health!
Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
Well, now do we know who is "partisian and close-minded"? Or who belongs to a group comprised of a "sickening bunch of partisian hacks"?Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
None of you moronic right-winters have proved a damn thing aganist CBS or Rather. Please continue beating your chests and showing how partisian and close-minded you really are. CBS aired a story that was backed up by a lot different evidence, including people who were there and would know.
If you have any real proof, show it. If all you have are opinions, then STFU and quit whining like a bunch of little girly boys. Until you can show some concrete evidence that CBS did anything illegal, your just a sickening bunch of partisian hacks engaged in a sick circle jerk.
If you want to do something constructive, you might try aslking your fearless leader to address the issues and concerns regarding the reasons why an already trained pilot with a million dollars woth of training was flying in a 2 seat trainig jet and why he never got his scheduled or ordered flight physical.
If we can get a straight answer to those questions (LMAO) then maybe we can find also find out why he had 6 months added to his 6 year military service commitment??? If GWB is so "proud" of his service, then let him defend it. Instead he blocks every effort to shed light on it while claiming "all the documents are released". LMAO again. What a phony SOB he is, a real ChickenHawk. Cock-a-doddle-doo!!
WTF happened to you? I knew you were rabidly partisan, but I always thought that you attempted some manner of reasoning and politeness. You have stooped pretty low to post irrational garbage such as this.
On September 11, 2004, Ms. Marian Carr Knox, the secretary to President Bush's National Guard commander, Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, appeared with Dan Rather on CBS's Wednesday's program. Ms. Knox acknowledged that some of the documents CBS relied on were not written by her. But she acknowledged that she had written memorandums identical to the ones presented by CBS. Ms. Knox's testimony transcends the importance of the memorandums, which were written by an unknown author. Ms. Knox gave first hand evidence that Bush was arrogant, aloof, and a person who didn't take serving in the guard seriously. She stated that other officers under Lt. Col. Jerry Killian resented Bush for his demeanor and attitude while in the guard. She said that Bush thought he was above the rules of the guard, or the military's Uniform Code of Military Justice. Bush did what he wanted to do. It should be noted that secretaries are usually at the heart of any organization putting them at the center of all information flows. So Ms. Knox recollections of the events of that era should be considered reputable, accurate, and true.
Ms. Knox is 86 years old and had no reason for not telling the truth. How could anyone believe that someone with her advanced age would come forth and lie. She flatly stated that Bush failed to take physical as he was ordered to do by Lt. Col. Jerry Killian. She said "It was a big no-no to not follow orders. And I can't remember anyone (other than Bush) refusing to." She also stated that anyone who failed to take a physical was grounded and was not allowed to fly. Bush was indeed grounded and there is documented evidence from five years ago that substantiate the documents that CBS provided that proves that Bush was grounded for "failure to submit to a physical".
Ms. Knox said ?But, his time there, it seemed that the other fellows were, I?m going to say this, sort of resentful of him because of his attitude ? that he (Bush) really didn?t have to go by the rules.?
Ms. Knox said Bush told her he "had this campaign to take care of, and that's what he was going to do -- and that's what he did do.? So much for Bush fulfilling his commitment that he promised to uphold when he joined the guard.
FOX's Friends hard on KnoxKnox is not the "only person" who has confirmed the memos' content. Colonel Bobby W. Hodges, Killian's superior officer, and Richard Via, another former Texas National Guard officer, have also verified that the content of the memos reflects Killian's true sentiments.
As The New York Times reported on September 12, "He [Hodges] said he had not authenticated the documents for CBS News but had confirmed that they reflected issues he and Colonel Killian had discussed."
Via told USA Today that "the documents were fakes but that their content reflected questions about Bush that were discussed at the time in the hangar at Ellington Air Force Base, where he had a desk next to Killian's."
Bush liesAWOL Opinion
From What Is Bush Hiding? by E. J. Dionne Jr.
Bush could end this [National Guard] story now so we could get to the real issues of 2004. It would require only that the president take an hour or so with reporters to make clear what he did and did not do in the Guard. He may have had good reasons for ducking that physical exam. Surely he can explain the gaps in his service and tell us honestly whether any pull was used to get him into the Guard.
