VelociRaptor 300GB $252 AR CB

[Zap]

I finally picked one up. These are the "older" models which are not compatible with hot-swap bays due to the location of the plugs.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16822136260

$279.99
free shipping
$20 rebate (expires 10/10)
~$8.40 Live Search cashback

$251.39

NewBiiz/Ewiz also has them for $259.99 without a rebate, but shipping to me ran around $8 or so.

 

[dynemd]

Your sure these are the older models?

 

[Kaido]

These are beasts. I have one in my main rig. The Samsung F1 1TB gets pretty close in terms of speed, but the Raptor just blows it away in certain areas.

 

[dynemd]

Have you tried the Samsung/OCZ/A-Data/G-Skill SSD's (all the same drive), or now the new Intel SSD's? Now these are quick! You can get the 32GB for $265 at the 'Egg

 

[bob4432]

Originally posted by: dynemd
Have you tried the Samsung/OCZ/A-Data/G-Skill SSD's (all the same drive), or now the new Intel SSD's? Now these are quick! You can get the 32GB for $265 at the 'Egg

will go that route once 74GB = $100 , otherwise will stick to fujitsu 15k scsi....

 

[Imyourzero]

Originally posted by: Kaido
These are beasts. I have one in my main rig. The Samsung F1 1TB gets pretty close in terms of speed, but the Raptor just blows it away in certain areas.

Yup. The access and transfer speeds are pretty amazing...the drive just "feels" very fast and responsive. I wish they made a version of it that was twice as big for half the cost.

 

[TemjinGold]

Originally posted by: Imyourzero

Originally posted by: Kaido
These are beasts. I have one in my main rig. The Samsung F1 1TB gets pretty close in terms of speed, but the Raptor just blows it away in certain areas.

Yup. The access and transfer speeds are pretty amazing...the drive just "feels" very fast and responsive. I wish they made a version of it that was twice as big for half the cost.

They did. It's called the WD6400AAKS...

 

[HumblePie]

Originally posted by: TemjinGold

Originally posted by: Imyourzero

Originally posted by: Kaido
These are beasts. I have one in my main rig. The Samsung F1 1TB gets pretty close in terms of speed, but the Raptor just blows it away in certain areas.

Yup. The access and transfer speeds are pretty amazing...the drive just "feels" very fast and responsive. I wish they made a version of it that was twice as big for half the cost.

They did. It's called the WD6400AAKS...

Not nearly the same speed


Side note, picked one of these up from an ebay store for $235+ 10 s/h. The with the current 30% live cash back offer after 60 days, my western digital 300gb raptor is about $175.

 

[Imyourzero]

LOL. I know those are pretty fast, but from everything I've read they still don't compare to a VR...the older Raptors, maybe.

Still, if you can live with a little bit less performance they are awesome drives for the $! You can buy, what, at least 3 of them and have 1.8GB of storage for the price of 1 VelociRaptor...6x the storage for 1/3 of the price? Why do people even buy VelociRaptors? I'm questioning my purchase as I type this, LOL

 

[tamasrepus]

Originally posted by: dynemd
Your sure these are the older models?

It's not really "older", but there is a "newer" one.

There are two models: the GFLS and HFLS. The GFLS was introduced first, and the HFLS a couple months later for enterprise/enthusiasts.

The disks in both models are exactly the same, only the sled enclosure is different. The GFLS does not conform to the SATA standard regarding placement of data and power connectors, so you cannot use it in SATA backplanes and hot-swap bays. WD introduced the HFLS a few months later to address this problem.

Why Western Digital keeps two models on the market is beyond me. Maybe they are trying to discontinue the old one, hence the sale? It's so far been very difficult to find the newer HFLS model.

 

[bob4432]

Originally posted by: Imyourzero
LOL. I know those are pretty fast, but from everything I've read they still don't compare to a VR...the older Raptors, maybe.

