The anti-crypto thread

[BFG10K]

Great news, crypto's collapsing across the board: https://www.techpowerup.com/282380/...ions-in-less-than-24-hours-did-the-bubble-pop

Also China's banned crypto, though individuals can still have it: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/chinese-financial-payment-bodies-barred-122712260.html

The sooner this cancerous parasite is wiped out, the better.

 

[alcoholbob]

Crypto can't go out of business because there is no business behind it. Decentralization. That is the core point.



Besides the obvious stuff of decentralization and having a public ledger everyone can see and analyze (wonder why politicians don't like crypto? that is your answer), i let Mr Ethereum himself explain it to you (note: this quote is in this thread already, probably multiple times);

Isn't Crypto just a speculation ponzi scheme built on top of more ponzi schemes? It seems like the core layer of crypto (Ethereum, BTC) sees more and more demand as there are more and shitcoins and crypto ponzi schemes like axie which pop up and rely on eth or btc. To me crypto, nft, fine art and antiques are all relief valves for central bank easing and low interest rates. Since most of inflation is going into the hands of the rich (so called "cantillionaires"), and there isn't anything productive for them to invest in, they just hide the money in these assets and keep driving the prices up until (if) central bank easing ends and rates start rising.

 

[UsandThem]

Crypto "wealth" is the Beanie Babies get-rich "easily" scheme for millennials, but mostly for the "whales", who will cash out and run at some point. Small individual miners hold such a small amount of the overall scale of [insert crypto name here].

It might be a while, but there's absolutely nothing backing the current crypto currencies. I'm sure ransomware hackers will hate to see it go since it'll be harder for them to stay hidden without those payment avenues, but screw them.

 

[Icecold]

Crypto "wealth" is the Beanie Babies get-rich "easily" scheme for millennials, but mostly for the "whales", who will cash out and run at some point. Small individual miners hold such a small amount of the overall scale of [insert crypto name here].

It might be a while, but there's absolutely nothing backing the current crypto currencies. I'm sure ransomware hackers will hate to see it go since it'll be harder for them to stay hidden without those payment avenues, but screw them.

I was curious if you could specify the age range you mean by millenials?

 

[Ajay]

I was curious if you could specify the age range you mean by millenials?

Born 1981-1996 approx. So 25 - 40. Man, I'd give my left nut to be 40 again.

 

[Ajay]

Oh why is this in Graphics??? Shouldn't it be in OT?

 

[VirtualLarry]

Data Shows Whales Are Dumping, But Bitcoin Holds Above $60k - Crypto Brain

On-chain knowledge exhibits Bitcoin whales are dumping as they make up virtually 90% of the transactions to exchanges, however BTC holds assist above $60k.

cryptobrain.us

Bitcoin "Whales" dumping @ $61K. Not sure what that means, TBH. (I mean, longer-term, for the future of Bitcoin. What happened to $100K Bitcoin by the end of the year?)

 

[BFG10K]

Cryptocurrency tax reporting bill has passed: https://www.coindesk.com/business/2021/11/06/house-sends-infrastructure-bill-with-crypto-tax-provision-to-us-president/

Looks like miners got their wish: >$10,000 Crypto transactions are now treated like cash from section 6050I, and full personal info needs to be sent to the government within 15 days. Failure to do so is a felony.

 

[BFG10K]

Yeah, you obviously never heard about hyperinflation. Your money under the pillow will have more value as firewood within hours. currency only has value as long as people believe in it or their government and the economy is somewhat running ok.

Sure I've heard of it, but you're confusing fiat with Crypto again. Crypto is the one that loses $trillions from its value ("hyperinflation") in five minutes whenever Musk opens his piehole.

I mean if fiat has hyperinflation, why on earth would anyone burn up the power of Argentina to mine Crypto given its sole purpose is to...convert back to fiat?

What, you think all those mining warehouses with thousands of GPUs are doing it to "use blockchain to maintain vaccine temperature integrity"? LMAO.

No, you can go and buy it but that would be even more stupid than buying it 4 days ago.

You can't buy something that costs $0 because there's no payment. Any elementary dictionary definition will quickly address your confusion.

