Real Christians or freeloading fools?

[Zebo]

I am really humbled by the reactions of the Amish to the man whom slaughtered 5 of their young girls. Not only were half the attendees at this mans funeral Amish, they set up a fund for his wife and children.

In Jesus' Sermon on the Mount Jesus says:

"You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth.' But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you." (Matthew 5:38-42, NIV)

Obviously the Amish live by this code making them extremely devout as opposed to some who never seen a war they didn't like.

I think the Amish allowed to practice their extreme pacifisim only because they live in the most powerful nation on earth with a heavy police protection from outside world. Totally insulated from extinction or at best persecution and second class status.. I also think they would all be slaughterd like lambs if they lived almost any place else and there would be no Amish. What do you think?

 

[Todd33]

We finally find a group of Christians that seem to practice what they preach and we pick on them?

 

[robphelan]

i think you hit the nail on the head but for the wrong reason... i think the gov't allows them to practice their extreme way of live BECAUSE of their pacifism.

if they were the branch davidians or lived near ruby ridge, it would be a different story.

 

[blackangst1]

I dunno the majority of Christians I meet are forgiving. I have met many in church who have been molested, raped, robbed, whatever, and they forgive their attackers. I dont think it's as uncommon as you think.

 

[yllus]

We're all products of our environment. They do live a relatively charmed life, but that's them making the most out of the opportunities the nation affords them.

 

[steppinthrax]

I haven't met many who actually practice what they preach anyway.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Todd33
We finally find a group of Christians that seem to practice what they preach and we pick on them?

So Bush should have built a memorial to the hijackers to be true? Hand the 'football' to Osama as a cheek turning gesture?

And I'm not picking on them. I'm moved on the one hand and on the other I question thier freeloading status, never joining the military, police or even paying taxes that protect them. Finally, is it even viable for every Christian to live according to Matthew 5:38-42? Seems pragmatism and survival instict won out among most.

Incidently - this kill or be killed corundum is what spured Islam in the first place after Assyrian Christians found themselves lambs for the slaughter they needed something with a defense mechanism built in Mo provided that in spades.

 

[ayabe]

I think they are bonafide nuts, but they don't bother me or anyone else. So more power to them.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: Todd33
We finally find a group of Christians that seem to practice what they preach and we pick on them?

So Bush should have built a memorial to the hijackers to be true? Hand the 'football' to Osama as a cheek turning gesture?

And I'm not picking on them. I'm moved on the one hand and on the other I question thier freeloading status, never joining the military, police or even paying taxes that protect them. Finally, is it even viable for every Christian to live according to Matthew 5:38-42? Seems pragmatism and survival instict won out among most.

Incidently - this kill or be killed corundum is what spured Islam in the first place after Assyrian Christians found themselves lambs for the slaughter they needed something with a defense mechanism built in Mo provided that in spades.

The Amish actually do pay taxes, other than Social Security, which they don't collect or pay.

I guess I don't consider them "freeloaders" at all, in that they're self-sufficient. Most Americans don't join the military or serve as policemen either, and in all fairness, no Amish person ever has, or ever would, start a war. They elect to live a very simple life, along with the rewards and costs of that simplicity. I for one admire their decency, even if I wouldn't want to live among them.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: Todd33
We finally find a group of Christians that seem to practice what they preach and we pick on them?

So Bush should have built a memorial to the hijackers to be true? Hand the 'football' to Osama as a cheek turning gesture?

And I'm not picking on them. I'm moved on the one hand and on the other I question thier freeloading status, never joining the military, police or even paying taxes that protect them. Finally, is it even viable for every Christian to live according to Matthew 5:38-42? Seems pragmatism and survival instict won out among most.

Incidently - this kill or be killed corundum is what spured Islam in the first place after Assyrian Christians found themselves lambs for the slaughter they needed something with a defense mechanism built in Mo provided that in spades.

The Amish actually do pay taxes, other than Social Security, which they don't collect or pay.

I guess I don't consider them "freeloaders" at all, in that they're self-sufficient. Most Americans don't join the military or serve as policemen either, and in all fairness, no Amish person ever has, or ever would, start a war. They elect to live a very simple life, along with the rewards and costs of that simplicity. I for one admire their decency, even if I wouldn't want to live among them.

Of course they are hard working and decent peoples. I think it's clear I mean freeloading as in for thier own protection for centuries in USA.

 

[jackschmittusa]

Although I could never see myself practicing any religion, I have great respect for the Amish. They pay a price to be faithful to their beliefs, and do it consistantly. Far too many other "believers" only seem to practice it when it is convienent. They do not try to force others to conform to their beliefs. They are not a burden to our society either, neither adding to the prison population or welfare rolls.

Perhaps we would be a better nation if their were 1000 times as many of them here.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Of course they are hard working and decent peoples. I think it's clear I mean freeloading as in for thier own protection for centuries in USA.