Still, if you can live with a little bit less performance they are awesome drives for the $! You can buy, what, at least 3 of them and have 1.8GB of storage for the price of 1 VelociRaptor...6x the storage for 1/3 of the price? Why do people even buy VelociRaptors? I'm questioning my purchase as I type this, LOL

access times, but i prefer 15k scsi myself. i know what the test show, but every game i play w/ buddies w/ raptors i am always on the map first by quite a margin, usually the 1st on every map which can be quite and advantage on certain games. plus you can get into scsi much cheaper than the 300GB raptors, though you will get ~74-146GB or so depending on the deal.

also when i open up photoshop, illustrator, indesign and flash all at the same time, the scsi is faster loading then when i have used raptors. for my data drive i prefer large, single platter drives like the 7200.10 250GB drive, or the 320GB wd aaks drive - nice thoroughput.

 

[Zap]

Originally posted by: dynemd
Your sure these are the older models?

Yes, based on model numbers.

Originally posted by: dynemd
Have you tried the Samsung/OCZ/A-Data/G-Skill SSD's (all the same drive), or now the new Intel SSD's? Now these are quick! You can get the 32GB for $265 at the 'Egg

Too small.*

Originally posted by: HumblePie
Side note, picked one of these up from an ebay store for $235+ 10 s/h. The with the current 30% live cash back offer after 60 days, my western digital 300gb raptor is about $175.

Dang, I should have thought of this. I've been trying to avoid Ebay since they've been jacking with fees and payment methods, but with the Live Cashback...

Originally posted by: bob4432
you can get into scsi much cheaper than the 300GB raptors, though you will get ~74-146GB or so depending on the deal.

Too small.*

I see 300GB 15,000RPM SAS for $390 before a controller card, which is $70 minimum (and who knows if any of that comes with a SAS cable?). Sure, that drive will be a beast, but $460 is yet another notch up.

I may have to consider it if prices come down a bit.

*I have a Raptor X (150GB) and am already down to 41GB free just from Windows, games and apps. Sheesh, has anyone checked the size of their Steam folder lately? Mine is well over 20GB and I don't have that much in Steam. I've got a bunch of games that came on DVDs. Future games will be even worse. I think Sacred II will take 20GB for one game!

My plan is to put the VelociRaptor in my gaming rig, which currently also has a Raptor X. Then, I'll combine the two Raptor X in RAID 0 in my main rig. Voila! 300GB and added performance in both machines! Mmmm, I may have to buy a RAID card though... wonder if I can get one that can handle both SATA and SAS with RAID?

 

[bob4432]

Originally posted by: Zap

Originally posted by: dynemd
Your sure these are the older models?

Yes, based on model numbers.

Originally posted by: dynemd
Have you tried the Samsung/OCZ/A-Data/G-Skill SSD's (all the same drive), or now the new Intel SSD's? Now these are quick! You can get the 32GB for $265 at the 'Egg

Too small.*

Originally posted by: HumblePie
Side note, picked one of these up from an ebay store for $235+ 10 s/h. The with the current 30% live cash back offer after 60 days, my western digital 300gb raptor is about $175.

Dang, I should have thought of this. I've been trying to avoid Ebay since they've been jacking with fees and payment methods, but with the Live Cashback...

Originally posted by: bob4432
you can get into scsi much cheaper than the 300GB raptors, though you will get ~74-146GB or so depending on the deal.

Too small.*

I see 300GB 15,000RPM SAS for $390 before a controller card, which is $70 minimum (and who knows if any of that comes with a SAS cable?). Sure, that drive will be a beast, but $460 is yet another notch up.

I may have to consider it if prices come down a bit.

*I have a Raptor X (150GB) and am already down to 41GB free just from Windows, games and apps. Sheesh, has anyone checked the size of their Steam folder lately? Mine is well over 20GB and I don't have that much in Steam. I've got a bunch of games that came on DVDs. Future games will be even worse. I think Sacred II will take 20GB for one game!