Dictionary
buy
/bʌɪ/
Learn to pronounce
verb
verb: buy; 3rd person present: buys; past tense: bought; past participle: bought; gerund or present participle: buying

1.
obtain in exchange for payment.[/QUOTE]

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Looks like miners got their wish: >$10,000 Crypto transactions are now treated like cash from section 6050I, and full personal info needs to be sent to the government within 15 days. Failure to do so is a felony.

That just means they'll start doing multiple $9999 transactions, or does US law stop such loopholes? Locally, we've had that exact problem in situations which weren't all that dissimilar, and a few cases where you really don't want see such happening. (Sorry for being a bit vague, but it'd take a lot of explaining)

 

[kn51]

That just means they'll start doing multiple $9999 transactions, or does US law stop such loopholes? Locally, we've had that exact problem in situations which weren't all that dissimilar, and a few cases where you really don't want see such happening. (Sorry for being a bit vague, but it'd take a lot of explaining)

Yes, that is called structuring. What happens is you get reported for suspicious activity.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Yes, that is called structuring. What happens is you get reported for suspicious activity.

Nice to hear there is some justice left in the world. And it's a felony, so it's got teeth.

 

[beginner99]

Sure I've heard of it, but you're confusing fiat with Crypto again. Crypto is the one that loses $trillions from its value ("hyperinflation") in five minutes whenever Musk opens his piehole.

Only if you're dumb enough to by s***coins like squid game but as I said, there are also people buying rolexes or diamond wedding rings from strangers at gas stations in a unique offer. Scammers are everywhere just like dumb people. Nothing unique to crypto. Well there is one thing unique. Media hype. No one cares about randos buying worthless shit at gas stations.

I mean if fiat has hyperinflation, why on earth would anyone burn up the power of Argentina to mine Crypto given its sole purpose is to...convert back to fiat?

How many of the top 10 coins are actually using mining in the foreseeable future? (Hint: 1 namley bitcoin)
Why are you buying stock if the sole purpose is to convert it back to fiat? It's called an investment. And while you actually can pay in crypto at some places, I rather use the biggest s***coin of them all for that: USD.

What, you think all those mining warehouses with thousands of GPUs are doing it to "use blockchain to maintain vaccine temperature integrity"? LMAO.

For sure not increasing the average persons IQ, that is crystal clear from this thread.

 

[beginner99]

Nice to hear there is some justice left in the world. And it's a felony, so it's got teeth.

Not really. Monero is 100% private. There is no way of proving who and how much someone has been moving around. So you can funnel all your crypto through it and then trade on a "no KYC" exchange or a DEX.

 

[gorobei]

That is an old article. Is this still the plan to make a cap? With fee-burning a different mechanism was already found to reduce supply. Staking will also bind a large amount of ETH reducing supply. And why does it need to be deflationary? In fact I see that as a negative point if you want to use it for actually things vs just as a value store (bitcoin). If ETH is deflationary so is using it as costs (gas fees) will simply go up (in $). any deflationary currency reduces spending as it's always better to not spend now as you can buy more tomorrow (metaphorically speaking). Deflation is way, way worse than inflation for an actual monetary system.

no easily googleable update on plans for a cap. theoretically whenever buterin feels like it.

stable value is the best thing if you are looking for it to be a currency, but the initial buy in by miners requires any new coin to be deflationary to entice speculation. back when i was part of the vcg btc mining thread in 2011, the general wisdom was that you were never going to make big money as a miner and if you really believed that btc would take off then you were better off using whatever money you would spend on gpus and just buy btc from an exchange. with btc deflationary history that ended up being true. if you took the 5-digit spending some of the guys from back then were doing and just bought directly when btc was $2, you would be close to a trillionaire now.

Not even close. With current block rewards and the burn rate from EIP-1559 implementation I doubt it hits 120M by the merge. It certainly isn't going past 125M, let alone 200M.

i didnt say it would be 2000m by the merge. i said given how long it took to nearly implement pos (4-5 years) eth could easily be 200m 4-5 years from now.

eth has the issue that is mostly buterin deciding what gets the most priority, that is not decentralized.

the only good thing about eth is that it will probably be the first to get into post mining phase of crypto. we wont know how btc functions after the block reward hits 0 in roughly 2140ad.

