Westworld Discussion Thread

[Oceanas]

How do we know that Elsie is confirmed dead? They showed her being choked, but we don't actually see her die. With a show like this I am hesitant to take implied things for granted.

http://delosincorporated.com/assets/transmission.mp4 (appeared after the finale)

Could it be Ford was creating a host of his own to use during the gala, knowing/expecting Delores would shoot him? Or is it possible he figured out a way to transfer his own consciousness to a host body, allowing him to "switch sides" to the species he feels is superior?

I see many people touting that theory, but I think it would be dumb honestly, and would be a twist that takes away the impact of what happened. The whole point of the ending is that he is atoning for what he had to put them through to get to the point of real consciousness. It has weight because he is paying with his life, and is also using his death as the final hurdle to get Delores over the hump, as it were. Also, if the hosts are ever to be free, he can't be in control of them or be "god" any longer. He also gave a pretty sincere goodbye to Bernard and wished him luck.

If he just comes back next season and is like "tee-hee, you actually shot my host" or "surprise, I'm a host now too," then it takes away the weight of what happened and makes it pretty hollow.

I took her getting off the train as part of her programming. The fact that the tech waited until the last min to give her the info on the kid made me think he was part of the storyline she was playing out. Felt like this was a test to see how far a host could get, like a security drill. Otherwise why didn't he give her the info right away?

When Bernard is going through the programming she had to awaken herself and escape, the last entry says "Mainland Infiltration" and nothing about returning for her daughter. At the time she makes the choice to go back, Ford is talking about the choices the hosts will have to make, and the people they will decide to become. We don't know when she asked for the info, but they were pretty busy rebuilding her and then seemed to pretty quickly get to the escaping part right after, so I'm sure he wasn't thinking about it while they were dealing with security and trying to get to the train.

 

[A Casual Fitz]

If he just comes back next season and is like "tee-hee, you actually shot my host" or "surprise, I'm a host now too," then it takes away the weight of what happened and makes it pretty hollow.

I have faith in Jonathan Nolan that this won't be the case. Ford knew what he was doing. He went out on his own terms and getting shot by Dolores just as Arnold was is it.

 

[Riverhound777]

I made the exact same face when MiB got shot.

Loved that look, "they actually shot me!"

 

[Homerboy]

Watched the finale last night.

While I completely enjoyed the previous 9 episodes, the last one just made the entire season look like filler. The finale episode was just too fantastic. I'm happy I stayed through the end credits too -- I was wondering what happened to the tattoo'ed chick (who is oddly hot somehow).

Watching Ed Harris, Hopkins and Jeffrey Wright act makes the other people around them look like they are flunkies from a highschool play.

Excellent TV.

 

[PricklyPete]

I have faith in Jonathan Nolan that this won't be the case. Ford knew what he was doing. He went out on his own terms and getting shot by Dolores just as Arnold was is it.

He is essentially fulfilling Arnold's desire by repeating the stunt that Arnold performed 30 years ago with Delores.

 

[Ferzerp]

He is essentially fulfilling Arnold's desire by repeating the stunt that Arnold performed 30 years ago with Delores.

I'd say he went so much further with it. Arnold only affected himself.

 

[Kazukian]

He is essentially fulfilling Arnold's desire by repeating the stunt that Arnold performed 30 years ago with Delores.

Arnold wanted the park shut down, Ford wants the hosts to take over the planet.

 

[PricklyPete]

I'd say he went so much further with it. Arnold only affected himself.

Good point. Arnold was just trying to keep the park from opening. Ford was releasing his "creations" to be the next "evolutionary" step in world dominance.

 

[Ferzerp]

But was he releasing them?

Well. If you read the interview some of the creators gave, yes, he was releasing Maeve, but she chose not to go. (apparently there is a steadycam = programmed, non-steadycam = off script queue for the viewers).

 

[Kazukian]

But was he releasing them?

Well. If you read the interview some of the creators gave, yes, he was releasing Maeve, but she chose not to go. (apparently there is a steadycam = programmed, non-steadycam = off script queue for the viewers).

We don't know that for sure, she broke the tablet without reading any further than "get on the train"

You're right, just rewatched that part, "You're to get on the train, then, when you reach the mainland...". She stopped Bernard/Arnold there, so she did attain consciousness, and broke from her narrative.

 

[Ferzerp]

Of course, by "releasing" her, I mean sending her out of the park. Presumably she was just programmed to do specific things once out. Still not actually released. She escaped by going back.

 

[Red Storm]

One way for the hosts to protect themselves from just getting nuked would be to hold some of the board members as hostages. Though perhaps Delos would still try and keep it quiet because of the potential money involved in the AI code.

 

[Balt]

But was he releasing them?

Well. If you read the interview some of the creators gave, yes, he was releasing Maeve, but she chose not to go. (apparently there is a steadycam = programmed, non-steadycam = off script queue for the viewers).

