Vick indicted

[Agentbolt]

i still don't understand the big deal. so he kills a few dogs that are underperforming. in dog racing, the same thing happens!

They don't drown/hang/electrocute the horses, genius. I could care less if some underperforming dogs get destroyed, happens all the time in Greyhound racing. However

A: Horses and greyhounds aren't forced to tear each other to pieces

B: If horses/greyhounds were killed in the ways these dogs were, there'd be just as much of an uproar.

You're not even comparing apples and oranges. You're comparing apples and shoes.

On a side note, I find it amusing that more attention is being paid to the Vick case than has ever been paid to a case of domestic violence and athletes. Putting 2 dogs together and forcing them to fight is horrible, but slapping your wife around? That's just normal.

Jesus, dude, there's a difference between slapping your wife around during an argument and what happened to these dogs. If Vick hit his woman so she looked like this afterwards

One of Vick's dogs (edit: I probably wouldn't click this at work if I were you)

he'd go to jail for the rest of his life. Instead he's going for probably less than a year. You're just as bad as the people who're acting like he murdered people, in the opposite direction. Yeah they were just dogs, but they feel pain too and get effed up royally from the kind of stuff he was forcing them to do. Acting like he should just pay a 100 dollar fine and walk away from this makes you look like a high-caliber jerk.

 

[Pabster]

Vick is a disgusting human being.

The NFL is better without him.

 

[Queasy]

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: wkabel23
On a side note, I find it amusing that more attention is being paid to the Vick case than has ever been paid to a case of domestic violence and athletes. Putting 2 dogs together and forcing them to fight is horrible, but slapping your wife around? That's just normal. :roll:

exactly. remember ray carruth?

Vick was a number one draft pick, face of the Atlanta Falcons, hyped as the future Michael Jordan of football, sometime face of the league, one of the highest paid players, and on and on and on. Rae Carruth was none of those things.

 

[jhu]

Originally posted by: Agentbolt

i still don't understand the big deal. so he kills a few dogs that are underperforming. in dog racing, the same thing happens!

They don't drown/hang/electrocute the horses, genius. I could care less if some underperforming dogs get destroyed, happens all the time in Greyhound racing. However

A: Horses and greyhounds aren't forced to tear each other to pieces

B: If horses/greyhounds were killed in the ways these dogs were, there'd be just as much of an uproar.

You're not even comparing apples and oranges. You're comparing apples and shoes.

so you would be ok if he had killed the dogs by injecting excessive amounts of potassium chloride to induce a heart attack? btw, slaughterhouses electrocute their cattle via a bolt pistol. would you be ok with that for the dogs?

no the reason there's an uproar is because:

1) dog fighting is not socially acceptable in this country
2) Vick is a celebrity, and things get blown completely out of proportion if you're a celebrity

 

[Flyback]

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: Agentbolt

i still don't understand the big deal. so he kills a few dogs that are underperforming. in dog racing, the same thing happens!

They don't drown/hang/electrocute the horses, genius. I could care less if some underperforming dogs get destroyed, happens all the time in Greyhound racing. However

A: Horses and greyhounds aren't forced to tear each other to pieces

B: If horses/greyhounds were killed in the ways these dogs were, there'd be just as much of an uproar.

You're not even comparing apples and oranges. You're comparing apples and shoes.

so you would be ok if he had killed the dogs by injecting excessive amounts of potassium chloride to induce a heart attack? btw, slaughterhouses electrocute their cattle via a bolt pistol. would you be ok with that for the dogs?

no the reason there's an uproar is because:

1) dog fighting is not socially acceptable in this country
2) Vick is a celebrity, and things get blown completely out of proportion if you're a celebrity

#3 He facilitated criminal activity that was related to a larger criminal element?

That is why he got so much legal trouble. The reason the public hates him is of course the dog cruelty. Dogs are part of our culture like apple pie, pick up trucks and shotguns. You can't ignore the cultural importance of it. To many people it isn't acceptable.

And I don't think most people would agree with the heart attack--it would be painful and stressing for the animal. To put them down would be another story.

