Saddam Captured in Tikrit Iraq!!

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: cashman

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: darren

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: darren

Originally posted by: rbloedow
Ahhhh, this just makes today a good day Glad that SOB is in our custody, maybe we can pull some info out of him to help support our argument for war since the beginning

that's a peculiar thing to say...why?
because we bombed and toppled a country, killing thousands of civilians, and tens of thousands of troops, searched every city, interrogated thousands of people, searched the cities, captured their leader. now lets hope we can get him to 'admit' that there's a developed nuclear weapons program (of which we've basically found more or less no evidence). but yea, maybe this man who our government has been calling us a liar all this time will just tell the truth now. what kind of truth is it that we're looking for? sheesh.

bomb now. ask (serious) questions / justify later.

i think the best we could do is throw his sorry as* into the deepest dungeon we got.

I just think he could lead us to some valuable evidence to support the US argument of war, hopefully to get the rest of the world off of our backs. I've always supported the war, but it's obvious that the majority of the other nations in the world were against us - hopefully he'll leaed us to some concrete evidence (just not his word, but physical proff) so we can laugh at these nation, and say with a Nelson laugh "HA - HA, TOLD YA SO!".

rbloedow,
thats my exact point though. if he's the only one that can prove (with concrete enough evidence) that he did something that justifies our toppling of his government and country, then isnt it the case that we've done all of thus without any concrete evidence? that's like gutting a man because he killed somebody and then trying to get him to show us where the corpse is.
theres a good reason why our courts are reluctant to convict someone of murder without a body, cause without the body we dont even know if a crime was committed, much less who did it. theres a reason why the trial comes BEFORE the sentencing, the probable cause comes BEFORE the issuance of the search warrant. we respect the concept of innocent until proven guilty.

~d

But we have plenty of bodies from the mass graves we've found, which is concrete enough for me to justify our actions. I guess I meant to say that we'd be able to get more evidence from him, too add to the pool that we already have.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

You guys are really looking way too much into this. It just had to be done, and it wasn't even up to you.

I agree. There will always be people who are going to bitch and complain about our actions, but at the end of the day, it's the results that matter, and we're getting the results that are needed.

it is my DUTY as a citizen to voice my opinion, otherwise we might as well have a dictator making all the decisions for us

I didn't say there was anything wrong with you voicing your opinion, buy again, at the end of the day it's the results of this war that matter, and they will ultimately eclipse your opinion. Say what you want, but it's falling on deaf ears.

maybe so, but that's because people prefer to stay deaf and blind. listen to both sides, then make your choice, thats the road to logic

I've listened to both sides and have made my decision.

 

[Kalvin00]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

Originally posted by: Ornery
OMG, FoxNews is just twisting the hell out of this story to make Bush look good. It's just sickening...

Unless you have specific examples to cite, go troll somewhere else - We don't want to hear it.

Viper GTS

Word.

 

[FelixDeCat]

/me runs through streets firing cap gun

Thank you President Bush, American Intelligence, The United States armed forces, et. al for this early Christmas present.


I can still here those idiots once cheering for Sadam, "WE! ARE DUMB! WE REALLY LIKE SAD-DAM!"

ha ha. game over baby. game over.

And to all those little crybabies..you should be happy and give credit where credit is due!

 

[Regs]

This holds great honor to our military, specially to the troops that have died there. Great work to our "boys" . Cheers to the lives that cost America to bring such a man to justice. Freedom once again is triumphant.

 

[Danman]

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: cashman

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: darren

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: darren

Originally posted by: rbloedow
Ahhhh, this just makes today a good day Glad that SOB is in our custody, maybe we can pull some info out of him to help support our argument for war since the beginning

that's a peculiar thing to say...why?
because we bombed and toppled a country, killing thousands of civilians, and tens of thousands of troops, searched every city, interrogated thousands of people, searched the cities, captured their leader. now lets hope we can get him to 'admit' that there's a developed nuclear weapons program (of which we've basically found more or less no evidence). but yea, maybe this man who our government has been calling us a liar all this time will just tell the truth now. what kind of truth is it that we're looking for? sheesh.

bomb now. ask (serious) questions / justify later.

i think the best we could do is throw his sorry as* into the deepest dungeon we got.

