Software RAID setup

[gimpyd00]

Hey all, I'm just looking for some critique on a home file server I want to implement.
Currently, I've got six IDE drives, ranging from 160GB to 400GB, in an Antec 1040 case, but I need to backup all of these drives. I'd also like to implement RAID5 since it would cost the least. I realize that each drive should be the same size to make the most effective use of this, so the only drives going to RAID5 will be new drives I purchase that are 300GB.

To accomodate such a large number of HDs, I'm looking at the Lian Li V2000 Plus II. I think I can get away with doing the RAID5 in software on Win2K3, but some of the drives will be IDE and some will be SATA. Can anyone think of a more effective way to house a bunch of HDs? Also, is there a more effective way to make sure my data is safe, beyond software RAID5? Cost is somewhat of a concern, but I'm obviously willing to spend a reasonable amount.

TIA for any advice, and if I've left out any important details, let me know.

gimp

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Are you more concerned about no down-time, or safeguarding your data? Because RAID is meant for reducing down-time due to hardware hd malfunction. If you are worried about your data, then just develop a very good back up strategy, and maintain it.

 

[gimpyd00]

I'm more concerned with protecting my data, but doing it effeciently. Right now, I'd have to buy a TB of drives to backup my current data. If I go RAID5, I'd be able to use that TB as storage and only lose a few hundred GB. Plus, if a drive ever fails, I'd just need to throw in a spare and have it rebuild itself which seems like the easiest way to restore things.

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Okay, I had to ask. IMHO, the optimal setup for you would be a JBOD array with a good backup solution. It offers optimal use of different sized hard drives, albeit with no redundancy. Regardless of your setup, you are going to want include a good backup solution (just talk to th3 l337 n3wb, who just had his RAID 5 array go down). Backing up is the more effective way to make sure your data is safe, and it can be done with $0.

 

[InlineFour]

what's the most practical solution for a 300gb+ backup?

 

[John]

A forum member around here runs a (dynamic disk) Raid 5 volume and mentioned that if your pc crashes you have to spend time rebuilding the array. Something to think about......

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: InlineFour
what's the most practical solution for a 300gb+ backup?

In that instance (multiple, different sized hds), I would sacrifice one or two drives from the JBOD array, and use them excplicitly for backup. Get a hot-swap cage for them (~$30), and backup data. If there is 300gb of data to backup, but only one or two 120gb hds available, then I would do incremental backups of critical data. Atleast it would be something.

Originally posted by: John
A forum member around here runs a (dynamic disk) Raid 5 volume and mentioned that if your pc crashes you have to spend time rebuilding the array. Something to think about......

Regardless of hardware or software RAID 5, if a drive goes down, and you put in another replacement, you are going to have to rebuild the array. And it's a PITA--on my setup, it takes about 11 hours to rebuild the array.

 

[John]

I apologize for not being clear in my previous post. When I used the term crash it was in reference to a lockup/BSOD/etc. and not a drive failure. However I may have misread his post.

There's more info here if someone feels like digging thru it.

http://technet2.microsoft.com/WindowsSe...38-b548-fdc518ae9d181033.mspx?mfr=true

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: John
I apologize for not being clear in my previous post. When I used the term crash it was in reference to a lockup/BSOD/etc. and not a drive failure. However I may have misread his post.

There's more info here if someone feels like digging thru it.

http://technet2.microsoft.com/WindowsSe...38-b548-fdc518ae9d181033.mspx?mfr=true

Ah, I'm sorry. Oooh, that would suck. Yet another reason why I'm not much of a supporter of onboard RAID controller setups. Thanks for the info.

 

[gimpyd00]

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
Ah, I'm sorry. Oooh, that would suck. Yet another reason why I'm not much of a supporter of onboard RAID controller setups. Thanks for the info.

Technically, I wouldn't be using onboard RAID for this, it would all be software. I would just connect the drives and format them as dynamic disk and let Windows manage them. I'm thinking I'll buy 5 300GB drives (I've already got one PATA and two SATA on the way) for the RAID5 array, and then just use windows backup to backup those drives on the JBOD array.

Also, 11 hours? That gives me something to think consider.

