Speaker Questions

[UVAJim]

Hey all, I'm in the market for some speakers, and had some general questions as well as some specific ones.

First of all, I'm mainly a music listener - not the biggest gamer, save the occasional game of computer golf or possibly halo. There is all this 4.1 and 5.1 stuff which is so Greek to me. From what I can tell, 5.1 is basically 4.1 with a center channel speaker, which is good for voices? The question I had is if this speaker makes a significant difference for music, or if it is more important for movies.

Also, I understand that THX certification is more or less a quality measure that says "hey, these speakers sound awesome." That's cool by me, but I heard the logitech z-640's at a friends and went "wow, no THX, but they still sound pretty darn good." Is the difference that THX makes worth paying the extra money?

Also, what is this whole "Matrix" thing on the z-5300s. Someone said its sort of like a fake decoder or something.

So as for specific questions, most people seem to like the logitech speakers, so here is what I'm looking at:

Logitech z-640 - sound pretty good, 5.1 config, only $50 at TechOnWeb
Logitech z-5300 - THX Certified, 5.1 config, more power than 640s, $115 on TechOnWeb
Logitech z-560 - THX Certified (I think), 4.1 config. Is this much worse than 5.1?
Logitech z-680 - Considered the best Logitech speakers (apparently, I don't know much about this). About $250 at various places. THX, 5.1, and much more.

I guess my ultimate question is whether or not the three latter models are worth the extra money over the 640's. Could someone give me an opinion on this?

Also, if I don't want to spend $250 on speakers, which is better, the 5300 or the 560 (for my music-listening purposes). Does the 560 have anything the 5300 doesnt have which might be useful?

BTW, I have an Audigy 2 sound card already, which I believe is enough for anything I might listen to.

Thanks In Advance
Jim

 

[UVAJim]

One more question.

The 680's have "Dolby Digital" whereas the others I think do not. If it isnt "Dolby Digital" can it still be digital? And how does this relate to 4.1/5.1 .

Just searching for answers, thanks again,
Jim

 

[Monoman]

first off, it's my opinion

I would go with the 5300 as from what I remember, they 560 are not THX or they are but are 4.1 either way, I like the 5300 better. the THX is a rating set by george lucas stating how high the quality of an item must be in order to receive the THX Certification.

It also depends on your wants.

Good luck

Mitch

 

[Matthias99]

Okay. You've got a lot of questions here, but I can try to answer them.
5.1 is, indeed, basically 4.1 with a front center channel. This is the standard used for all DVD movies (the dialogue is put on the front center, "direct" sound effects on the front left/right, and "ambient"/"environmental" sound effects on the rear left/right). It's very useful for movies, and somewhat useful for gaming (as it makes locating things by sound a bit more accurate), but does practically nothing for music.

Speaker THX certification is, as far as I can tell, a joke. It means practically nothing.

The "Matrix" feature on the 5300s lets you take a regular 2-channel stereo input (from, say, a CD player or the like) and upmix it to 4.1 or 5.1. Good computer soundcards do this for you, and give you more options.

I've heard good things about the 640 and 680, and I've heard the 640s (they sound OK; pretty good for computer speakers). I presume the 680s are better (I believe the sub is significantly more powerful, and the speakers have decent midrange), but I'm not sure if they're worth $200 more.

The 680 speakers have a Dolby Digital *decoder* built in. This means you can use the digital output of your sound card to hook up to them, potentially resulting in higher-quality sound. I haven't tried it myself. You can also do this with most home theater receivers.

Frankly, if you're really looking for good quality for *music*, you need to be looking at home theater surround sound systems. All of the above systems will reproduce movie sound and games adequately, and will do alright with music, but they're just not in the same league as quality HT stuff.

 

[Oifish]

5.1 means that there are 5 channels (5 speakers) and the .1 is the tenth of a channel for the sub. (At least thats what I have heard) I love my z-640's. Nice sound, no crackle or distortion and look at the price. I got mine for $65 about 3 months ago.

 

[UVAJim]

Matthias and Monoman,

thanks for the quick replies.