I just think he could lead us to some valuable evidence to support the US argument of war, hopefully to get the rest of the world off of our backs. I've always supported the war, but it's obvious that the majority of the other nations in the world were against us - hopefully he'll leaed us to some concrete evidence (just not his word, but physical proff) so we can laugh at these nation, and say with a Nelson laugh "HA - HA, TOLD YA SO!".

rbloedow,
thats my exact point though. if he's the only one that can prove (with concrete enough evidence) that he did something that justifies our toppling of his government and country, then isnt it the case that we've done all of thus without any concrete evidence? that's like gutting a man because he killed somebody and then trying to get him to show us where the corpse is.
theres a good reason why our courts are reluctant to convict someone of murder without a body, cause without the body we dont even know if a crime was committed, much less who did it. theres a reason why the trial comes BEFORE the sentencing, the probable cause comes BEFORE the issuance of the search warrant. we respect the concept of innocent until proven guilty.

~d

But we have plenty of bodies from the mass graves we've found, which is concrete enough for me to justify our actions. I guess I meant to say that we'd be able to get more evidence from him, too add to the pool that we already have.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

You guys are really looking way too much into this. It just had to be done, and it wasn't even up to you.

I agree. There will always be people who are going to bitch and complain about our actions, but at the end of the day, it's the results that matter, and we're getting the results that are needed.

it is my DUTY as a citizen to voice my opinion, otherwise we might as well have a dictator making all the decisions for us

I didn't say there was anything wrong with you voicing your opinion, buy again, at the end of the day it's the results of this war that matter, and they will ultimately eclipse your opinion. Say what you want, but it's falling on deaf ears.

maybe so, but that's because people prefer to stay deaf and blind. listen to both sides, then make your choice, thats the road to logic

So you think we should of stayed out of this completely? And let those people over there suffer? Let's say you were over there and you lost your wife and children because of this POS. Then, the United States freed you. I think you may be a little happy. I know that's not all we went over there for, but this part of the war of terrorism. Like it or not, we helped and saved millions of people from future harm.

 

[darren]

Originally posted by: cashman

You guys are really looking way too much into this. It just had to be done, and it wasn't even up to you.

cashman,

yea, this is ATOT, so not looking into it is almost way of life. its called coming here to relax and neff. thats fine. no offense intended when i say that, thats all your post is.
but you are completely WRONG if you think that we are looking way too much into this. somebody's got to.

~d

 

[iamme]

wow!

(we now return you to your regularly scheduled ATOT political flame fest)

 

[Insane3D]

Ornery, I'm only trying to prove a point. If the average US citizen really knew what the US agencies went through on a daily basis, the would go crazy. They hold info from us to have stability in the economy and the country. You seem like a smart person, so you would be able to understand this kind of info if you found it out. But you are only a minority, the majority would take it the wrong way.

Well, I think you've mistaken me for Ornery, but you are correct. I realize the general public doesn't need to know everything, and probably is better off for it. However, if we go to war, and are told it is because it is to protect us from a threat of dangerous weapons, and we find not even a single one, there is a problem.

 

[Ornery]

Originally posted by: Kalvin00

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

Originally posted by: Ornery
OMG, FoxNews is just twisting the hell out of this story to make Bush look good. It's just sickening...

Unless you have specific examples to cite, go troll somewhere else - We don't want to hear it.

Viper GTS

Word.

Come on, they're obviously just so biased... damn.

 

[Danman]

Originally posted by: Insane3D

Insane3D, I'm only trying to prove a point. If the average US citizen really knew what the US agencies went through on a daily basis, the would go crazy. They hold info from us to have stability in the economy and the country. You seem like a smart person, so you would be able to understand this kind of info if you found it out. But you are only a minority, the majority would take it the wrong way.

Well, I think you've mistaken me for Ornery, but you are correct. I realize the general public doesn't need to know everything, and probably is better off for it. However, if we go to war, and are told it is because it is to protect us from a threat of dangerous weapons, and we find not even a single one, there is a problem.

:Q

My bad, you guys have the same avatar, and I just got up. I'm only trying to be civil about this. So what we didn't find any. Then that just gives us the reassurance that there is NONE of over there. We could of just stayed over here contemplating if they do or they don't. Iraq was the middle of the terrorist ring and sooner or later, we were gonna be attacked by someone who was connected with Sadaam's regime.

 

[Fenixgoon]

anyone remmeber UN resolution 1441? he broke it and did not disarm, for 13 years no less. that is, in itself, enough to warrant invasion. not to mention genocide, among other things.