My plan is to put the VelociRaptor in my gaming rig, which currently also has a Raptor X. Then, I'll combine the two Raptor X in RAID 0 in my main rig. Voila! 300GB and added performance in both machines! Mmmm, I may have to buy a RAID card though... wonder if I can get one that can handle both SATA and SAS with RAID?

that is why i go the older u320 scsi and not sas. even in a 32bit pci slot my scsi drive will still have an str of ~90MB/s or so w/ a bit of headroom, but i am more concerned about seek times as to me, that is more important. i guess i run less than most on my machine - xp pro, office 2k7, adobe suite cs3 and a couple games leaves me ~27GB open on my c drive, so i am good for that, but different strokes for different folks

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: bob4432

Originally posted by: dynemd
Have you tried the Samsung/OCZ/A-Data/G-Skill SSD's (all the same drive), or now the new Intel SSD's? Now these are quick! You can get the 32GB for $265 at the 'Egg

will go that route once 74GB = $100 , otherwise will stick to fujitsu 15k scsi....

Maybe it's time to move over to waaaaay faster 15k Seagate SAS on an Adaptec 5805? Note, the 5805 SAS controller will run these 10k Raptors or any other SATA drive along with SAS.

 

[bob4432]

Originally posted by: Googer

Originally posted by: bob4432

Originally posted by: dynemd
Have you tried the Samsung/OCZ/A-Data/G-Skill SSD's (all the same drive), or now the new Intel SSD's? Now these are quick! You can get the 32GB for $265 at the 'Egg

will go that route once 74GB = $100 , otherwise will stick to fujitsu 15k scsi....

Maybe it's time to move over to waaaaay faster 15k Seagate SAS on an Adaptec 5805? Note, the 5805 SAS controller will run these 10k Raptors or any other SATA drive along with SAS.

what hdds do you speak of? i am currently running a fujitsu max on a lsi u160 card. may seem old but like i said, i really don't care about burst and i am still able to keep the drive ok w/ its max str. i have run the seagate 15k.5 300GB u320 drive on it too, and i must admit the str was limited by the slot, it was still @ 98MB/s str.

for the less than $150 i have into the current 74GB setup, actually probably less than $125, i really don't see the need to spend probably $1K for a 300GB setup which i don't need. nor at this time go sas. please enlighten me of these "waaaaay" faster 15k seagate sas drives. the 300GB seagate 15k.5 i had didn't do as well for the main drive that the fujitsu max does, fwiw. if you are talking about the savvio 15k drives, the data doesn't support the $$ difference imho.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: bob4432

Originally posted by: Googer

Originally posted by: bob4432

Originally posted by: dynemd
Have you tried the Samsung/OCZ/A-Data/G-Skill SSD's (all the same drive), or now the new Intel SSD's? Now these are quick! You can get the 32GB for $265 at the 'Egg

will go that route once 74GB = $100 , otherwise will stick to fujitsu 15k scsi....

Maybe it's time to move over to waaaaay faster 15k Seagate SAS on an Adaptec 5805? Note, the 5805 SAS controller will run these 10k Raptors or any other SATA drive along with SAS.

what hdds do you speak of? i am currently running a fujitsu max on a lsi u160 card. may seem old but like i said, i really don't care about burst and i am still able to keep the drive ok w/ its max str. i have run the seagate 15k.5 300GB u320 drive on it too, and i must admit the str was limited by the slot, it was still @ 98MB/s str.

for the less than $150 i have into the current 74GB setup, actually probably less than $125, i really don't see the need to spend probably $1K for a 300GB setup which i don't need. nor at this time go sas. please enlighten me of these "waaaaay" faster 15k seagate sas drives. the 300GB seagate 15k.5 i had didn't do as well for the main drive that the fujitsu max does, fwiw. if you are talking about the savvio 15k drives, the data doesn't support the $$ difference imho.

A lot of people are willing to spend $3-5 per GB for SSD storage. With a the ability to sustain 170 MB/s the Seagate 15k.6 is much faster and a lot cheaper per GB than SSD. Add a good controller like the Adaptec 5805 and you further supercharge your storage speeds by 30% or more.

http://hothardware.com/Article...eetah-X156-Hard-Drive/

 

[HumblePie]

Originally posted by: Googer


A lot of people are willing to spend $3-5 per GB for SSD storage. With a the ability to sustain 170 MB/s the Seagate 15k.6 is much faster and a lot cheaper per GB than SSD. Add a good controller like the Adaptec 5805 and you further supercharge your storage speeds by 30% or more.

http://hothardware.com/Article...eetah-X156-Hard-Drive/

Sure, if you are willing to deal with the heat, noise, and power consumption of a 15K scsi drive. I'm not talking minor. I'm talking bonfire + jet engine + blow dryer power usage Okay, maybe not exactly that much, but way way way more than a SSD or velocipator.