Two things I forgot to mention are that I am putting these in my dorm room, so they need to be small, and they also need to be cheap. I believe that a home theater would take up way too much room and be way too expensive (please correct me if I'm wrong).

Thanks for the answers to the questions. So without a Dolby Digital decoder in the speakers, am I not able to use the digital capabilities of my Audigy 2? Or can I still use a digital signal (or whatever you want to call it, I don't know the technical terms) with the 5300 or the 560.

Also, how exactly does the wall mounting work? Is it some sort of stickum, or screws, or what? Thanks a lot.

Oh ya, and the 560's have metal wall mounters, whereas the 5300s have plastic wall mounters. Are they heavy enough that the material of the wall mounter would make a difference?

Please, more opinions on these speaker models would be very appreciated from everyone, especially if you have owned them or compared them.

Thanks
Jim

 

[Oifish]

For the z-640's you have to screw or nail them in to the wall. They made it real easy, you just flip the metal stand for wall mounting and there are two holes to put the screws in. The size of you dorm matters too. You might need to buy some extra cables from radio shack if the wires aren't long enough. But those are cheap.

 

[Matthias99]

Yeah, any of these are fine for a dorm room. HT equipment would be larger AND more expensive, and so is probably not a good option.

Unless you have something to send a digital signal to (like the 680 speakers, or a receiver with a digital in), you will not be using the digital outputs on your sound card. The only benefit of using the digital out is that the decoding gets done at the receiver/speaker amp, instead of in the computer. This means that, in theory, you'll get a cleaner signal, since the analog signal only has to go from the amp to the speakers, rather than going computer->amp->speakers. It's unlikely with speakers of this quality that you could even tell the difference, to be honest.

Unfortunately, I don't know anything about wall-mounting any of these. If they're built to be mounted, usually speakers will have a bracket that screws into a wall stud, and then the speaker gets attached somehow to the bracket. Also, if you're going to be in a dorm room, mounting anything on the walls will likely not be an option if it requires screwing, or even strong adhesives (which will damage the paint). I placed my rear speakers on a bookshelf and the windowsill in my dorm.

 

[UVAJim]

*bumpety bump bump bump*

 

[WobbleWobble]

I have the Z640s and have heard the Z540s. The Z640s are a great bargain and because you'll mainly be listening to 2 channel music, a 5.1 won't have any real benefit for you.

Logitechs in my opinion are not great for music as their bass is way to overwhelming.

 

[UVAJim]

Yes, but doesn't the "Matrix" mode of the 5300s take two channels and make them sounds like five?

I like the 640s too, a friend has them, I'm just trying to find out how much better the others are.

Thanks
Jim

 

[s1t]

get a compact stereo and hook it up with your comp
make sure the stereo has aux in though

 

[WobbleWobble]

The Z640s also have Matrix mode. From my own experience and what I've read on the Internet, Matrix mode isn't that great. Your Audigy 2 should be able to upmix your MP3s and stuff so that music will come from all the speakers.

 

[matrixwalker]

u don't need the dolby digital decoders, the audigy 2's decoders are of so high quality that they eliminate the need for an external dolby digital decoder, and they also decode Dolby Digital EX too,

 

[cchen]

a klipsch 2.1 system (can be found for less than 130) would beat all of the systems you mentioned in terms of sound quality

 

[UVAJim]

Hey Guys,

I just want to thank you all again for your input. It's really helping me out with ideas and thinking about what I want to do.

S1T, I already have a compact stereo and am running aux through it. That is my current setup, but the 640s sound MUCH better and are much smaller.

So essentially, because my audigy2 has Dolby Digital decoders in it, I don't need dolby digital decoders in the speakers. To me, this seems to eliminate the possibility of the 680s . . . what do you guys think?

Also, are you all saying that my audigy2 basically does on its own what the matrix mode would do, and probably do it better? I have also heard that the matrix mode isn't that great, so if my sound card can do a better job, that's awesome.

How do you all feel about Klipsch 2.1? Last time I heard Klipsch speakers I didn't like them as much as the logic.