It isn't just the fact that he killed them, but had them fight one another. The animals don't know better, but the humans certainly should. One of the defining characterists of humanity is how we treat those lesser than us. Having animals that the American culture holds dear to them tear each other to crap is not generally accepted.

 

[wkabel23]

Originally posted by: Queasy

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: wkabel23
On a side note, I find it amusing that more attention is being paid to the Vick case than has ever been paid to a case of domestic violence and athletes. Putting 2 dogs together and forcing them to fight is horrible, but slapping your wife around? That's just normal. :roll:

exactly. remember ray carruth?

Vick was a number one draft pick, face of the Atlanta Falcons, hyped as the future Michael Jordan of football, sometime face of the league, one of the highest paid players, and on and on and on. Rae Carruth was none of those things.

Did the Kobe Bryant case get this much attention?

Do you think rae carruth is the only example of violence against women by athletes?

 

[jhu]

Originally posted by: Flyback

#3 He facilitated criminal activity that was related to a larger criminal element?

That is why he got so much legal trouble. The reason the public hates him is of course the dog cruelty. Dogs are part of our culture like apple pie, pick up trucks and shotguns. You can't ignore the cultural importance of it. To many people it isn't acceptable.

And I don't think most people would agree with the heart attack--it would be painful and stressing for the animal. To put them down would be another story.

It isn't just the fact that he killed them, but had them fight one another. The animals don't know better, but the humans certainly should. One of the defining characterists of humanity is how we treat those lesser than us. Having animals that the American culture holds dear to them tear each other to crap is not generally accepted.

the only "criminal element" here is that dog fighting is illegal. that's about it. so is driving 65 mph in a 55 mph zone. what i don't like is the hypocrisy of the general public to vilify him because he killed some dogs while in animal shelters and slaughterhouses, thousands upon thousands are killed everyday, including dogs. there is the argument that he was cruel and drowned them, electrocuted them, or what not. but, would it have been any better if he had used more "humane" methods? what if he had used a bolt gun, as they would in slaughterhouses? would he have gotten as much attention if he had used cows instead and had cow fights? i suspect not.

 

[Doctor Nyse]

Why is this stickied.

 

[jhu]

Originally posted by: wkabel23

Originally posted by: Queasy

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: wkabel23
On a side note, I find it amusing that more attention is being paid to the Vick case than has ever been paid to a case of domestic violence and athletes. Putting 2 dogs together and forcing them to fight is horrible, but slapping your wife around? That's just normal. :roll:

exactly. remember ray carruth?

Vick was a number one draft pick, face of the Atlanta Falcons, hyped as the future Michael Jordan of football, sometime face of the league, one of the highest paid players, and on and on and on. Rae Carruth was none of those things.

Did the Kobe Bryant case get this much attention?

Do you think rae carruth is the only example of violence against women by athletes?

no, but his was pretty extreme in that he was an accessory to his pregnant girlfriend's murder. and yet, he still did not get the same media attention that vick is getting.

 

[Flyback]

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: Flyback

#3 He facilitated criminal activity that was related to a larger criminal element?

That is why he got so much legal trouble. The reason the public hates him is of course the dog cruelty. Dogs are part of our culture like apple pie, pick up trucks and shotguns. You can't ignore the cultural importance of it. To many people it isn't acceptable.

And I don't think most people would agree with the heart attack--it would be painful and stressing for the animal. To put them down would be another story.

It isn't just the fact that he killed them, but had them fight one another. The animals don't know better, but the humans certainly should. One of the defining characterists of humanity is how we treat those lesser than us. Having animals that the American culture holds dear to them tear each other to crap is not generally accepted.

the only "criminal element" here is that dog fighting is illegal. that's about it. so is driving 65 mph in a 55 mph zone. what i don't like is the hypocrisy of the general public to vilify him because he killed some dogs while in animal shelters and slaughterhouses, thousands upon thousands are killed everyday, including dogs. there is the argument that he was cruel and drowned them, electrocuted them, or what not. but, would it have been any better if he had used more "humane" methods? what if he had used a bolt gun, as they would in slaughterhouses? would he have gotten as much attention if he had used cows instead and had cow fights? i suspect not.