Also, as I said, I paid about $175 shipped for a 300GB VR. Well, when my 60 days are up for my cash back, but to me the price was cheaper than a good scsi drive + good controller card + proper cables + term + hassle of hooking that all up + over all price after my electric bill comes in.

Don't get me wrong, scsi can be nice, but I've never found is really useful in a home pc.

 

[Imyourzero]

Originally posted by: HumblePieDon't get me wrong, scsi can be nice, but I've never found is really useful in a home pc.

Me either.

Hopefully we can come to a consensus that there is no "perfect" solution; it simply depends on what your needs are and what you're willing to sacrifice. If speed is priority 1 and heat/noise aren't a concern, go SCSI. If cost per GB is a factor or you need a ton of storage and you don't need blazing access times, get one of the 1TB drives. If you crave a really fast boot drive with a minimum of heat and noise, the VelociRaptor is an excellent choice assuming you're fine with the cost/GB.

Just have to weigh the pros and cons of each; there's no use thinking that your choice is better than someone else's, because their needs might be different than yours. I prefer a mix; I like having a fast boot drive and several TB of storage while having a cool and quiet PC...but that doesn't mean it's the best solution for everyone.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: HumblePie

Originally posted by: Googer


A lot of people are willing to spend $3-5 per GB for SSD storage. With a the ability to sustain 170 MB/s the Seagate 15k.6 is much faster and a lot cheaper per GB than SSD. Add a good controller like the Adaptec 5805 and you further supercharge your storage speeds by 30% or more.

http://hothardware.com/Article...eetah-X156-Hard-Drive/

Sure, if you are willing to deal with the heat, noise, and power consumption of a 15K scsi drive. I'm not talking minor. I'm talking bonfire + jet engine + blow dryer power usage Okay, maybe not exactly that much, but way way way more than a SSD or velocipator.

Also, as I said, I paid about $175 shipped for a 300GB VR. Well, when my 60 days are up for my cash back, but to me the price was cheaper than a good scsi drive + good controller card + proper cables + term + hassle of hooking that all up + over all price after my electric bill comes in.

Don't get me wrong, scsi can be nice, but I've never found is really useful in a home pc.

SCSI is as you know it is dead, I know the aspects of the SCSI protocol are built in in to it, SAS is the SCSI replacement.

I personally put performance above all other factors when building a PC. Almost any high performance part like an extreme edition CPU is going to generate a bit of extra heat or noise. That should be expected; however, many modern components are much quieter and/or cooler than their ancestors were.

 

[bob4432]

Originally posted by: Googer

Originally posted by: HumblePie

Originally posted by: Googer


A lot of people are willing to spend $3-5 per GB for SSD storage. With a the ability to sustain 170 MB/s the Seagate 15k.6 is much faster and a lot cheaper per GB than SSD. Add a good controller like the Adaptec 5805 and you further supercharge your storage speeds by 30% or more.

http://hothardware.com/Article...eetah-X156-Hard-Drive/

Sure, if you are willing to deal with the heat, noise, and power consumption of a 15K scsi drive. I'm not talking minor. I'm talking bonfire + jet engine + blow dryer power usage Okay, maybe not exactly that much, but way way way more than a SSD or velocipator.

Also, as I said, I paid about $175 shipped for a 300GB VR. Well, when my 60 days are up for my cash back, but to me the price was cheaper than a good scsi drive + good controller card + proper cables + term + hassle of hooking that all up + over all price after my electric bill comes in.

Don't get me wrong, scsi can be nice, but I've never found is really useful in a home pc.

SCSI is as you know it is dead, I know the aspects of the SCSI protocol are built in in to it, SAS is the SCSI replacement.

