Really old thread somebody bumped.

[Rage187]

ouch, 5 to 6 million a tape out.

 

[hans030390]

if i remember correctly, wasnt the R520 supposed to be out before the 7800gtx?

ha, well this is funny. I used to be an ATI fan....but....i dunno...this is pretty funny ati. great job this round.

yeah and then watch the R520 perform alot better than a 7800....and...something bad happens...like i actually get up and move...

hm yeah im done.

 

[Drayvn]

Thats a quick turn around by an ATi fan

 

[blckgrffn]

Being a fan is foolish, spend your budget on what performs the best and has the features you personally find important on the games you play now, because it will take tomorrows vid cards to play tomorrows games

Nat

 

[HDTVMan]

Originally posted by: Drayvn
"I just cannot understand one thing. How come ATI was able to ship millions of R500, Xbox 360 chips to Microsoft's launch scheduled for October, when it seems to having trouble with yields for the R520? Both chips are using the same new 90 nanometre marchitecture."

But.. But.... ATi arent producing those chips... MS are.

Because Microsoft owns the R500 chip design and could use any foundry and process they choose. They only liscence it from ATI. It could also be clocked lower and first gen might even be 130nm or 110nm but move to 90nm later. Time will tell.

Secondly the R500 and R520 are not the same chip they are different. The R600 will be something similar to what is learned on the R500.

 

[HDTVMan]

Originally posted by: HDTVMan

Originally posted by: Drayvn
"I just cannot understand one thing. How come ATI was able to ship millions of R500, Xbox 360 chips to Microsoft's launch scheduled for October, when it seems to having trouble with yields for the R520? Both chips are using the same new 90 nanometre marchitecture."

But.. But.... ATi arent producing those chips... MS are.

Because Microsoft owns the R500 chip design and could use any foundry and process they choose. They only liscence it from ATI. It could also be clocked lower and first gen might even be 130nm or 110nm but move to 90nm later. Time will tell.

Secondly the R500 and R520 are not the same chip they are different. The R600 will be something similar to what is learned on the R500.

If everyone recalls the XBOX 1 GPU was supposed to be clocked higher than what it was released at.

I would assume there is a problem getting ATI chips speed high enough so it can compete with the 7800 than any other real manufacturing problem. A quick redesign and retap should get the speed up enough so that its a competitor.

 

[ryanv12]

If my 6800GT runs COD2 at my 1680x1050 resolution with 2-4x AA and 8x AF and highest details acceptably, I'm not buying a video card for a while

At least not until COD3

 

[fstime]

Anyone else think the Inq is full of crap?

I never trusted info from them.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: HDTVMan

Originally posted by: HDTVMan

Originally posted by: Drayvn
"I just cannot understand one thing. How come ATI was able to ship millions of R500, Xbox 360 chips to Microsoft's launch scheduled for October, when it seems to having trouble with yields for the R520? Both chips are using the same new 90 nanometre marchitecture."

But.. But.... ATi arent producing those chips... MS are.

Because Microsoft owns the R500 chip design and could use any foundry and process they choose. They only liscence it from ATI. It could also be clocked lower and first gen might even be 130nm or 110nm but move to 90nm later. Time will tell.

Secondly the R500 and R520 are not the same chip they are different. The R600 will be something similar to what is learned on the R500.

If everyone recalls the XBOX 1 GPU was supposed to be clocked higher than what it was released at.

I would assume there is a problem getting ATI chips speed high enough so it can compete with the 7800 than any other real manufacturing problem. A quick redesign and retap should get the speed up enough so that its a competitor.

I think you are right. It's probably been done a while at lower clock speeds, but they've seen what the 7800GTX is (or maybe 7800U) and know they need the 600MHz to compete.

(my theory anyway)

 

[HDTVMan]

Originally posted by: BouZouki


Anyone else think the Inq is full of crap?

I never trusted info from them.

I have found that the INQ is pretty much on the ball. They do run risks when publishing before everyone else.

 

[coomar]

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: Rollo
LOL

Remember all the ATI faithful yelling at me earlier this year:
"The R520 is taped out Rollo! It will be here in a couple months!"

Hmmmmm.

Yeah, "we should wait a couple weeks and see the R520" before getting 7800s.
Maybe by Christmas we'll be able to.

I'll be laughing at you Rollo if the 7800GT comes in AGP and can over clock to GTX speeds for 100 dollars cheaper. I mean, the demand for AGP is low, so it should be cheaper...right?

demand is lower, they make less and it would sell it for more, plus its going to have to cost a little more anyways because of the pci-e to agp bridge they have to put on it

 

[BroadbandGamer]

In the meantime I'll be enjoying my 7800 GTX.