Gotcha. I wasn't really arguing with your post, just adding my two cents to the main topic. I don't really think anyone, other than the God Hates F@gs loonies, really dislikes the Amish.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: Zebo

Of course they are hard working and decent peoples. I think it's clear I mean freeloading as in for thier own protection for centuries in USA.

Gotcha. I wasn't really arguing with your post, just adding my two cents to the main topic. I don't really think anyone, other than the God Hates F@gs loonies, really dislikes the Amish.

No one? Thats a conditioned feeling you have of holding Christain values they practice as admirable. JacK too. They wound not last a week in ME or at least relegated to dhimmi status, SE asia aftica etc etc. who would see them as fools and easy prey not admirable. If it wasn't conditioned, and instead as you guys imply, based purly on respecting ones faitfulness to thier beliefs, y'all would have the same admiration for an extremly pious man like Osama and his divisions of suicide bombers? No?

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Zebo

No one? Thats a conditioned feeling you have of holding Christain values they practice as admirable. JacK too. They wound not last a week in ME or at least relegated to dhimmi status, SE asia aftica etc etc. who would see them as fools and easy prey not admirable. If it wasn't conditioned, and instead as you guys imply, based purly on respecting ones faitfulness to thier beliefs, y'all would have the same admiration for an extremly pious man like Osama and his divisions of suicide bombers? No?

Boy, this post is confusing on so many levels that I don't really even begin to understand what you're talking about.

FWIW, I'm not a Christian - I really am not religious at all. I respect the Amish because their belief system is, from my perspective, peaceful, loving, and respectful. Their embracing the family of the schoolhouse killer is just one example of that. I would say the same thing of any Muslim, Jew, Hindu, or Satanist who behaved with similar generosity of spirit. It has nothing to do with their "faithfulness to their beliefs" and everything to do with their treatment of their fellow man.

 

[AreaCode707]

Outside a protective American tolerance, their pacifism would get them wiped out the same way Ghandi and his pacifist movement was wiped out, or the same way the pacifist civil rights movement in the US was wiped out.

And we all know how unsuccessful those were.

 

[Mong0]

We'll see how pacifistic they are when Osama flies a plane into one of their barns.

 

[AreaCode707]

Originally posted by: Mong0
We'll see how pacifistic they are when Osama flies a plane into one of their barns.

Somehow I doubt the Amish barns are much of a terrorist target. Could it be because they're pacifistic?

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Mong0
We'll see how pacifistic they are when Osama flies a plane into one of their barns.

What they gonna do... hurt the chickens now... Osama against eggs.... Western Omelets

Besides... Osama Dont Fly... everyone knows that.. scared of heights..

 

[Moonbeam]

You two turkies shouldn't make fun of Mong0. Clearly he was making exactly your points. I'm as sure of it as if I had posted it myself.

 

[sandorski]

"Free loading"?

 

[SilverRaven]

Since from what I know they pay taxes, then I don't see them as freeloading since they choose not to participate in activities that I would not not join as well. In terms of protection...I don't think so either. How are they freeloading on protection? Most are in the middle of America and shun a lot of what we use - I'm sure they have their own means of defending themselves. On an international level, well you don't have an argument from me. They are in the US so they benefit from our strong military indirectly- but I don't think that is freeloading to any SERIOUS degree. Part of why they can be as they are is because they are in a massive community of other Christians. I do think we give them more leeway because they are Christians so they can be extempt from things that we otherwise would not afford others both in terms of practical services and cultural views of them. IF these were another religious group we'd be calling them back asswards all day long and focus on that rather than their "admiration" for living simple.

If they were elsewhere...would it be a different story? I don't know. It depends. Despite what you want to believe, I don't see them in other parts of the world relegated to a lower status. There are other groups like the Yezidis that live in relative seclusion like the Amish and keep to themselves and generally haven't been bothered throughout history.

While I admire their resiliance to maintain their lifestyle, I don't feel their type of life style is realistic to any degree - and ultimately I would think a religious creed needs to be compatable with life to some degree. Shunning the world away from you and closing up simply doesn't work - Despite my distaste towards evangelists who feel the need to convert everyone, I admire that they are willing to work with the world rather than close up.

I think the fact they "shun" the outside will prove to be their undoing because you can never ignore what is going on the outside world. Eventually the world and changes that go around you will break down any barrier that is created...doesn't matter if you block out the world on an individual level or on a massive international level a la Chinese and Japanese (which historically ended up biting them HARD in the arse) - it will always come in. So they best way is to cope with the change and see how to get them to work for the better.

 

[sandorski]

mongo and silver: Logout/ Log back in

 

[Ronstang]

Freeloading? They pay taxes and don't suck from the government teet.....they are a lot of things but freeloading is not one of them.

 

[AreaCode707]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
You two turkies shouldn't make fun of Mong0. Clearly he was making exactly your points. I'm as sure of it as if I had posted it myself.

Dang, I expect that from you but not from a no0b. No0bs have no cleverness that compares to the almighty and lowly Moonbeam.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: sandorski
mongo and silver: Logout/ Log back in

Ah.. the irony...

hehehehhe