 

[Insane3D]

And to all those little crybabies..you should be happy and give credit where credit is due!

I don't think there is one person here who isn't glad an evil war criminal like Saddam Hussein is now in custody and going to face justice. I think everyone appreciates the men and women or our armed forces for the job they do protecting our way of life as well.

Questioning the government's actions, and disagreeing about the justification for war does not change that...

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
anyone remmeber UN resolution 1441? he broke it and did not disarm, for 13 years no less. that is, in itself, enough to warrant invasion. not to mention genocide, among other things.

I agree, also

 

[KidViciou$]

Originally posted by: cashman
So you think we should of stayed out of this completely? And let those people over there suffer? Let's say you were over there and you lost your wife and children because of this POS. Then, the United States freed you. I think you may be a little happy. I know that's not all we went over there for, but this part of the war of terrorism. Like it or not, we helped and saved millions of people from future harm.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

the ends is not supposed to justify the means my good man, that is not what we stand for.

I've listened to both sides and have made my decision

if you were truly interested in logic, and being correct, you will never have a final decision. you will constantly listen to new facts presented, and base your opinions off of that, from an unbiased standpoint.

 

[Danman]

Originally posted by: darren

Originally posted by: cashman

You guys are really looking way too much into this. It just had to be done, and it wasn't even up to you.

cashman,

yea, this is ATOT, so not looking into it is almost way of life. its called coming here to relax and neff. thats fine. no offense intended when i say that, thats all your post is.
but you are completely WRONG if you think that we are looking way too much into this. somebody's got to.

~d

I'm sorry I meant it that way, I'm just trying to say what is done, is done. There's nothing changing the administration's decisions, they couldn't give a sh!t if some minority group protesting over some bullsh!t reasons. I'm not saying everyone has BS reasons, there are some really good, valid points. Again, the government has more intel on this than any of us. They have been making good choices and they will keep on doing it.

 

[Regs]

Originally posted by: Insane3D

And to all those little crybabies..you should be happy and give credit where credit is due!

I don't think there is one person here who isn't glad a evil war criminal like Saddam Hussein is now in custoday and going to face justice. I think everyone apreciates the men and women or our armed forces for the job they do protecting our way of life as well.

Questioning the government's actions, and disagreeing about the justification for war does not change that...

Exactly. Over 400 soldiers have died for this cause. They are the ones that captured their target. This is their victory today, their moment.

This is the correspondent moment of firemen rising the American Flag over the site of 9/11, 2 years ago.

 

[Danman]

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: cashman
So you think we should of stayed out of this completely? And let those people over there suffer? Let's say you were over there and you lost your wife and children because of this POS. Then, the United States freed you. I think you may be a little happy. I know that's not all we went over there for, but this part of the war of terrorism. Like it or not, we helped and saved millions of people from future harm.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

the ends is not supposed to justify the means my good man, that is not what we stand for.

I've listened to both sides and have made my decision

if you were truly interested in logic, and being correct, you will never have a final decision. you will constantly listen to new facts presented, and base your opinions off of that, from an unbiased standpoint.

Answer my question!? Stop bullshitting around and just answer it?! Cannot you not answer one question or you do you have to sway your way around it?!

 

[KidViciou$]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
anyone remmeber UN resolution 1441? he broke it and did not disarm, for 13 years no less. that is, in itself, enough to warrant invasion. not to mention genocide, among other things.

You did say UN resolution 1441, right? I could have swore you said US resolution 1441

 

[Insane3D]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
anyone remmeber UN resolution 1441? he broke it and did not disarm, for 13 years no less. that is, in itself, enough to warrant invasion. not to mention genocide, among other things.

When we went to war, there were inspectors in Iraq doing their job...we said there wasn't enough time to let them complete it...

I agree they flaunted the resolutions for many years, but they were contained. Regardless, Saddam was supposed to disarm any WMD's he had, and well, so far, it appears he did.

 

[Danman]

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
anyone remmeber UN resolution 1441? he broke it and did not disarm, for 13 years no less. that is, in itself, enough to warrant invasion. not to mention genocide, among other things.

You did say UN resolution 1441, right? I could have swore you said US resolution 1441

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: cashman
So you think we should of stayed out of this completely? And let those people over there suffer? Let's say you were over there and you lost your wife and children because of this POS. Then, the United States freed you. I think you may be a little happy. I know that's not all we went over there for, but this part of the war of terrorism. Like it or not, we helped and saved millions of people from future harm.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

the ends is not supposed to justify the means my good man, that is not what we stand for.