If and when ATI comes out with their nex gen card and it does in fact blow away whatever NVIDIA has, I will have no problem selling this GTX on ebay.

I'm loyal to no ONE company.

 

[HDTVMan]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: HDTVMan

Originally posted by: HDTVMan

Originally posted by: Drayvn
"I just cannot understand one thing. How come ATI was able to ship millions of R500, Xbox 360 chips to Microsoft's launch scheduled for October, when it seems to having trouble with yields for the R520? Both chips are using the same new 90 nanometre marchitecture."

But.. But.... ATi arent producing those chips... MS are.

Because Microsoft owns the R500 chip design and could use any foundry and process they choose. They only liscence it from ATI. It could also be clocked lower and first gen might even be 130nm or 110nm but move to 90nm later. Time will tell.

Secondly the R500 and R520 are not the same chip they are different. The R600 will be something similar to what is learned on the R500.

If everyone recalls the XBOX 1 GPU was supposed to be clocked higher than what it was released at.

I would assume there is a problem getting ATI chips speed high enough so it can compete with the 7800 than any other real manufacturing problem. A quick redesign and retap should get the speed up enough so that its a competitor.

I think you are right. It's probably been done a while at lower clock speeds, but they've seen what the 7800GTX is (or maybe 7800U) and know they need the 600MHz to compete.

(my theory anyway)

Exactly what I was thinking. The Xbox 360 doesnt compete directly with something like the 7800. Their goal was all games at 720P and 1080i with Anti Alias or something like that as you figure with 30fps. So whatever Mhz it takes to achieve that and pipelines is what it gets. Goal Achieved then they move on.

With the R520 it has to get past 7800 level or its nothing new and 7800 continues to sell. In fact I would bet the R520 has to get somewhere between 7800 and 7800SLI and 600mhz is what they need.

Die Shrinking the R420 wouldnt work because ATI needs Smart Shader 3.0 becuase its catching on. Thus the R520 is needed and 600Mhz the goal.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

Isn't the 360's CPU clocked at 500MHz? 100MHz more for the 520 is a substantial boost, ATI might be doing this knowing they could strike a big blow and claim the flagship victory even if nVidia releases an "Ultra". 32 pipes should already give them quite the advantage, but at 600MHz, that's a death blow. But I'm not holding my breath.

However the one thing that doesn't make much sense is with ATI's gamble. Why else would they risk going to 90nm if they couldn't stand to gain advantage from it? nVidia did it to try and gain an advantage, however they made some foolish blunders along the way such as with not upgrading to a 256bit memory architecture with the 5800. It seems more likely that ATI believes they've got a winner on their hands, whether or not it is a winner is yet to be determined, it could be a huge blunder pretty much the same as what nVidia did with the 5800U, who knows, they might need the high clock speed to even keep up just as with the 5800U (making it the perfect card for Rollo). However in the past ATI has shown patience in upgrading their non crucial non flagship parts to new silicon first, such as with their 9600 and X800XL, so it seems odd that they should gamble on this round with their flagship, I think it tells us they're either going for the all-in win, or are doing it to merely stay in the game.

It'll be interesting to see what develops.

 

[HDTVMan]

Originally posted by: bunnyfubbles
Isn't the 360's CPU clocked at 500MHz? 100MHz more for the 520 is a substantial boost, ATI might be doing this knowing they could strike a big blow and claim the flagship victory even if nVidia releases an "Ultra". 32 pipes should already give them quite the advantage, but at 600MHz, that's a death blow. But I'm not holding my breath.

However the one thing that doesn't make much sense is with ATI's gamble. Why else would they risk going to 90nm if they couldn't stand to gain advantage from it? nVidia did it to try and gain an advantage, however they made some foolish blunders along the way such as with not upgrading to a 256bit memory architecture with the 5800. It seems more likely that ATI believes they've got a winner on their hands, whether or not it is a winner is yet to be determined, it could be a huge blunder pretty much the same as what nVidia did with the 5800U, who knows, they might need the high clock speed to even keep up just as with the 5800U (making it the perfect card for Rollo). However in the past ATI has shown patience in upgrading their non crucial non flagship parts to new silicon first, such as with their 9600 and X800XL, so it seems odd that they should gamble on this round with their flagship, I think it tells us they're either going for the all-in win, or are doing it to merely stay in the game.

