Sandra Bland Dashboard Video Released

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Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Similar to the issue in Michigan where the kid flashed his lights.
Attitude escalated the situation and now both people are dead as a result.

People forget that an attitude can get you in trouble. The officer on the initial interaction is usually willing to cut slack if it was nothing serious.
Escalating by attitude starts to make the LEO nervous - they have no idea why the attitude exists - why are they nervous?

There is a similarity between both cases. A dick cop that was on a power trip looking for trouble. In the Michigan case the cop already knew his head lamps were not functioning correctly. It wasnt a matter of if, but when he would run into somebody who gave him trouble. Then he could abuse his position of power. In this case the cop intentionally got under her skin. Then gave a ridiculous order that when refused gave him legal authority to arrest her.

Both cops should not be peace officers after these incidents.
 
Feb 4, 2009
35,862
17,401
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No. Stupid question.

I'll extrapolate to save some time with the rebuttal. Since when does a cop giving an order depend on illegal activity. Can a cop not signal you to use a different lane? Is using a different lane illegal?

Being Devils advocate can a cop see you sitting with your hot wife/girlfriend than ask you to sit somewhere else because he needs to sit in your spot?
I understand the cop wanting the cigarette to be put out. I understand she was difficult to deal with. The problem is his inability to deescalate the situation. He is a paid professional whose duty is to serve the public this isn't an unreasonable expectation to have. Who does it benefit or protect locking her up for what appears to be a very minor infraction. How do the Police expect people in that community to support them if this is how they choose to interact with citizens?
 

cabri

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2012
3,616
1
81
There is a similarity between both cases. A dick cop that was on a power trip looking for trouble. In the Michigan case the cop already knew his head lamps were not functioning correctly. It wasnt a matter of if, but when he would run into somebody who gave him trouble. Then he could abuse his position of power. In this case the cop intentionally got under her skin. Then gave a ridiculous order that when refused gave him legal authority to arrest her.

Both cops should not be peace officers after these incidents.
She already had an attitude with LEO before the officer interacted with her.
she took out that frustration out and caused the situation to escalate from there.
 

Londo_Jowo

Lifer
Jan 31, 2010
17,303
158
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londojowo.hypermart.net
I agree with this, but I really take issue with the posters in this thread (not you) who are turning this into a "pigs vs. freedom" situation.

The officer should have simply given Bland the warning and sent her on her way, whether or not she was being obnoxious, but her behavior seems totally irrational to me. I see no point in being gratuitously rude to police, particularly where they are giving me a warning rather than citing me. I absolutely agree that the officer had a professional duty to be the bigger person and move on, but the kind of attitude she exhibited will never enhance any interaction with anyone, police or otherwise. I would rather just move on with my day than argue with a police officer over nothing. You do get the sense she was spoiling for a fight.

Agree, trooper should have been the bigger person however, I do feel she was looking for a fight and did everything she could to escalate the situation.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
She already had an attitude with LEO before the officer interacted with her.
she took out that frustration out and caused the situation to escalate from there.

Give me a break. The cop was baiting her. Even the police have said his actions were against their policy.

So you are fine with cops escalating traffic violations to the point of arrest? Even through her ranting, which he literally asked her about, he didnt do anything until she refused to put out the cigarette.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,688
126
I find the whole Sandra Bland case sad and strange, and I am gratified the DoJ is investigating it. I wish she had never been arrested in the first place. She and the officer each could have handled this situation better. She could have simply politely cooperated, and he could have given her more room to express herself without escalating the situation.

I'm really disappointed by this equivocation. One is sworn (and paid) to protect and serve the other. I didn't see anything that she did to provoke an arrest until the officer was trying to pull her out of the car and pointing a stun gun at her, but you have legal training so LMK if I'm wrong there.

I agree that her behavior wasn't ideal, but that doesn't seem very relavent. We give officers the authority to use force and arrest people, and in exchange we need to hold them to a much higher standard of behavior.

I absolutely agree. Personally when I am dealing with a traffic stop I make it my job to make the cop as comfortable and sympathetic as possible. Frankly if I had been in Bland's situation and he asked me to put out a cigarette I would just have complied. I can understand being pissed at the cop who pulls you over, but I see no upside to being confrontational with the police.

Yes, I do this too. Mostly because I can't stand to be around police officers and want the encounter to end ASAP. They seem to almost always be snotty, sarcastic assholes.

But neither of us is Sandra Bland, we are not routinely targeted and harassed by law enforcement. I'm interested if you disagree that black people are disproportionatly targeted by police or if you disagree that we should expect that targeting to affect their behavior when they're stopped. If you agree on both counts, I'm not sure how our behavior is relevant here.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
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but her behavior seems totally irrational to me.

To you... A white middle aged lawyer. Black people have a lot of resentment towards police and for good reason. Police should probably understand that at this point and walk on egg shells around black people. Enforce the law but don't go all respect my authority on them.