I've listened to both sides and have made my decision

if you were truly interested in logic, and being correct, you will never have a final decision. you will constantly listen to new facts presented, and base your opinions off of that, from an unbiased standpoint.

I never said my decision was final, there's a big difference. NO decision can ever be really be final, but I have yet to see any real facts presented in this thread to make any real decision.

 

[KidViciou$]

Originally posted by: cashman

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: cashman
So you think we should of stayed out of this completely? And let those people over there suffer? Let's say you were over there and you lost your wife and children because of this POS. Then, the United States freed you. I think you may be a little happy. I know that's not all we went over there for, but this part of the war of terrorism. Like it or not, we helped and saved millions of people from future harm.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

the ends is not supposed to justify the means my good man, that is not what we stand for.

I've listened to both sides and have made my decision

if you were truly interested in logic, and being correct, you will never have a final decision. you will constantly listen to new facts presented, and base your opinions off of that, from an unbiased standpoint.

Answer my question!? Stop bullshitting around and just answer it?! Cannot you not answer one question or you do you have to sway your way around it?!

settle down! of course if i was in that situation i would be happy! and im glad that they have their freedom. and i support the troops in them doing their honorable jobs. but the issue is not about honor, or valor, it's about politics. and as such, we were politically wrong. there's no getting around that.

 

[KidViciou$]

Originally posted by: cashman

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
anyone remmeber UN resolution 1441? he broke it and did not disarm, for 13 years no less. that is, in itself, enough to warrant invasion. not to mention genocide, among other things.

You did say UN resolution 1441, right? I could have swore you said US resolution 1441

shall i explain?

We acted alone, without the consent of the UN! They created the treaty, they should be the ones to initiate enforcement. If we can supercede them, then they are just an organization to manage all member countries except for the coalition countries.

 

[KidViciou$]

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: cashman
So you think we should of stayed out of this completely? And let those people over there suffer? Let's say you were over there and you lost your wife and children because of this POS. Then, the United States freed you. I think you may be a little happy. I know that's not all we went over there for, but this part of the war of terrorism. Like it or not, we helped and saved millions of people from future harm.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

the ends is not supposed to justify the means my good man, that is not what we stand for.

I've listened to both sides and have made my decision

if you were truly interested in logic, and being correct, you will never have a final decision. you will constantly listen to new facts presented, and base your opinions off of that, from an unbiased standpoint.

I never said my decision was final, there's a big difference. NO decision can ever be really be final, but I have yet to see any real facts presented in this thread to make any real decision.

and as such, i have not seen any threads that make me think invading Iraq was right. In my heart it might be the right decision, but in my brain it was not. it's just a question of which has more precedence, and i choose my brain as it tends to do a lot more thinking!


but for now, i must bid you all ado, as i must go shovel the snow, and catch a little shuteye before studying for my finals tomorrow (i've been up all night and goign strong!)

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: KidViciou$

Originally posted by: cashman
So you think we should of stayed out of this completely? And let those people over there suffer? Let's say you were over there and you lost your wife and children because of this POS. Then, the United States freed you. I think you may be a little happy. I know that's not all we went over there for, but this part of the war of terrorism. Like it or not, we helped and saved millions of people from future harm.

well, according to US law, we were not supposed to know about those graves. we only found them after invading. don't get me wrong, Iraq is better off without Hussein and the gang, but we did not follow our own rules here. (maybe i need to readup on international rules of war )

the ends is not supposed to justify the means my good man, that is not what we stand for.

I've listened to both sides and have made my decision

if you were truly interested in logic, and being correct, you will never have a final decision. you will constantly listen to new facts presented, and base your opinions off of that, from an unbiased standpoint.

I never said my decision was final, there's a big difference. NO decision can ever be really be final, but I have yet to see any real facts presented in this thread to make any real decision.

and as such, i have not seen any threads that make me think invading Iraq was right. In my heart it might be the right decision, but in my brain it was not. it's just a question of which has more precedence, and i choose my brain as it tends to do a lot more thinking!


but for now, i must bid you all ado, as i must go shovel the snow, and catch a little shuteye before studying for my finals tomorrow (i've been up all night and goign strong!)

Have fun, thanks for the good discussion