Chocobo: what's your setup currently? And can you send me a link to a $30 drive cage? The only hot swappable one I've seen is from supermicro and runs $160 on newegg.

Thanks!

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: gimpyd00

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
Ah, I'm sorry. Oooh, that would suck. Yet another reason why I'm not much of a supporter of onboard RAID controller setups. Thanks for the info.

Technically, I wouldn't be using onboard RAID for this, it would all be software. I would just connect the drives and format them as dynamic disk and let Windows manage them. I'm thinking I'll buy 5 300GB drives (I've already got one PATA and two SATA on the way) for the RAID5 array, and then just use windows backup to backup those drives on the JBOD array.

Also, 11 hours? That gives me something to think consider.

Chocobo: what's your setup currently? And can you send me a link to a $30 drive cage? The only hot swappable one I've seen is from supermicro and runs $160 on newegg.

Thanks!

Honestly, I consider straight software (windows) RAID worse that onboard RAID controller setups. But whatever floats your boat.

I have a BroadCom BC4852 on a 133MHz / 64bit bus, with 6x250gb Hitachis (RAID 5) & 2x160gb Hitachis (RAID 0).

Here is the single cage. (I would have linked to newegg, but it seems to be down). Both me and my wife have these for IDE drive swapping. Technically, they aren't hot swappable, because IDE devices don't support it, as they have to be identified in BIOS. But it does make swapping them out a hell of a lot easier. These are also available, albeit @ $160 on NewEgg. I have two of them, and they are absolutely wonderful...

 

[gimpyd00]

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
Honestly, I consider straight software (windows) RAID worse that onboard RAID controller setups. But whatever floats your boat.

Why is software RAID through Windows horrible? I've never done it before, and the point for posting this is to figure out the pitfalls of my plan.

I really like those hot swappable drive cages, but can I fit one in an Antec 1040? This case uses drive rails. Part of what I'm trying to figure out is the best way to cram as many drives into one machine as possible, be it buying a new case or using drive cages like that.

Also, newegg lists a black and a white version of the Supermicro drive cage:
White
Black
There's a $45 difference. Any idea what accounts for that?

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: gimpyd00
Why is software RAID through Windows horrible? I've never done it before, and the point for posting this is to figure out the pitfalls of my plan.

I really like those hot swappable drive cages, but can I fit one in an Antec 1040? This case uses drive rails. Part of what I'm trying to figure out is the best way to cram as many drives into one machine as possible, be it buying a new case or using drive cages like that.

Also, newegg lists a black and a white version of the Supermicro drive cage:
White
Black
There's a $45 difference. Any idea what accounts for that?

This is of course my opinion, but software RAID is maintained on the hds themselves. So not only are you subjecting your data to hardware failure, but software (windows) failure as well. That doesn't make sense to me when you are trying to protect data. I've never messed with software RAID, so I really don't know the mechanics about it honestly. Also, you are putting more of a load on the processor, as it has to calculate the RAID parity, but if you are just doing a storage setup, then I guess that wouldn't matter as much.

Not sure about your case specifically, but I use rails on my case, and I haven't had a problem installing the single mobile rack, or the Supermicro SATA enclosures.

I have two of the black ones. When I bought them, they were $116. I'm guessing the price has gone up due to demand. Not many people have white cases though.

 

[InlineFour]

that 5.25" hdd cage looks sweet. if i bought a sata hdd cage, would that be hot swappable or would that depend on the sata controller it's connected to (pci-x raid card in my situation)?

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: InlineFour
that 5.25" hdd cage looks sweet. if i bought a sata hdd cage, would that be hot swappable or would that depend on the sata controller it's connected to (pci-x raid card in my situation)?

The Supermicro one? Yes, it is hot swappable, so long as the controller supports it. Hot swappable always depends upon the controller; it's simply a matter of how convenient removal / swapping is in the bay where the hd is mounted.

 

[gimpyd00]

I'm going to pick up the Lian Li V2000. I'm still not sure what kind of RAID I'm going to implement yet though.

Anyone have feedback on the XFX Revo64 cards? They're cheap, PCI, and the only reliable review I can find on them says the biggest issue is throughput, something that I don't care as much about for a media file server.

Also, any other affordable RAID card suggestions are totally welcome.