It'll be interesting to see what develops.

Im guessing they figured it was safe to move to 90nm seeing that most other chip manufacturers have worked their way into it and were doing well and got most of the bugs out using different manufacturing processes and all.

But something bit them thats for sure.

It also makes sense to go to the smaller die so they can make more chips per wafer. Especially when trasistor counts increase.

Like you said Time will tell and reveal all.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Insomniak

1) It's The Inquirer. Grain of salt.

2) I'm still inclined to believe it. No wonder ATi held on to R300 so long - looks like they have serious issues designing new cores.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I mean, originally ATI designed regular 2D graphics cards. NVIDIA was 3D from the start, weren't they? I don't know, I'm just 'wild guessing'.

 

[g3pro]

Well, ATi is f***ed, exactly as I predicted. And the 8800 will be competing with the R520, and the 7800 will be competing with the X800-series, just as I had predicted.


What say you, ATi fanbois?

 

[ronnn]

Nice to see the op and the salesman take the inquirer as gospel. Must be a first! Anyways all is not lost. If the R580 eventually surpasses Nvidia (lower cost for same performance) and xbox 360 is out and selling well - will be the same cast of characters on different sides of the fence casting their lines. Personally I am waiting to see the midrange lineups before pronouncing ATI dead.

 

[Killrose]

Originally posted by: g3pro

What say you, ATi fanbois?

Be prepared to be pawned by the mighty R520 nvidot!!, once in production, the rumbling sounds of moving R520 GPU chips reminicent of mighty heards of Buffalo you will hear!!

Cheap, homeless 7800's for all!!

:beer:

 

[HDTVMan]

I dont really see any fanboy reactions except now with the last couple posts.

There is no doubt Nvidia is leading and most definatly caught ATI with thier pants down.

What everyone wants is some competition so prices are reduced from the significant high they are at right now.

I actually wish there was some more competion like the old days becuase these 600 video card prices are sick when most people in here dont pay that much for a CPU with Motherboard and Ram.

 

[nitromullet]

Be prepared to be pawned by the mighty R520 nvidot!!

Pawned? How much do you think ATI can get for a nVidia fanboy?

once in production, the rumbling sounds of moving R520 GPU chips reminicent of mighty heards of Buffalo you will hear!!

I'll keep my 7800GTX, it's pretty quiet and doesn't take up nearly as many slots as a heard of Buffalo.

 

[So]

Originally posted by: nitromullet

Be prepared to be pawned by the mighty R520 nvidot!!

Pawned? How much do you think ATI can get for a nVidia fanboy?

once in production, the rumbling sounds of moving R520 GPU chips reminicent of mighty heards of Buffalo you will hear!!

I'll keep my 7800GTX, it's pretty quiet and doesn't take up nearly as many slots as a heard of Buffalo.

Also, significantly less noisy.

 

[blckgrffn]

Originally posted by: g3pro
Well, ATi is f***ed, exactly as I predicted. And the 8800 will be competing with the R520, and the 7800 will be competing with the X800-series, just as I had predicted.


What say you, ATi fanbois?

Check Avalons sig, you should be able to find a post of his somewhere around here...

Nat

 

[HDTVMan]

Originally posted by: So

Originally posted by: nitromullet

Be prepared to be pawned by the mighty R520 nvidot!!

Pawned? How much do you think ATI can get for a nVidia fanboy?

once in production, the rumbling sounds of moving R520 GPU chips reminicent of mighty heards of Buffalo you will hear!!

I'll keep my 7800GTX, it's pretty quiet and doesn't take up nearly as many slots as a heard of Buffalo.

Also, significantly less noisy.

LOL.
Who cares if they are both 500-600 each they wont make a noise in any of my computers because I wont buy one.

Besides 100 vs 120fps means nothing if you suck at the game or the game itself sucks.

Also developers release games that will work with both manufacturers so its not like owning an R520 or Geforce 7800 means your the only person who can play the latest games. The games are written to cover 2-3 generations of video cards so that they can make the most dollars. They dont care what video card you use. As long as you buy their game and they get money.

Consumer = Pawned when there is no competition.

 

[Creig]

Originally posted by: blckgrffn

Originally posted by: g3pro
Well, ATi is f***ed, exactly as I predicted. And the 8800 will be competing with the R520, and the 7800 will be competing with the X800-series, just as I had predicted.


What say you, ATi fanbois?

Check Avalons sig, you should be able to find a post of his somewhere around here...

Nat

Good one!