Recording HDTV

[Rage187]

I found the instructions HERE.


Went and bought a firewire 6pin to 6pin and had it working in about 30mins.



It records so easy, and the quality is outstanding, the problem is that it records 2.5mbps. Roughly 1gig per 6.66 minutes.

10 gig = 66.66 minutes. So about 20gig per regular movie.




What I'm trying to figure out is why its so big, I know the sound quality has alot to do with it, and trust me, the quality is there, but is it really making the file that big?

Anyone done this before and figure out how to compress the file w/o losing image quality?

BTW I'm uisng VLC to view the files as I'm recording it all as .ts.

 

[Robor]

I'm only guessing but I have a feeling you're seeing why we all don't have big names making cheap HDTV DVR's right now.

If you don't mind, could you list your system specs on the box you're using to do this? Are you using a wireless KB/Mouse to control your box? I've got a spare P4-2.4b/512MB system that I could devote to HDTV recording. Of course, I'd need to purchase a good video card and BIG HD(s) but I'm blown away by HDTV and would love to be able to record some of the shows.

 

[Rage187]

its a AMD 2500 barton in a Shuttle SN45G, 512mb 3200 and a 6800nu. My newest xpc. The tuner is a motorolla 6200 firmware 7.15.


I believe I could do it w/ half the system, as recording takes less then 20-25% of the resources.

 

[MercenaryForHire]

If I could compress HDTV to a much smaller size without losing quality, I'd be driving a Lambo instead of a Civic.

Sorry, dude - it's just that big. Invest in storage. :Q

- M4H

 

[Rage187]

I also dont think the 6800nu is required, I bet I could do it w/ a 440mx. But the only cards in the house are a 6800NU and a GT.

 

[manko]

NullPacketStripper will cut down your file sizes a lot (maybe 20GB > 12GB), without losing quality. Search on AVS Forum for more info.

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: manko
NullPacketStripper will cut down your file sizes a lot (maybe 20GB > 12GB), without losing quality. Search on AVS Forum for more info.

:Q

That's news to me. Awesome stuff!

- M4H

 

[gsellis]

Originally posted by: Rage187
It records so easy, and the quality is outstanding, the problem is that it records 2.5mbps. Roughly 1gig per 6.66 minutes.

10 gig = 66.66 minutes. So about 20gig per regular movie.

What I'm trying to figure out is why its so big, I know the sound quality has alot to do with it, and trust me, the quality is there, but is it really making the file that big?

Anyone done this before and figure out how to compress the file w/o losing image quality?

BTW I'm uisng VLC to view the files as I'm recording it all as .ts.

LOL!!! Huge? That is actually small. Standard Def DV is 13GB/hr. HDV streams at 19-25+ Mbps. Welcome to the land of digital video. :laugh:

I just had to get another 250GB drive to finish a video project this weekend (see Hot deals - 250's are now $130 or less - ymmv). So, you may want to get a 'spare' media drive.

 

[rbV5]

Anyone done this before and figure out how to compress the file w/o losing image quality?

You can re-encode the TS files using something like windows media encoder to WMV, but it is lossy. It takes a loooong time to re-encode high resolution video and the methods aren't exactly point and click yet.

Nice job, and welcome to the HD world Maybe with blu-ray, we could just burn a movie to a single disc?

 

[Rage187]

yep, records at 29.7fps.

I'm recording somethng tonite onto a spare 40gig, figured it should be able to hold the 3-4hours I need it for.


I just want to add, you lose nothing when recording, the image and sound quality are absolutley intact.

 

[JackBurton]

Hey Rage, what hardware are you using to capture the HD signal?

Edit: I guess you are using the same hardware as in your link.

 

[Rage187]

its a AMD 2500 barton in a Shuttle SN45G, 512mb 3200 and a 6800nu. My newest xpc. The tuner is a motorolla 6200 firmware 7.15.




as noted, I bet I could do it with less. Probably min would be a 1.5gig, 512mb and a 440mx.


Ive' tried using the Nullpacketstripper, but even after a scan and convert, its still the same size. The scan show PID's as =0. Maybe the file really is just that big.


I recorded a little of everything last night, football, cagefighting, midget wrestling(for real) horse racing, and I also found out my pay channels are not encrypted.

But once again, I can fit 4.33 mins per cd.

 

[Robor]

Unencrypted pay channels? That's cool! What is your HD feed? I wonder if it would work in my area with just a tuner? I would think not since my cablebox is used to decode regular pay channels.

 

[Concillian]

Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire

Sorry, dude - it's just that big. Invest in storage. :Q

- M4H

LoL, yes, buy lots of Seagate drives!
(I'm a Seagate employee, so the previous staement may contain a small bias )

Seriously though, record how you will, then compress to mpeg4.