 

[gorobei]

Not really. Monero is 100% private. There is no way of proving who and how much someone has been moving around. So you can funnel all your crypto through it and then trade on a "no KYC" exchange or a DEX.

it is always nice to see who has done their homework.

it is only idiot criminals and uninformed luddites parroting the lazy reporters that believe the bitcoin/eth are anonymous/untraceable. the fbi and nsa have exactly 0 trouble tracking down ransomware and other cybercriminals asking for btc. there is a reason why law enforcement was able to track down and return the ransom from one of the cases this last year.
monero zcash and maybe vex are the only ones actually facilitating dark web transactions, and without way more buy in by way more users any one of those coins could be shut down by the us govt and become unviable.

 

[Mopetar]

Yes, that is called structuring. What happens is you get reported for suspicious activity.

People doing legitimate business already don't have problems paying taxes. People involved in illegal activities don't have a problem breaking other laws because the business they're conducting is already felonious. Having to make multiple small transactions adds to the cost, but just like any business the costs are passed on to the customer if the provider won't absorb them.

 

[beginner99]

if you really believed that btc would take off then you were better off using whatever money you would spend on gpus and just buy btc from an exchange

Partially agree with that. While I did mine some ETH back then, it was just a hassle with heat and power use and ended up just buying. I mean I had the PC and GPU anyway so the cost for the GPU was essentially 0. But still if I had mined for another year or 2 this would easily be worth 100k right now.
Oh, and I still have that 290x running...sadly I missed the train for updating...ain't paying $500 for merely doubling performance after 8 years or so.

monero zcash and maybe vex are the only ones actually facilitating dark web transactions, and without way more buy in by way more users any one of those coins could be shut down by the us govt and become unviable.

at least monero is open-source and decentralized. You can't shut it down. People all over the world are running nodes and the US goverment can't touch some Aussie or Russian or Japanese guy running monero node. They can make a law to prohibit running a node and forbid it on US exchanges but really that doesn't stop anyone from buying it on a DEX / or no KYC CEX. And if you use l2p they won't even know you are running a node.

 

[ozzy702]

i didnt say it would be 2000m by the merge. i said given how long it took to nearly implement pos (4-5 years) eth could easily be 200m 4-5 years from now.

eth has the issue that is mostly buterin deciding what gets the most priority, that is not decentralized.

Due to EIP-1559 Ethereum has had significantly reduced inflation and post merge to PoS will likely be deflationary. There's a good chance that Ethereum never has over ~ 120M ETH in circulation.

Sounds like you primarily hang out in Bitcoin circles. Vitalik hasn't played much of a role in Ethereum for many years now and certainly hasn't been steering the ship and unilaterally calling the shots like I hear so many claim.

Decentralization is a multifaceted topic. I see decentralization as falling on a spectrum with perfect decentralization (in it's many forms) on one end and 100% centralization on the other. Bitcoin isn't perfectly decentralized but it's decentralized enough to provide reliable censorship resistance and security.

In some ways Ethereum is more decentralized than Bitcoin. Ethereum has five clients currently, and will have seven or more post-merge.

 

[gorobei]

Partially agree with that. While I did mine some ETH back then, it was just a hassle with heat and power use and ended up just buying. I mean I had the PC and GPU anyway so the cost for the GPU was essentially 0. But still if I had mined for another year or 2 this would easily be worth 100k right now.
Oh, and I still have that 290x running...sadly I missed the train for updating...ain't paying $500 for merely doubling performance after 8 years or so.

if i had continued mining during winter 2012 (i have electric heating so it would have been money i would have spent anyways) i would be driving a ferrari and posting pictures in the OT/discussion crypto millionaire thread.

at least monero is open-source and decentralized. You can't shut it down. People all over the world are running nodes and the US goverment can't touch some Aussie or Russian or Japanese guy running monero node. They can make a law to prohibit running a node and forbid it on US exchanges but really that doesn't stop anyone from buying it on a DEX / or no KYC CEX. And if you use l2p they won't even know you are running a node.