Right now I'm feeling like the 640s or the 5300s might be the best bet, but please, more comments! I appreciate it so much.

Thanks
Jim

 

[UVAJim]

*bump bump bump*

b2k style

 

[Pariah]

So essentially, because my audigy2 has Dolby Digital decoders in it, I don't need dolby digital decoders in the speakers.

correct

Also, are you all saying that my audigy2 basically does on its own what the matrix mode would do, and probably do it better?

It does have matrix modes (CMSS,CMSS 2). Whether they are better is a matter of opinion.

I have also heard that the matrix mode isn't that great, so if my sound card can do a better job, that's awesome.

It;s a matter of taste. Some people (myself included) think all matrix modes stink because they alter the music too much. The only expansion technique I like is multi-channel stereo which most PC hardware doesn't support for whatever reason. CMSS 2 is the best PC matrixed audio I have heard, but I still don't like it, and never use it.

In the under $250 category, the only set of speakers I would recommend are the Creative MegaWorks THX 5.1 550's ($206 at Newegg). The best mainstream PC speakers I have heard besides the GigaWorks. Again, this is a matter of taste. To me the MegaWorks have a much warmer/smoother sound compared to Klipsch (too shrill) and Logitech (too boomy/muddled), with superior mid range, and cleaner and more accurate bass that isn't as in your face and overpowering as the Klipsch and Logitech. If all you want is the loudest set on the block for gaming and movies, you're better off with Logitech or Klipsch.

 

[UVAJim]

Thanks a lot,

But with my audigy 2, will I even have to use the matrix settings, seeing as how it has a dolby digital decoder in it? I thought matrix was a pseudo-decoder type thing.

Any more opinions on the logitechs or the Creative 550's?

Thanks
Jim

 

[Budmantom]

I have the 560's and I love them, I paid about $120-130, I never expected that kind of sound out of "computer speakers".

 

[UVAJim]

Budmantom,

I've also heard good things about the 560's, but do you find yourself wishing you had a center channel?

Also, more opinions are still welcome, and one more question: it seems that some speakers are only mac compatible, but are all PC speakers also compatible with Mac? I may get a powerbook or something in the next few years and I would want my speakers to work with a Mac. Does anyone know how whether the logitechs and the creative 550s are compatible with mac as well as PC?

Thanks
Jim

 

[Budmantom]

Jim,

I can tell you honestly that I never thought twice about it.

My thinking has always been computers speakers are just that two cheap little speakers until I heard my brother-in-laws, he has the Klipsch 4.1's. The first time I heard those I was blown away by the sound and price. I did my research and decided to buy the "klipsch killers", both speakers sound great but they are definatly different, I prefer mine and he prefers his.

Tom

 

[UVAJim]

Cool, thanks Tom, I appreciate the input.

Any other opinions out there? Which speakers should I get?

Jim

 

[beatle]

I second what Pariah said about Matrixing. I can't comment on Klipsch or the newer megaworks speakers since I've never listened to them. I did have a set of Z680s and I didn't like them. The bass was way too muddy and they had an awful hiss. Other Logitech speakers I listened to (640, 560) didn't have any hiss. I still like my 4 1/2 year old Cambridge Desktop theater.

5.1 is really only a big deal for movies. It's kind of nice to have a matrixed center channel for games, but EAX doesn't create 5 discrete channels, only 4, so the center channel isn't needed. That said, I'd get the Z-5300s.

 

[UVAJim]

Thanks for the input on the z-5300s. I was just at Best Buy listening to them, and I liked them a lot.

I did have a question for you all on something he said. He told me that THX makes no difference for audio, because it is for movies, and are a way of encoding movie audio. Is this correct? And if so, because I'm going to be using the speakers for audio 99% of the time, is THX even worth the money?

As a result of his comments, I also looked at Bose's new 2.1 setup, the "Bose Companion 3" and liked it a lot. Does anyone have experience with this setup or know where I could get a good deal on it?

I really need that THX question answered, cause I'm unsure again what THX even is. Thank you all so much.
Jim