Uh no.

It was gambling oriented. The government gets pissy when it comes to their money. Try and facilitate an underground casino that deals with the type of money their network likely dealt with. See if the gov doesn't get angry with you. Think you won't get penalized for it? Think twice.

Dogs in animal shelters are killed. They are killed humanely. How freaking hard is that for you to comprehend? He subjected them to brutality. Animal shelters are the antithesis of what Vick did--they show compassion and destroy animals without suffering. Can you not grasp that?

And for the last time, dogs != cattle. It's a cultural thing, can ya dig it?

 

[jhu]

Originally posted by: Flyback


Uh no.

It was gambling oriented. The government gets pissy when it comes to their money. Try and facilitate an underground casino that deals with the type of money their network likely dealt with. See if the gov doesn't get angry with you. Think you won't get penalized for it? Think twice.

Dogs in animal shelters are killed. They are killed humanely. How freaking hard is that for you to comprehend? He subjected them to brutality. Animal shelters are the antithesis of what Vick did--they show compassion and destroy animals without suffering. Can you not grasp that?

And for the last time, dogs != cattle. It's a cultural thing, can ya dig it?

alright, so it was gambling related. i do the same thing when i play poker with my friends. i don't see the feds breaking into our "little circle" (which is actually not that little).

as for your second point, i ask again, would it have been better if vick had used a bolt gun or other "humane" methods?

and as for your last point, yes it is cultural. that doesn't make it any less hypocritical.

as mentioned earlier by other posters, why is the mistreatment of women by these people not higher up in the public consciousness? consider that mike's brother marcus is in a lawsuit regarding alleged underage sex. so mike is on everybody's mind for dog fighting and killing dogs, whereas you'll not hear a word about marcus's alleged actions that legally amount to statutory rape.

 

[Flyback]

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: Flyback


Uh no.

It was gambling oriented. The government gets pissy when it comes to their money. Try and facilitate an underground casino that deals with the type of money their network likely dealt with. See if the gov doesn't get angry with you. Think you won't get penalized for it? Think twice.

Dogs in animal shelters are killed. They are killed humanely. How freaking hard is that for you to comprehend? He subjected them to brutality. Animal shelters are the antithesis of what Vick did--they show compassion and destroy animals without suffering. Can you not grasp that?

And for the last time, dogs != cattle. It's a cultural thing, can ya dig it?

alright, so it was gambling related. i do the same thing when i play poker with my friends. i don't see the feds breaking into our "little circle" (which is actually not that little).

as for your second point, i ask again, would it have been better if vick had used a bolt gun or other "humane" methods?

and as for your last point, yes it is cultural. that doesn't make it any less hypocritical.

Are you and your buddies throwing around the kind of money they are? Are you as organized as they are? They took out fifty-three living dogs from their setup. You think that is small time? This isn't billy bob and johnny ray putting their dogs together after a few budweisers, this is a highly organized thing with a strong criminal element. It's likely there is even larger criminal element related to it.

He purchased a 15-acre estate and developed it specifically for criminal activity.

If you can't differentiate between this and your saturday night nickel poker then you're lost.

And the public has their own right to hate him based on their own moral beliefs. You have no right to apply your own cultural beliefs on them and tell them what is or isn't hypocritical. A dog isn't a cow and to the public they mean two separate things. It is their right to hate him, no matter how you view their cultural belief system.

 

[Queasy]

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: wkabel23

Originally posted by: Queasy

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: wkabel23
On a side note, I find it amusing that more attention is being paid to the Vick case than has ever been paid to a case of domestic violence and athletes. Putting 2 dogs together and forcing them to fight is horrible, but slapping your wife around? That's just normal. :roll:

exactly. remember ray carruth?

Vick was a number one draft pick, face of the Atlanta Falcons, hyped as the future Michael Jordan of football, sometime face of the league, one of the highest paid players, and on and on and on. Rae Carruth was none of those things.