But a guy who is supposed to be so frank and direct turns remarkably Clintonian where the National Guard issue is concerned. "I met my requirements and was honorably discharged" is Bush's stock answer, which does old Bill proud. And am I the only person exasperated by a double standard that treated everything Bill Clinton ever did in his life ("I didn't inhale") as fair game but now insists that we shouldn't sully ourselves with any inconvenient questions about Bush's past?
I'm as weary as you are that our politics veer away from what matters - Iraq, terrorism, health care, jobs - and get sidetracked into personal issues manufactured by political consultants and ideological zealots. But the Bush campaign has made clear it wants this election to focus on character and leadership. If character is the issue, the president's life, past and present, matters just as much as John Kerry's.
Dan Rather has answered his critics. Now it is Bush's turn.
Commander's family calls for CBS apology for flawed report
BY JACK DOUGLAS JR. AND MIKE LEE
Knight Ridder Newspapers
FORT WORTH, Texas - (KRT) - The son of a late commander in the Texas Air National Guard said Monday that CBS owes his family an apology for airing documents - now believed to be false - that purportedly were of his father criticizing President Bush's service as a young man in the Guard.
"I'm not surprised," said Gary Killian of Houston. Earlier in the day, CBS issued a statement saying it was a "mistake, which we deeply regret," to use four memos that allegedly came from Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, a Guard commander over Bush in the early 1970s.
CBS News President Andrew Heyward said in a statement: "Based on what we now know, CBS News cannot prove that the documents are authentic ... ."
The network also named Bill Burkett, a rancher who lives near Baird, in West Texas, as their source for the memos.
Neither Burkett, a former commander in the Guard, nor his lawyer, David Van Os of San Antonio, returned repeated phone calls Monday. But Burkett acknowledged in an interview with CBS News anchor Dan Rather on Monday night that he misled the network about the source of the documents; he nevertheless defended the truthfulness of the information. . . . . . . . . .
Originally posted by: burnedout
Gary Killian calls on "See BS" to apologize.
Knight Ridder
Commander's family calls for CBS apology for flawed report
BY JACK DOUGLAS JR. AND MIKE LEE
Knight Ridder Newspapers
FORT WORTH, Texas - (KRT) - The son of a late commander in the Texas Air National Guard said Monday that CBS owes his family an apology for airing documents - now believed to be false - that purportedly were of his father criticizing President Bush's service as a young man in the Guard.
"I'm not surprised," said Gary Killian of Houston. Earlier in the day, CBS issued a statement saying it was a "mistake, which we deeply regret," to use four memos that allegedly came from Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, a Guard commander over Bush in the early 1970s.
CBS News President Andrew Heyward said in a statement: "Based on what we now know, CBS News cannot prove that the documents are authentic ... ."
The network also named Bill Burkett, a rancher who lives near Baird, in West Texas, as their source for the memos.
Neither Burkett, a former commander in the Guard, nor his lawyer, David Van Os of San Antonio, returned repeated phone calls Monday. But Burkett acknowledged in an interview with CBS News anchor Dan Rather on Monday night that he misled the network about the source of the documents; he nevertheless defended the truthfulness of the information. . . . . . . . . .
Gary Killian retired from the Texas National Guard in 1991. He was also assigned to the unit at the same time his father and Bush served.Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Like a 19 year old kid knew what was going on at the time. Buwhahahah
*shrug* I don't know if Bush shirked his duties or not or even if I really care, but then again, that's not what this thread is about, now is it? Check the title - "Rathergate." This isn't about Bush at all, it's about CBS and their apparent lack of journalistic integrity and process. It's about a fake document, not the possible implications from its contents. There are dozens of other threads about Bush and one 'sticky' that is specifically dedicated to the topic of his Guard performance, or lack thereof.Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Bush is lying and someday the truth will come out. I certainly believe Knox. Knox was certainly in a position to know the truth more then any document expert. How conviently that simple fact is overlooked. LOL The truth is what's important IMO and I don't believe GWB is capable of telling the American public the truth. He has proven that time and time again. It is just one lie after another from him.
Bush is lying and people are dying
Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
*shrug* I don't know if Bush shirked his duties or not or even if I really care, but then again, that's not what this thread is about, now is it? Check the title - "Rathergate." This isn't about Bush at all, it's about CBS and their apparent lack of journalistic integrity and process. It's about a fake document, not the possible implications from its contents. There are dozens of other threads about Bush and one 'sticky' that is specifically dedicated to the topic of his Guard performance, or lack thereof.Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Bush is lying and someday the truth will come out. I certainly believe Knox. Knox was certainly in a position to know the truth more then any document expert. How conviently that simple fact is overlooked. LOL The truth is what's important IMO and I don't believe GWB is capable of telling the American public the truth. He has proven that time and time again. It is just one lie after another from him.