I personally put performance above all other factors when building a PC. Almost any high performance part like an extreme edition CPU is going to generate a bit of extra heat or noise. That should be expected; however, many modern components are much quieter and/or cooler than their ancestors were.

i understand that scsi is old tech and sas has taken over. that is why i have been getting the drives so cheap for some time. and to be honest, when i had my 15k.5, even though it had the ability for superior str and was bottlenecked, the fujitsu max and even mas drives seemed to be a bit more gear for a desktop machine. i know everybody always says scsi is bad for desktop but i have to disagree w/ that when you have a decent drive. but, as a disclaimer, the 15k.5 i had was a very early model of it, so for all i know they could have mad adjustments to the drive firmware and it may have worked better if that had matured, don't know, ended up selling it.

like i said before, i pay nowhere near retail for these drives, i find deals and the deals are good. so please don't think i am paying hundreds of dollar for drives as that is not the case.

also, you guys that say the 15k scsi are loud and hot, the old 10-15k were, they sounded like a circular saw and would generate a ton of heat, the last few 15k drives i have had are nowhere near that level of sound and in fact, are no louder than a 7.2k drive. i have always run all my hdds w/ active cooling so cooling is a moot point for me, but the last couple generations if not farther back have been rather cool and also quiet. in fact, i have a 15k mas drive in my htpc and can't hear it at all.

i will probably wait to move over to sas till it is much cheaper, and that may not happen, in fact ssds may be much lower in price than sas for some time and that is where i am looking because i am more interested in seek times vs str.

 

[AmberClad]

Zap - I want to hear your impressions as far as the drive when you've had a chance to play around with it a bit.

At the moment, this is the one aspect of my system where I feel like I could use a bit more performance. Btw, does the drive come with any free software? Seagate packages their drives with a special version of Acronis (that only works with Seagate drives).

 

[TemjinGold]

I'm not Zap but I got my retail box Velo and all it came with was the sata cable and a manual (which was pretty useless.) I haven't had time to put it in yet so I can't comment on the speed but I imagine it'll be way faster than my 74 raptor that it's replacing.

 

[Zap]

This OEM drive from Newegg comes with a free anti static bag and bubble wrap. I can verify that because I just got it yesterday. Haven't had a chance to install it yet.

 

[Lurker1]

I've been a long-time SCSI RAID user, both enterprise and in my home systems. With a decent RAID setup, you won't believe your speed/throughput for any application that hits the disk. (6 - 8 disks in an array make for very nice and fast performance, although the old 16 SCSI-III drives certainly were a bit loud)

I now have a new SATA setup with 2 750s and 2 320s, all 7200RPM with 40GB set aside for striping on the outside and the remainder for mass storage or system/application space. (I tried PATA drives at one time, but the controllers all suck unless you delve into SCSI territory, software is definitely the way to go for RAID0)

With Linux, software RAID0 is downright swift. Windows XP will allow you to do it after hacking the registry a bit.

I don't know why you'd spend 4 times the cash for less than 1/2 the drive. Just buy two slightly slower same gen drives and stripe what you need. It'll be far faster than just one drive and quieter and cooler to boot.

 

[Zap]

Originally posted by: Lurker1
I don't know why you'd spend 4 times the cash for less than 1/2 the drive. Just buy two slightly slower same gen drives and stripe what you need. It'll be far faster than just one drive and quieter and cooler to boot.

Actually, the new VelociRaptor runs really cool and really quiet even compared to normal 7200RPM desktop drives.

Regarding RAID, some things will benefit tremendously while other things will not. For instance, if you happen to have an app that has a bunch of really small files, you may not benefit at all if the files are mostly smaller than your stripe size. If you decrease your stripe size, you lose on large file performance. Also, RAID striping only increases data transfer rates and does nothing for access times. When you "hear" your HDD churning, rattling and clicking when running something disk intensive... that's when you need lower access times the most.

Compared to a VelociRaptor, sometimes a RAID 0 array of 7200RPM drives will be the better performer, sometimes performs worse.

Compared to a single 7200RPM drive, the array will sometimes be the better performer, sometimes perform the same.

Compared to a single 7200RPM drive, the VelociRaptor will ALWAYS outperform it.