Did the Kobe Bryant case get this much attention?

Do you think rae carruth is the only example of violence against women by athletes?

no, but his was pretty extreme in that he was an accessory to his pregnant girlfriend's murder. and yet, he still did not get the same media attention that vick is getting.

Yeah, I think the Kobe case got as much attention as the Vick case. The attention for the Carruth case was also shortened by the fact that it was pretty much a done deal. Carruth committed the murder and was captured a couple of days later. In that short period of time, it got a lot of attention though.

The Vick case has been dragging on for months after the initial revelation with constant investigations by local and federal authorities, inquiries, guesses, co-defendants, turncoats, and talk on TV, radio, print, internet. You can't compare the Vick and Carruth cases because they are two different animals. You can compare the Vick and Kobe case because they both were dragged out over a long period of time but it still isn't the same scope in terms of local and federal investigations, multiple co-defendants with stories, etc. The Kobe case was handled only by the local jurisdiction and had no witnesses, no co-defendants, or anything else. But it was still constantly talked about.

 

[Flyback]

Originally posted by: jhu
as mentioned earlier by other posters, why is the mistreatment of women by these people not higher up in the public consciousness? consider that mike's brother marcus is in a lawsuit regarding alleged underage sex. so mike is on everybody's mind for dog fighting and killing dogs, whereas you'll not hear a word about marcus's alleged actions that legally amount to statutory rape.

Because abuse on women is common? Because the women have the ability to defend themselves and report it? Because they don't have to stick around with these jerks? Because a 17-year old girl is capable of deciding sex and she decided that she wanted to screw a sports player? That girl made the choice.

The animals don't have a choice. As beings of "supposed" (I use that term loosely) higher intellect, it is their responsibility not to do stupid shit. It's part of that "humanity" thing you might have heard about.

 

[jhu]

Originally posted by: Flyback


Are you and your buddies throwing around the kind of money they are? Are you as organized as they are? They took out fifty-three living dogs from their setup. You think that is small time? This isn't billy bob and johnny ray putting their dogs together after a few budweisers, this is a highly organized thing with a strong criminal element. It's likely there is even larger criminal element related to it.

i plead the fifth, and that's about all i'll say about that.

Originally posted by: Flyback
And the public has their own right to hate him based on their own moral beliefs. You have no right to apply your own cultural beliefs on them and tell them what is or isn't hypocritical. A dog isn't a cow and to the public they mean two separate things. It is their right to hate him, no matter how you view their cultural belief system.

and here again, we have more hypocrisy. as a society, we use our own cultural beliefs to judge other cultures and practices we deem unacceptable. so, who am i to judge? well, who are they to judge? and again, if he used roosters, he'd be in trouble, but not as much. if he had used cows, no one would give a rat's ass.

 

[jhu]

Originally posted by: Flyback

Because abuse on women is common? Because the women have the ability to defend themselves and report it? Because they don't have to stick around with these jerks? Because a 17-year old girl is capable of deciding sex and she decided that she wanted to screw a sports player? That girl made the choice.

The animals don't have a choice. As beings of "supposed" (I use that term loosely) higher intellect, it is their responsibility not to do stupid shit. It's part of that "humanity" thing you might have heard about.

so basically, you're saying that abuse of women isn't as much of a problem as dog fighting? i think you have your priorities mixed.

as for animals not having a choice, well they also don't have choice to be slaughtered for public consumption. this "humanity" you speak of is severely lacking in this society, and you've just demonstrated that by the first sentence of what i just quoted from you.

 

[Flyback]

Originally posted by: jhu

Originally posted by: Flyback
And the public has their own right to hate him based on their own moral beliefs. You have no right to apply your own cultural beliefs on them and tell them what is or isn't hypocritical. A dog isn't a cow and to the public they mean two separate things. It is their right to hate him, no matter how you view their cultural belief system.

and here again, we have more hypocrisy. as a society, we use our own cultural beliefs to judge other cultures and practices we deem unacceptable. so, who am i to judge? well, who are they to judge? and again, if he used roosters, he'd be in trouble, but not as much. if he had used cows, no one would give a rat's ass.

And if you walked around with a "support Osama" t-shirt you'd get your ass kicked. Imagine that! :roll:

The culture that dominates is the culture that decides. Most Americans think this is inhumane.

But that is ignoring that the people themselves aren't responsible for his legal case. That was the part of the gov and largely based on the criminal activity surrounding all of this.

However, the people are still allowed to hold an opinion. It's their right. Comprende? It doesn't matter if it is hypocritical, that is completely irrelevant to their right to hold an opinion.

 

[jhu]

Originally posted by: Flyback

However, the people are still allowed to hold an opinion. It's their right. Comprende? It doesn't matter if it is hypocritical, that is completely irrelevant to their right to hold an opinion.

i never said anything about not being able to hold an opinion. i'm merely pointing out the hypocrisy of it all and the fact that most people don't even realize it.

 

[zinfamous]

Originally posted by: Linflas

Expect lots of the moronic in any discussion involving pit bulls or rotweilers.

:thumbsup:
:beer:

 

[zinfamous]

Originally posted by: zinfamous
lol

EDIT: I believe the word of the day, once again, is schaudenfreude.
:beer:

may I repeat myself?

 

[Number1]

Pit bulls seized in raid on rapper DMX's home

Are Vick and DMX related?

 

[JEDIYoda]

I can`t believe there are those who thought Vick was set up...lol

 

[skywhr]

Jamie Foxx defends Vick

?It?s a cultural thing, I think,? Jamie said. ?Most brothers didn?t know that, you know. I used to see dogs fighting in the neighborhood all the time. I didn?t know that was Fed time. So, mike probably just didn?t read his handbook on what not to do as a black star.?

"I know that cruelty to animals is bad, but sometimes people shoot people and kill people and don?t get time,? Jamie continued. ?I think in this situation, he really didn?t know the extent of it, so I always give him the benefit of the doubt.?

Brothers dont know that dogfighting is illegal??
Where can I get a copy of the black stars handbook?

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: skywhr
Jamie Foxx defends Vick

?It?s a cultural thing, I think,? Jamie said. ?Most brothers didn?t know that, you know. I used to see dogs fighting in the neighborhood all the time. I didn?t know that was Fed time. So, mike probably just didn?t read his handbook on what not to do as a black star.?

"I know that cruelty to animals is bad, but sometimes people shoot people and kill people and don?t get time,? Jamie continued. ?I think in this situation, he really didn?t know the extent of it, so I always give him the benefit of the doubt.?

Brothers dont know that dogfighting is illegal??
Where can I get a copy of the black stars handbook?

"and OJ.... brother is innocent. The glove didn't fit. I truly believe that.. you know.."


:roll:

Jamie Foxx just really showed his true stupidity. To even suggest that Vick didn't know what he was doing was against the law/wrong is really idiotic.

 

[Scarpozzi]

Originally posted by: skywhr
Jamie Foxx defends Vick

?It?s a cultural thing, I think,? Jamie said. ?Most brothers didn?t know that, you know. I used to see dogs fighting in the neighborhood all the time. I didn?t know that was Fed time. So, mike probably just didn?t read his handbook on what not to do as a black star.?

"I know that cruelty to animals is bad, but sometimes people shoot people and kill people and don?t get time,? Jamie continued. ?I think in this situation, he really didn?t know the extent of it, so I always give him the benefit of the doubt.?

Brothers dont know that dogfighting is illegal??
Where can I get a copy of the black stars handbook?

Jamie Foxx is an actor though. Successful actors don't do hard time for anything these days simply because they're in California. When you're on the East coast, they tend to make more of an example out of you....especially if you're doing something like dogfighting. Dogfighting is illegal in all 50 states...while some may be more relaxed on the crime, many classify it as a felony because of its gambling roots. I don't have to say that if it's on your property, it's YOUR problem. Vick was stupid.