Bush is lying and people are dying
Why not post your "STFU and quit whining like a bunch of little girly boys" antics in that thread, where they are not quite as off-topic as they are here? You are oft quick to spout off about being partisan and close-minded, but you are rapidly becoming the liberal version of Riprorin-esque poster. And your attitude of "who cares if it's fake, look at the bigger picture" is rather tired and irrelevant. Why not simply reduce every single thread to the point where we say "Who cares about X - there are children dying every day of starvation and AIDS!" It may be true, but it adds nothing to the discussion. :disgust:
Originally posted by: Harvey
My physical and mental health are fine, and that's not paranoia; it's fact. It is well documented by the 9/11 Commission and others that the administration was prioritizing plans to invade Iraq since they first came to office. They viewed on any scant, questionable hint of intelligence with an eye that would support for their position, they actively solicited and encouraged others to write reports slanted toward their views, and they ignored any input that ran contrary to thier goals.Originally posted by: Buz2b
Harvey,
You need to take a chill pill my friend because all that paranoid activity is going to drive up your blood pressure. Not good for your health!
We don't have to review that whole discussion, here. Dan Rather and 60 Minutes were obviously professionally remiss in not verifying the reliablity of their information and sources before including the memos in their story. Rather, himself, simply stated he and 60 Minutes were wrong, and he offers no exuses for this lapse.
If you believe Rather should be forced to resign for this, I believe it is reasonable to apply the same standard to anyone in the Bush administration who ignored the facts presented to them. There was no Al Quaeda connection. There were no WMD's. There was no yellow cake uranium. There were no nuclear facilities. There were no chemical facilities. There were no long range rockets.
Finally, and most importantly, NO ONE DIED as a result of Rathers' actions. THOUSANDS HAVE DIED as a direct result of the Bush admin's professional incompetence and malfeasance.
Even if Kerry is elected, thousands more will die before anyone can do anything to improve the situation. That is not an excuse to allow the same stupid administration to continue the same stupid policies that got us into this mess.
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
*shrug* I don't know if Bush shirked his duties or not or even if I really care, but then again, that's not what this thread is about, now is it? Check the title - "Rathergate." This isn't about Bush at all, it's about CBS and their apparent lack of journalistic integrity and process. It's about a fake document, not the possible implications from its contents. There are dozens of other threads about Bush and one 'sticky' that is specifically dedicated to the topic of his Guard performance, or lack thereof.Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Bush is lying and someday the truth will come out. I certainly believe Knox. Knox was certainly in a position to know the truth more then any document expert. How conviently that simple fact is overlooked. LOL The truth is what's important IMO and I don't believe GWB is capable of telling the American public the truth. He has proven that time and time again. It is just one lie after another from him.
Bush is lying and people are dying
Why not post your "STFU and quit whining like a bunch of little girly boys" antics in that thread, where they are not quite as off-topic as they are here? You are oft quick to spout off about being partisan and close-minded, but you are rapidly becoming the liberal version of Riprorin-esque poster. And your attitude of "who cares if it's fake, look at the bigger picture" is rather tired and irrelevant. Why not simply reduce every single thread to the point where we say "Who cares about X - there are children dying every day of starvation and AIDS!" It may be true, but it adds nothing to the discussion. :disgust:
Then why don't you tell all the other OT posters that even though Rather cannot prove the documents to be genuine, it in no way proves the underlying story to be false. Rather still thinks the gist of the story is true.
I guess this thread isn't about the truth, now is it. It is just about bashing liberals or as you rightie like to call us, Bush haters.
Are you serious? Wow.Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
this is hysterical!!!!
Burkett is now going to SUE CBS for breach of contract!!
God what a great country....
Originally posted by: burnedout
Are you serious? Wow.Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
this is hysterical!!!!
Burkett is now going to SUE CBS for breach of contract!!
God what a great country....
I'd wager that Burkett retains the services of none other than TX Supreme Court candidate David Van Os.