Again this is another case of black lives dont matter. If you think the next traffic stop is going to be any easier you are mistaken. You can only segment and prey on a minority population for so long before they stop giving you respect.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
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What we are seeing here is what we are seeing around the world... minority populations with internet access can communicate these thoughts with one another and can see exactly how big the problem is. Expect more civil disobedience from people as they attempt to exercise their rights. And I support it 100%.
 

ctbaars

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2009
1,565
160
106
I think this officer broke proper procedure. He has a responsibility to deescalate the situation.
But why did she die? Does this have anything to do with this particular officer?
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
I think this officer broke proper procedure. He has a responsibility to deescalate the situation.
But why did she die? Does this have anything to do with this particular officer?


Maybe she did kill herself. Maybe she was in so much grief about living in a system that would lock her up for 3 days for no reason other then a white cop had a bad attitude towards another minority. Maybe in that state she thought she would make the ultimate sacrifice to make sure her case was heard. Or maybe not.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
I think this officer broke proper procedure. He has a responsibility to deescalate the situation.
But why did she die? Does this have anything to do with this particular officer?

I don't think it has anything to do with this cop. It is just a tragic ending to a terrible situation. At this point is sounds like suicide. But who the fuck really knows now with the way the state acts. That dash cam video they sent out of this incident has edited written all over it. Sure sure technical glitch.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,688
126
Maybe she did kill herself. Maybe she was in so much grief about living in a system that would lock her up for 3 days for no reason other then a white cop had a bad attitude towards another minority. Maybe in that state she thought she would make the ultimate sacrifice to make sure her case was heard. Or maybe not.

She also just started a new job. She probably assumed that she was now going to lose it. The fact that no one bailed her out suggests she didn't have much of a support network. The fact that no-one at the jail recognized she was a suicide risk for 3 days suggests that no one gave a shit about her. When somone is in your custody, it is your responsibility to protect them from harm, even from themselves.

It's exactly like you said, another case of 'black lives don't matter'.
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,168
60
91
She could have been polite and put out the cigarette. She chose to be an impolite criminal that acted belligerently and told the police officer what he could and could not do. Black people just cause their own problems trying to be uppity with a police officer. This may sound like I am against Black people, but I am only trying to show that this is not the way civilized people act. If you resist arrest, the police are required to take their response up to the next level.

All she had to do is put out the cigarette and be polite. She would have probably been issued a ticket and left on her own.
 

mizzou

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2008
9,734
54
91
Wait, are people insinuating that he got her out of the car because she didn't put out her cigarette? He didn't even order her, he said "could you, please"

I thought he asked her to put it out because he was next going to ask her to step out of the car due to her bad attitude. Does the video suggest otherwise?
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,688
126
Wait, are people insinuating that he got her out of the car because she didn't put out her cigarette? He didn't even order her, he said "could you, please"

I thought he asked her to put it out because he was next going to ask her to step out of the car due to her bad attitude. Does the video suggest otherwise?

Did he ever say in the video? I believe she asked him several times.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
She could have been polite and put out the cigarette. She chose to be an impolite criminal that acted belligerently and told the police officer what he could and could not do. Black people just cause their own problems trying to be uppity with a police officer. This may sound like I am against Black people, but I am only trying to show that this is not the way civilized people act. If you resist arrest, the police are required to take their response up to the next level.

All she had to do is put out the cigarette and be polite. She would have probably been issued a ticket and left on her own.


Theres that fucking word. You people are fucking pathetic racist scum.
 

Subyman

Moderator <br> VC&G Forum
Mar 18, 2005
7,876
32
86
Ignoring or even refusing to comply with a cop's order isn't going to win you anything but a free taxi ride to the gray bar hotel. The bolded is the flaw in your reasoning. That was a perfectly legal, reasonable, and simple request. She got uppity about it. That's where she went wrong.


FWIW, the cop can order her out of the car for any reason during a lawful traffic stop. She was wrong to refuse that.

The main difference in view is that you guys are being pragmatic while others are being idealistic. A pragmatist thinks about what is best to get out of the situation, while an idealist wants to be treated appropriately. I would have gotten out of the car, but that doesn't mean I agree with what the cop was doing.

I know I wouldn't want deputy badass in my town, losing his shit over a cigarette.
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,168
60
91
It is all about attitude. If you act aggressive and threatening with the police, they will suspect you are committing a crime and treat you accordingly.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Wait, are people insinuating that he got her out of the car because she didn't put out her cigarette? He didn't even order her, he said "could you, please"

I thought he asked her to put it out because he was next going to ask her to step out of the car due to her bad attitude. Does the video suggest otherwise?

Have you watched the video? When she snaps back that she isnt going to put out her cigarette in her own car. His response is "Well you can step on out now". Before that he was making no motion to get her out of the car. The second she snapped back he got his clipboard ready for her to get out of the car.
 

mizzou

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2008
9,734
54
91
Have you watched the video? When she snaps back that she isnt going to put out her cigarette in her own car. His response is "Well you can step on out now".

Because it's a moot point. I'm sure he already decided she was being arrested anyway. Please put it out. NO. Well, get out anyway then.

Oh well I guess we just have theories at this point. Either way it doesnt make much difference in the grand scheme of things.
 
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