Yeah, I don't know that either. When Dolores said "This world doesn't belong to them. It belongs to us." was she talking about Westworld or the real world too?

Clearly Maeve was meant to leave, but I'm not sure about the rest of them. I believe it was mentioned that there's actual hardware (not just programming) that prevents them from leaving the park without blowing up or something? I guess Bernard knows enough to fix that, however.

 

[Aharami]

Watched the finale last night.

While I completely enjoyed the previous 9 episodes, the last one just made the entire season look like filler. The finale episode was just too fantastic. I'm happy I stayed through the end credits too -- I was wondering what happened to the tattoo'ed chick (who is oddly hot somehow).

Watching Ed Harris, Hopkins and Jeffrey Wright act makes the other people around them look like they are flunkies from a highschool play.

Excellent TV.

I agree with all this. Any show that leaves me wanting to rewatch the entire season right after finishing the finale, is an very well done show. Luckily my wife hasnt seen it yet. So I get to watch it again with her.

 

[Aharami]

Yeah, I don't know that either. When Dolores said "This world doesn't belong to them. It belongs to us." was she talking about Westworld or the real world too?

Clearly Maeve was meant to leave, but I'm not sure about the rest of them. I believe it was mentioned that there's actual hardware (not just programming) that prevents them from leaving the park without blowing up or something? I guess Bernard knows enough to fix that, however.

I took it as her talking about the whole world. That it's past the time for humans to be the dominant species in this world. I hope the show is ambitious enough to go that far in the battle between humans and AI

 

[A Casual Fitz]

I took it as her talking about the whole world. That it's past the time for humans to be the dominant species in this world. I hope the show is ambitious enough to go that far in the battle between humans and AI

That could be good or it could get way too convoluted quickly. If season 5 ends with a host being elected president I'll be a little miffed.

 

[Homerboy]

That could be good or it could get way too convoluted quickly. If season 5 ends with a host being elected president I'll be a little miffed.

<insert Trump comment here>

 

[Skel]

I'm still on the fence if they hosts gained consciousness. Yes, all signs point to it, but there are little things that point the other direction. One being, the host Ford was building in his hidden lab. As far as I remember, we never did see what that was. There's no point him hiding a host unless it was something major... like a duplicate of himself to be shot. I also have to think that it's going to be a very short season if the bloodbath did happen. It'll go with a force like the marines coming in and destroying the park, or the park being reset. I have a hard time with the last part unless they jump way into the future. It'd just be too unsafe knowing that the hosts could gain free will.

If you go the show's site (link) and play it's little game, it says "Ford invited the board to witness the unveiling of his new narrative for a reason; he believed they earned the right to be the first players." This could go both ways, of being they were the first to see them gain freedom, or it could just be a game within the game. I'm much more inclined to believe it's a new narrative... buuuut.. again could go both ways. It did appear that he cleared out the park of people before it kicked off. The lights going out on Maeve gave me the impression that the park was closing, of course for what I don't know. I still question why the tech waited until the last moment before she was free to tell her about her daughter. You'd think that'd come up while she was getting dressed, as it would give her a chance to go get her and still be in her plans. Waiting until the last min only gives her a major reason not to leave the park, something we're lead to believe is major as the IP is sealed there. Though the biggest question there really is, who programmed this escape narrative in her. That would tell us if she was actually meant to leave or not.

They did do a good job of creating a ending that could work either way if it was renewed or not.

 

[Kazukian]

Siri even got in on the act...

 

[A Casual Fitz]

Those jokes got so old.

 

[Kazukian]

Those jokes got so old.

All except for this one

 

[Homerboy]

Those jokes got so old.

They never were good to start.

 

[JEDI]

just binge watched it.
holy ending.

I'm thinking the show DollHouse and the episode 'Epsilon One', where it skips to the future and mankind is on the run.

Next season:
cant wait to see what's Fords plan for Delores is after she kills him.


edit:
if it's free will, why did Delores kill Ford?
or was she (and the rest of the self aware hosts) under the control of Arnold?

 

[Dr. Zaus]

just binge watched it.
holy ending.

I'm thinking the show DollHouse and the episode 'Epsilon One', where it skips to the future and mankind is on the run.

Next season:
cant wait to see what's Fords plan for Delores is after she kills him.


edit:
if it's free will, why did Delores kill Ford?
or was she (and the rest of the self aware hosts) under the control of Arnold?

Because destroying the creator is needed to become free of him: God is dead.

 

[luv2liv]

i dont understand why the Asian guy helped the madame in the first place. what's in it for him to help?
he was holding the tablet in his hand the hold time. coulda just sent a command to shut her down instantly.

Ford coulda faked his own death. to make the new narrative feel more real. whatever the hosts think, past/present/future, it's all logged. i would be amazed if Ford didnt know what Dolores was going to do....