If you could get this compatible with Linux / MythTV then size could be much less an issue. A co-worker with a MythTV box records in high quality MPEG-2 via the built in encoder in the PVR-250, then the computer runs an MPEG-4 compression program in the background that is constantly re-packing MPEG-2 capped stuff to MPEG-4. When the MPEG-4 version is completely compressed, and the MPEG-2 version is not in use, it deletes the MPEG-2 version. Quality is still pretty good and finished size is MUCH smaller. The MPEG-4 encoder is 'niced' so that it will release CPU resources if needed by something else.

I'm not sure how he set it up, but I'm almost certain it is a reasonably standard function of MythTV.

Also Robor,
with MythTV, you can use a timeshift device with channels that you need to use a box to get. The basic layout is:

Source --> Cable/DISH box --> HTPC --> TV

Then you set up the HTPC with two IR ports, one to accept signals from your normal remote and a second to transmit IR signals to your cable box. The computer then changes the channels on the Cable box as needed and function completely normally. Again, I'm not sure how to set it up, but know it can be done.

I don't think I'd ever get a commercial PVR. Not with the stuff like TiVo is doing (restricting use on PPV channels and certain other situations through an automatic fimware download) and statements that seem to indicate that companies collect and sell information from commercial PVRs. I think an independent PVR is the way to go. Besides, that way it'll be easy for me to use it with no local hard drive so I can keep my main storage centralized on my RAID 5 file server.

 

[manko]

Originally posted by: Rage187
Ive' tried using the Nullpacketstripper, but even after a scan and convert, its still the same size. The scan show PID's as =0. Maybe the file really is just that big.

Hmm, maybe it only works with an over-the-air HDTV tuner card or files from D-VHS. Maybe your cable box > firewire method already strips the null packets, I'm not sure. The crowd at AVS Forums are the experts. A search there will probably turn up useful info on getting it to work (or why it doesn't work with firewire).

Time for you to invest in a DVD-R drive.

 

[Robor]

I currently use a commercial DVR but not TiVo. I've got a Sonic Blue ReplayTV unit and it does a pretty good job. It does use the infrared port to change the channel on my cablebox when it records. I've got commercial skip and with my self upgraded (160GB) HD I get a little over 100 hours of high quality recording. The trouble is it can not record HDTV because there's no DVI or component inputs. A widescreen HD feed looks more "squished" than a standard 4:3 picture.

I saw a DVD/HDTV tuner combo at Best Buy over the weekend. I was considering getting it so I'd have a HDTV tuner I could hook up an antenna but the more I read the more of a PITA it looks to be. If I knew for sure I could get a quality HD signal over air I'd probably do it but I don't want to put up an antenna and have it all be for nothing. Bah, I'm getting off topic here with the over-the-air HD talk.

Thanks for the info!

 

[Tab]

What are the actual HDTV movies stored on? Can you buy them if you wanted too? How much better is it than DVD-Quality? I don't really know much about this

 

[Robor]

I don't think HD-DVD's are available yet, are they?

I don't know the technical specs but in my eyes HDTV blows DVD away in quality. DVD's look great but I turn on HDNet or DiscoveryHD and it's like - WOW!

 

[Rage187]

Originally posted by: Tabb
What are the actual HDTV movies stored on? Can you buy them if you wanted too? How much better is it than DVD-Quality? I don't really know much about this

Cant buy it yet.

Reg DVD is 480P, real HD is 1080i.





Further in the article it exlains how to watch it as a live stream, so technically you dont even need a HDTV, just the tuner.

hint hint...

 

[gsellis]

Originally posted by: Rage187

Originally posted by: Tabb
What are the actual HDTV movies stored on? Can you buy them if you wanted too? How much better is it than DVD-Quality? I don't really know much about this

Cant buy it yet.

Reg DVD is 480P, real HD is 1080i.

HDV is 720p, 1080i. HD includes 1080p. And you thought 1080i was bad... Double it to get 1080p

Hey Rage, you can use WMV-HD with Windows Media 9 codec, but don't expect that 6800 to help (grins, ducks, runs).

Too lazy to look it up... does your 43 have Firewire? This might be a good time for an enclosure and use as an external. I think the 83 (my current lust for a mini) has 3 drive bays, but not sure how much room you have in the 43. I know most of our popular vendors have some <50 firewire/usb enclosures. I have a DVD writer in one and getting ready to get another one for my wife's mobile. If it was on an external, you could take it with you to a friend's house that has a HTPC with firewire.

 

[MornNB]

You can re-encode the TS files using something like windows media encoder to WMV, but it is lossy. It takes a loooong time to re-encode high resolution video and the methods aren't exactly point and click yet.

How can I do that?