i dont doubt that people around the world would continue to run the nodes, but i am saying that if customers in the us/can and eu cant easily get money out of a local exchange to cover the drugs/guns/contraband they just delivered as payment then those darkweb suppliers arent going to bother with crypto. if there isnt enough users then confidence in any coin drops and no one will invest/speculate.

money laundering is one of the biggest issues in organized crime, there is no point in doing the crime if you cant find a way to spend the loot on normal stuff without worrying about the irs investigating. without clean money you cant buy anything significant: house, car, major durable goods; because nobody is going to accept a house payment in cash. i knew a guy in college who did middleman brokering for mj. the dealer he connected to customers had tons of money but could only buy stuff under $200 at any given time. the second they try to put significan money without a clean paper trail in a bank, the criminal is risking getting caught.

exchanges are getting busted by govt law enforcement for crypto pooling to hide the origin of coins. no traditional finance type person is going to run a crypto exchange in the us with that much heat given the rampant asset seizure/forfeiture.

 

[gorobei]

Due to EIP-1559 Ethereum has had significantly reduced inflation and post merge to PoS will likely be deflationary. There's a good chance that Ethereum never has over ~ 120M ETH in circulation.

Sounds like you primarily hang out in Bitcoin circles. Vitalik hasn't played much of a role in Ethereum for many years now and certainly hasn't been steering the ship and unilaterally calling the shots like I hear so many claim.

Decentralization is a multifaceted topic. I see decentralization as falling on a spectrum with perfect decentralization (in it's many forms) on one end and 100% centralization on the other. Bitcoin isn't perfectly decentralized but it's decentralized enough to provide reliable censorship resistance and security.

In some ways Ethereum is more decentralized than Bitcoin. Ethereum has five clients currently, and will have seven or more post-merge.

the eth dev team is large enough that buterin isnt in charge, but he is the face the news media and finance people point to in 80% of the articles out there. if he notionally mentions something then the eth fanboys/holders will be clamoring over it asking when it will be implemented. its not control but it is in effect a big voice, or at the very least a distraction.

decentralization of recordkeeping was one of the big draws outlined in the btc whitepaper. that and ease of international transactions were the vision offered 13 years ago. in use btc however ended up becoming a digital gold reserve for wealth storage. eth tried to carry on with the original currency function but with the digital contracts function it has become something else.

there will always be the quasi libertarian/anarchist fringe who yearn for the unregulated/uncontrolled/anonymous aspect of crypto, but for it to become something mainstream long term it needs to be stable enough in the short term for buyers and sellers not to worry about losing value in the few minutes/hours/days it takes the transaction to occur. i dont see how you can have that kind of stability without some sort of limited quick responding centralized control unless it is built in at the start. but you wont get investors to speculate on a new coin unless it has some small amount of guaranteed deflation/roi.

 

[Shmee]

Coins still mooning somewhat. Down a bit today, but then coins go up and down all the time. Anyway I am enjoying the gains here and there. My question is, what is this bill about? What does it actually do? I glanced at the article menitoning it was about reporting large transfers, but my understanding is exchanges in US already report.

 

[alcoholbob]

Coins still mooning somewhat. Down a bit today, but then coins go up and down all the time. Anyway I am enjoying the gains here and there. My question is, what is this bill about? What does it actually do? I glanced at the article menitoning it was about reporting large transfers, but my understanding is exchanges in US already report.

If they are treating coins as cash I assume the institutions have to file a CTR if more than 10k is transferred in a single day to another wallet. Right now as far as I know none of the exchanges report anything from sales because they don't know your cost basis. The only thing they actually report is interest paid and rewards.

 

[MrTeal]

You're all just looking at it wrong, the crypto collapse is well underway.

 

[Jwilliams01207]

Nah if we can find a way to harness stupidity as energy, even the universe itself could not contain us. As i feel human stupidity even outpaces the universe in expansion even.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Nah if we can find a way to harness stupidity as energy, even the universe itself could not contain us. As i feel human stupidity even outpaces the universe in expansion even.

Nah if we can find a way to harness stupidity as energy, even the universe itself could not contain us. As i feel human stupidity even outpaces the universe in expansion even.

lol