Originally posted by: CaptainGoodnight
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
*shrug* I don't know if Bush shirked his duties or not or even if I really care, but then again, that's not what this thread is about, now is it? Check the title - "Rathergate." This isn't about Bush at all, it's about CBS and their apparent lack of journalistic integrity and process. It's about a fake document, not the possible implications from its contents. There are dozens of other threads about Bush and one 'sticky' that is specifically dedicated to the topic of his Guard performance, or lack thereof.Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Bush is lying and someday the truth will come out. I certainly believe Knox. Knox was certainly in a position to know the truth more then any document expert. How conviently that simple fact is overlooked. LOL The truth is what's important IMO and I don't believe GWB is capable of telling the American public the truth. He has proven that time and time again. It is just one lie after another from him.
Bush is lying and people are dying
Why not post your "STFU and quit whining like a bunch of little girly boys" antics in that thread, where they are not quite as off-topic as they are here? You are oft quick to spout off about being partisan and close-minded, but you are rapidly becoming the liberal version of Riprorin-esque poster. And your attitude of "who cares if it's fake, look at the bigger picture" is rather tired and irrelevant. Why not simply reduce every single thread to the point where we say "Who cares about X - there are children dying every day of starvation and AIDS!" It may be true, but it adds nothing to the discussion. :disgust:
Then why don't you tell all the other OT posters that even though Rather cannot prove the documents to be genuine, it in no way proves the underlying story to be false. Rather still thinks the gist of the story is true.
I guess this thread isn't about the truth, now is it. It is just about bashing liberals or as you rightie like to call us, Bush haters.
You still lack "Preponderance of Evidence"
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
this is hysterical!!!!
Burkett is now going to SUE CBS for breach of contract!!
God what a great country....
according to Burkett
"CBS is "an organization with a total lack of moral or journalistic integrity."
HAHAHAHHA
call out the trial lawyers
sue CBS sue Dan Rather
blood in the water!!
call in the sharks/lawyers!!
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Then why don't you tell all the other OT posters that even though Rather cannot prove the documents to be genuine, it in no way proves the underlying story to be false. Rather still thinks the gist of the story is true.
I guess this thread isn't about the truth, now is it. It is just about bashing liberals or as you rightie like to call us, Bush haters.
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
this is hysterical!!!!
Burkett is now going to SUE CBS for breach of contract!!
God what a great country....
according to Burkett
"CBS is "an organization with a total lack of moral or journalistic integrity."
HAHAHAHHA
call out the trial lawyers
sue CBS sue Dan Rather
blood in the water!!
call in the sharks/lawyers!!
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Post the link
Originally posted by: Ozoned
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Post the link
Don't need a link. Just a story. Remember?
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: Ozoned
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Post the link
Don't need a link. Just a story. Remember?
I've got lots of stories, hehe.
Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Then why don't you tell all the other OT posters that even though Rather cannot prove the documents to be genuine, it in no way proves the underlying story to be false. Rather still thinks the gist of the story is true.
I guess this thread isn't about the truth, now is it. It is just about bashing liberals or as you rightie like to call us, Bush haters.
??? Meh..
1) I am, by no means, any sort of "authoritative" figure in this discussion, and I do apologize if I came off as such. I feel no need to "tell the other OT posters" anything. As I read through this discussion, yours was the only post that "stood out," and not in a good way, and I felt the urge to comment. Nothing more than that.
2) I would not be at all surprised if it was discovered that Bush missed some physical because he had alcohol or drugs in his system and pulled as many strings as possible to get out of the situation. But the simple fact remains that it appears the document used as "proof" of this was a fake. The very idea that *somebody* felt the need to falsify reports and provide forged documents to prove Bush was in the wrong is a very telling issue, IMO. If there was so much evidence against him, as you state, why in the hell would somebody make an very poor forgery as part of the evidence? Doesn't that seem a little odd to you? Why take that chance? That does not mean that the implication may not be true, but it sure doesn't bode well for his accusers, now does it?
3) Who the hell cares what "Rather thinks it's true"? He has just proven is inability to be an accurate judge of right vs wrong, so who gives flying fvck what he thinks anymore?
4) I'm terribly sorry you feel somehow victimized by the 'righties' on this board. But that seems like a personal problem, now doesn't it? Who the hell is 'bashing liberals' in this thread? This entire thread is about CBS's seemingly unjustified Bush-bashing. Sorry if you don't feel like you are getting an appropriate amount of sympathy for siding with an obviously flawed perspective. You picked your position, not us 'righties.' :roll: