Saw this on firingsquad...

[DJFuji]

Saw this comment on firingsquad's "build a $600 gaming rig" article:

"DellHome - Dimension 9100 with 2.8Ghz P-D 820 Dual Core, 512MB
DDR2 SDRAM, 160GB S-ATA, 16x DVD-Rom, 48x CD-RW, 56k Modem, Win XP
Media Edition 2005 and 17" LCD for $849.15!

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins."

It got me thinking. I wouldn't dare buying a PC if i had the option of building one. But I'm starting to think that with Dell's deals and pricing. maybe custom building is not as economical as it used to be. I don't think any of us could build a PC like that dell for much cheaper. Especially when you consider you'd have to buy the OS and monitor.

Opinions?

 

[DerelictDev]

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins."

Thats not fair though, Dell has a HUGE inventory of dell keyboards and mice not to mention a million DELL XP Cd's. They have contracts with microsoft as well as other companies to get these items for cheap, but consumers on the other hand have to dish out the high price tags on the software.

But otherwise in my opinion you can still make a computer with roughly the same benchmarks for the price, though i admit it may go a bit overbudget but on the other hand you have full upgradability, and also dont have to worry about voiding any crap ;p

 

[Tiamat]

Dell has huge bulk sales. Thats how they can pass the savings through coupons. The normal person can only buy in single pieces through a distributor - so we incur extra hidden fees that buying bulk would not see.

If there are no Dell Coupons or Price slashes, building your own computer will win in terms of performance for dollar.

 

[Gadzookie]

plus you wont get quality parts as if you were to build your own

 

[Hyperlite]

Originally posted by: Gadzookie
plus you wont get quality parts as if you were to build your own

i think we have known for a long time that you could build a comperable dell system for less money, but its the quality of the work at question here. No way in hell can dell match the quality of the systems we build.

 

[Elcs]

Originally posted by: Gadzookie
plus you wont get stuck with Intel if you were to build your own

Quote fixed.

I think the premium of building my own PC Vs. Dell is worth it, not just because Im mainly a gamer and quiet PC lover.

Knowing exactly what goes into my pc and knowing how effective/quiet/powerful they are is an added comfort. Dislike Dell's propriety possibilities as well.

 

[Pariah]

You also get tech support when you buy a Dell and a one stop location for warranty services. I know all the uber elite haxors here have no need for tech support, but if you are building a system for a friend or family member, I'll be damned if I want to get woken up at 2 am because their computer decided to crash and little Jill has a term paper due the next day, or someone put peanut butter in the dvd drive. Screw that, I'll gladly buy a Dell or other OEM system for someone else to avoid those headaches even if the Dell doesn't win all the benchmarks.

 

[mezrah]

Originally posted by: DJFuji
Saw this comment on firingsquad's "build a $600 gaming rig" article:

"DellHome - Dimension 9100 with 2.8Ghz P-D 820 Dual Core, 512MB
DDR2 SDRAM, 160GB S-ATA, 16x DVD-Rom, 48x CD-RW, 56k Modem, Win XP
Media Edition 2005 and 17" LCD for $849.15!

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins."

It got me thinking. I wouldn't dare buying a PC if i had the option of building one. But I'm starting to think that with Dell's deals and pricing. maybe custom building is not as economical as it used to be. I don't think any of us could build a PC like that dell for much cheaper. Especially when you consider you'd have to buy the OS and monitor.

Opinions?

what video card is in this system?

 

[Gadzookie]

lol and i dont think you can overclock a dell

and i think dell uses integrated INTEL graphics

 

[Genx87]

It seems like if you want a good gaming system from Dell the price sky rockets. No doubt their version of the e-machine can go as low as 239 bucks. But what do you get for that money? Not very much, that I can tell you!

 

[mezrah]

Well it has media center 2005...so does it have integrated graphics and a tv tuner?

 

[DJFuji]

Im hearing a lot of rationlization here. ("but that's not fair/dell is a big company/etc") Fact is, it's still cheaper to buy a Dell. It didn't used to be that way. Doesn't mean i ever will, but now "economics" is no longer in my list of reasons why i build instead of buy. I think te 9100s have a x600 or something. Not quite sure.

On the other hand, i've been recommending MacOS to family and friends because it's better for them to pay the extra premiums and not bug me when their stuff goes down.

 

[Some1ne]

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins

The problem with the Dell system is that they skimp on all the parts they don't advertise, and usually in ways that the average system builder cannot match. Aside from getting a cheap, generic PSU, proprietary, pared-down mainboards are commonly used, generic RAM modules, and so on and so forth. In short, the Dell integrates components that may not be available to the the general public, and that most self-respecting system builders would not use in the first place.

Now, if I were allowed to use my university affiliations to get a free copy of Win XP MCE (through a legitimate program they have), and willing to cut corners everywhere I could get away with, I could probably build a system that would best the Dell.

 

[spazo]

Originally posted by: Some1ne

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins

The problem with the Dell system is that they skimp on all the parts they don't advertise, and usually in ways that the average system builder cannot match. Aside from getting a cheap, generic PSU, proprietary, pared-down mainboards are commonly used, generic RAM modules, and so on and so forth. In short, the Dell integrates components that may not be available to the the general public, and that most self-respecting system builders would not use in the first place.

Now, if I were allowed to use my university affiliations to get a free copy of Win XP MCE (through a legitimate program they have), and willing to cut corners everywhere I could get away with, I could probably build a system that would best the Dell.

Lets see, my dell uses a psu that offers 18amps on each +12v rail. My motherboard is manufuctured by Foxconn, and the generic ram is the same stuff that budgt ram is made of. So how is this skimpping? To me, these are pretty decent parts. Of course, they're not the highest end but for budget conseus consumers, they're not bad either.

 

[mezrah]

Atrix Case with 400W power supply, keyboard, mouse, and speakers $55.99
Chaintech socket 939 $50.00
AMD 64 3000+ $133.38
PQI 512MB DDR400 $37.50
Hitachi 160GB SATA $77.00
LG 17"LCD $163.99
Toshiba DVD Rom $19.99
Rosewill CD Burner $19.99
Radeon AIW 9600 $102.00
Windows XP Media Center 2005 $129.95
Encore 56kbps modem $5.40

TOTAL $795.19

So It's not dual core...but we're talking benchmarks. This will be comparable. And with the extra $55 you can get more ram or step up the processor or get the AIW 9800 Pro

 

[Some1ne]

Manufactured by Foxconn, but is it officially supported by them, or is it a proprietary modification that is only supported through Dell? Does it have all the BIOS settings that a production/consumer Foxconn board does? A good way to check this is see if you can flash the BIOS with an official Foxconn release, or if you have to use BIOS provided through the Dell website. I had a HP system once, and the board was manufactured by MSI, but its model number did not officially exist according to MSI, HP was the only source of support and updates for it...regardless of who manufactured it, it may still be a proprietary model designed exclusively for Dell and with a crippled feature set.

 

[Griffinhart]

Originally posted by: DJFuji
Saw this comment on firingsquad's "build a $600 gaming rig" article:

"DellHome - Dimension 9100 with 2.8Ghz P-D 820 Dual Core, 512MB
DDR2 SDRAM, 160GB S-ATA, 16x DVD-Rom, 48x CD-RW, 56k Modem, Win XP
Media Edition 2005 and 17" LCD for $849.15!

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins."

It got me thinking. I wouldn't dare buying a PC if i had the option of building one. But I'm starting to think that with Dell's deals and pricing. maybe custom building is not as economical as it used to be. I don't think any of us could build a PC like that dell for much cheaper. Especially when you consider you'd have to buy the OS and monitor.

Opinions?

Dell, certainly, is cheap. But, there are several reasons why I wouldn't buy a Dell desktop for me. Price isn't the reason though. I don't save much if anything when I build a PC.

The reasons are:
Quality: I tend to use higher end componants that Dell. And I know exactly what I am putting into my machine.
Upgradability: A home built PC, in general, has more opportunity for upgrades. Chances are, with Dell, I couldn't just swap the Processor, Upgrading the Motherboard to something with more options simply won't happen either.
No uneeded software installed: The very first thing I had to do on my Dell Laptop, was take hours to uninstall and remove dozens of demo's/applications/utilities I didn't need. Most of which did nothing more than drastically slow down my system performance.
I don't want or need everything that is included: Take this system as an example.
Dimension 9100 with 2.8Ghz P-D 820 Dual Core I wouldn't use this processor. Of what's currently available, I wouldn't touch an intel Dual Core chip. I would go AMD and that's simply not an option Dell has.
512MB DDR2 SDRAM for a gaming PC? Simply not what I would get.
160GB S-ATA One of the few things I don't have a problem with.
16x DVD-Rom, 48x CD-RW I wouldn't buy two drives. I would buy 1 DVD burner.
56k Modem I wouldn't buy one. I have no use for a modem.
Win XP Media Edition 2005 Another thing I wouldnt buy. I Love my Media Center, but a PC without a TV tuner Card has no real need for MCE 2005 in my opinion. Besides, I have legal copies of WinXP Pro, Home and x64 that I can transfer to any PC I build.
17" LCD again, something I don't need as it would be a downgrade from what I currently use.

I wouldn't use the dell keyboard or mouse either as I use better.

Finally, the ATI x300 integrated video w/ 128MB isn't something I would use on a gaming PC either.

It's not that the Dell isn't a good deal. It's that the Dell isn't a system that would meet my needs. Plus, I also enjoy the PC building project.

I gladly recommend them to my sister and her kids. Just not for me. Dell just doesn't have the options I am looking for. And the PC's that are closer to my needs tend to be as expensive as the ones I can build on my own.

I do agree, however, that times have changed. Pre-Built PC's are no longer as expensive as they used to be, compared to home built PC's.

 

[Griffinhart]

Originally posted by: mezrah
Well it has media center 2005...so does it have integrated graphics and a tv tuner?

According to the Dell site, it has a 128MB ATI x300 integrated Video adapter. Pretty low end as far as games go. And no, it doesn't have a TV Tuner.

 

[kitkat22]

I got to about $950 with those specs.

 

[Maluno]

Originally posted by: Griffinhart

Originally posted by: DJFuji
Saw this comment on firingsquad's "build a $600 gaming rig" article:

"DellHome - Dimension 9100 with 2.8Ghz P-D 820 Dual Core, 512MB
DDR2 SDRAM, 160GB S-ATA, 16x DVD-Rom, 48x CD-RW, 56k Modem, Win XP
Media Edition 2005 and 17" LCD for $849.15!

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins."

It got me thinking. I wouldn't dare buying a PC if i had the option of building one. But I'm starting to think that with Dell's deals and pricing. maybe custom building is not as economical as it used to be. I don't think any of us could build a PC like that dell for much cheaper. Especially when you consider you'd have to buy the OS and monitor.

Opinions?

Dell, certainly, is cheap. But, there are several reasons why I wouldn't buy a Dell desktop for me. Price isn't the reason though. I don't save much if anything when I build a PC.

The reasons are:
Quality: I tend to use higher end componants that Dell. And I know exactly what I am putting into my machine.
Upgradability: A home built PC, in general, has more opportunity for upgrades. Chances are, with Dell, I couldn't just swap the Processor, Upgrading the Motherboard to something with more options simply won't happen either.
No uneeded software installed: The very first thing I had to do on my Dell Laptop, was take hours to uninstall and remove dozens of demo's/applications/utilities I didn't need. Most of which did nothing more than drastically slow down my system performance.
I don't want or need everything that is included: Take this system as an example.
Dimension 9100 with 2.8Ghz P-D 820 Dual Core I wouldn't use this processor. Of what's currently available, I wouldn't touch an intel Dual Core chip. I would go AMD and that's simply not an option Dell has.
512MB DDR2 SDRAM for a gaming PC? Simply not what I would get.
160GB S-ATA One of the few things I don't have a problem with.
16x DVD-Rom, 48x CD-RW I wouldn't buy two drives. I would buy 1 DVD burner.
56k Modem I wouldn't buy one. I have no use for a modem.
Win XP Media Edition 2005 Another thing I wouldnt buy. I Love my Media Center, but a PC without a TV tuner Card has no real need for MCE 2005 in my opinion. Besides, I have legal copies of WinXP Pro, Home and x64 that I can transfer to any PC I build.
17" LCD again, something I don't need as it would be a downgrade from what I currently use.

I wouldn't use the dell keyboard or mouse either as I use better.

Finally, the ATI x300 integrated video w/ 128MB isn't something I would use on a gaming PC either.

It's not that the Dell isn't a good deal. It's that the Dell isn't a system that would meet my needs. Plus, I also enjoy the PC building project.

I gladly recommend them to my sister and her kids. Just not for me. Dell just doesn't have the options I am looking for. And the PC's that are closer to my needs tend to be as expensive as the ones I can build on my own.

I do agree, however, that times have changed. Pre-Built PC's are no longer as expensive as they used to be, compared to home built PC's.

QFT
</thread>

 

[AmberClad]

Originally posted by: spazo

Originally posted by: Some1ne

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins

The problem with the Dell system is that they skimp on all the parts they don't advertise, and usually in ways that the average system builder cannot match. Aside from getting a cheap, generic PSU, proprietary, pared-down mainboards are commonly used, generic RAM modules, and so on and so forth. In short, the Dell integrates components that may not be available to the the general public, and that most self-respecting system builders would not use in the first place.

Now, if I were allowed to use my university affiliations to get a free copy of Win XP MCE (through a legitimate program they have), and willing to cut corners everywhere I could get away with, I could probably build a system that would best the Dell.

Lets see, my dell uses a psu that offers 18amps on each +12v rail. My motherboard is manufuctured by Foxconn, and the generic ram is the same stuff that budgt ram is made of. So how is this skimpping? To me, these are pretty decent parts. Of course, they're not the highest end but for budget conseus consumers, they're not bad either.

Plus, I think people are confusing OEM with generic. Dell uses OEM RAM modules with chips manufactured by Samsung, Micron, Infineon, Hynix, Nanya, etc. Guess where brand name RAM companies like Crucial, OCZ, Corsair, and others get their chips from? Same chip manufacturers.

I do have one huge pet peeve with Dell though, and that would be the fact that you can't just strip them for parts and use the parts with an aftermarket case. For one thing, the Dell Fortron PSU is not standard, and neither is the FoxConn mobo. I don't think it's so much a matter of quality as proprietaryness.

 

[mezrah]

Originally posted by: Griffinhart

Originally posted by: mezrah
Well it has media center 2005...so does it have integrated graphics and a tv tuner?

According to the Dell site, it has a 128MB ATI x300 integrated Video adapter. Pretty low end as far as games go. And no, it doesn't have a TV Tuner.

LOL...what's the point of throwing media center edition in there if you aren't gonna record tv? Anyway, I think the rig I put together is comparable. Obviously it's gonna take come leg work to get all the parts. The only reason to buy dell is the convenience, and maybe the warranty

 

[Kyanzes]

Originally posted by: DJFuji
Saw this comment on firingsquad's "build a $600 gaming rig" article:

"DellHome - Dimension 9100 with 2.8Ghz P-D 820 Dual Core, 512MB
DDR2 SDRAM, 160GB S-ATA, 16x DVD-Rom, 48x CD-RW, 56k Modem, Win XP
Media Edition 2005 and 17" LCD for $849.15!

Take $819.15 and build your best without going over budget and
include everything Dell includes (OS, KB, mouse). Then benchmark
the two and see who wins."

It got me thinking. I wouldn't dare buying a PC if i had the option of building one. But I'm starting to think that with Dell's deals and pricing. maybe custom building is not as economical as it used to be. I don't think any of us could build a PC like that dell for much cheaper. Especially when you consider you'd have to buy the OS and monitor.

Opinions?

I'm not impressed by that config. However it's not me who has to be impressed ofc. I think that stuff is more like an office build. Okay, it has a dual core CPU, the lowest end ofc, I mean it's 2.8GHz P4 after all. Sure the case has a DELL logo on it and looks cool (I guess) but other than that it's just a - relatively - cheap build. If I were you I would surely build my own comp with that money. And you CAN build a very nice comp that can excel in games/work for that much. I also wouldn't buy LCD unless you mostly work on it. Cause for gaming you surely can't get a very good LCD with that budget. As for movies a 17" monitor is very small (by my standards at least). I would buy a used 21" flat monitor. But you are surely won't get robbed blind with that config for that much ofc.

 

[Markbnj]

Didn't bother to read the whole thread, as I am sure everyone said pretty much the same thing, i.e...

Naturally Dell can win on price, since they have huge purchasing power.

The Dell also includes intangibles such as service and support.

Building your own machine will probably get you more mflops/dollar, or whatever performance metric you want to use.

Building your own machine gets you upgradeability going forward.

And it is much more satisfying than talking to Rajib, the support tech from New Delhi, to find out what SKU# you need to get a PSU that will fit.

 

[thecrecarc]

Originally posted by: mezrah
Atrix Case with 400W power supply, keyboard, mouse, and speakers $55.99
Chaintech socket 939 $50.00
AMD 64 3000+ $133.38
PQI 512MB DDR400 $37.50
Hitachi 160GB SATA $77.00
LG 17"LCD $163.99
Toshiba DVD Rom $19.99
Rosewill CD Burner $19.99
Radeon AIW 9600 $102.00
Windows XP Media Center 2005 $129.95
Encore 56kbps modem $5.40

TOTAL $795.19

So It's not dual core...but we're talking benchmarks. This will be comparable. And with the extra $55 you can get more ram or step up the processor or get the AIW 9800 Pro

pwned