What brought down WTC7

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Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
Based on what? If you never even bothered investigating if there was a controlled demolition, how are you gonna find evidence supporting or refuting that possibility.

Originally posted by: BeauJangles
1) If planes did not bring down the WTC, what did? How did it get there? A controlled demolition on the scale required by the WTC would have required thousands of pounds of explosives, miles (miles!) of detonation cord, and months of preparation. Have you ever seen videos of buildings when they're wired to come down? There is wire and explosives everywhere. In the WTC there was nothing. I hate to break it to you, but it would be nearly impossible for all of that stuff to be hidden.

LMAO, you're quoting speculation from a forum post as evidence? Firstly, explosive can be detonated wirelessly - you do not need miles and miles of detonation cord. Secondly, yes you do need preparation time... did the official story investigate who had maintenance access to the buildings prior to the event? And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,389
8,547
126
Originally posted by: LunarRay
You scienc-y types give me the woolies.. heeheheh

Could you tell me where the screw up occurred regarding the folks who built the buildings saying they could withstand a 707 hit? I've seen the numbers regarding the expected hit dynamics of a 707 at cruise vs the heavier 767 at maniac speed... it is not that great at all. So where would I start to pin the tail - on which donkey?

Perhaps you could tell me if you disagree with this below to any material degree.

the towers did withstand the impact.
 

Cogman

Lifer
Sep 19, 2000
10,284
138
106
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
Based on what? If you never even bothered investigating if there was a controlled demolition, how are you gonna find evidence supporting or refuting that possibility.

Originally posted by: BeauJangles
1) If planes did not bring down the WTC, what did? How did it get there? A controlled demolition on the scale required by the WTC would have required thousands of pounds of explosives, miles (miles!) of detonation cord, and months of preparation. Have you ever seen videos of buildings when they're wired to come down? There is wire and explosives everywhere. In the WTC there was nothing. I hate to break it to you, but it would be nearly impossible for all of that stuff to be hidden.

LMAO, you're quoting speculation from a forum post as evidence? Firstly, explosive can be detonated wirelessly - you do not need miles and miles of detonation cord. Secondly, yes you do need preparation time... did the official story investigate who had maintenance access to the buildings prior to the event? And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

And what have you provided as evidence? Some guys that hear loud noises...

If the explosives were detonated wirelessly there DEFINITELY would have been evidence for multiple reasons. The greatest of which is the fact that wireless signals fail, hence not all of the explosives would have gone off.

Or do you think this is like batman where the joker can pull out a magic remote the size of a tv remote that can detonate explosives 3 miles away through layers and layers of concrete?

As for concrete being pulverized into nothing. Gee, I wonder what happens when one of the largest buildings in the world falls on a piece of concrete. Seriously? I don't know if you noticed this, but the entire building wasn't engulfed in a giant explosion. There was plenty of concrete that was damaged by nothing more then the building falling on it.
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: munky
Do you see rain and lighting in any video at the scene of the incident? Funny way to classify it as a clap of thunder, when it obviously could not have been a "clap of thunder." And yes, I'd expect a thorough investigation to examine what could have caused the sound of an explosion at a major cataclysmic event like that.

Exactly what the NIST did. They considered every possibility and ruled out any sort of controlled demolition based on a lack of evidence.

There is ZERO evidence for a controlled demolition, neither in the rubble of the WTC nor in the circumstantial evidence surrounding the event. Noises themselves are not indicative of anything, neither are people who use the word "explosives." The BBC saying WTC 7 collapsed long before it did indicates how confused the entire situation was and may indicate their own inability to accurately report what was happening. It doesn't mean there is a conspiracy. The "pull it" video is equally lacking in any sort of evidence.

Truthers have had eight full years to find one shred of evidence that explosives brought the building down. They have failed to do so.

Lol, the NIST investigation was a joke. It was not based on forensic evidence, because most of the steel from the site was cleaned up and shipped off to Asia to be recycled long before the NIST investigation even started. Their so-called investigation had their conclusions heavily drawn from mathematical models and simulations, the details of which they didn't even release to the public, in case anyone tried to scrutinize their methods.
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: Cogman
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
Based on what? If you never even bothered investigating if there was a controlled demolition, how are you gonna find evidence supporting or refuting that possibility.

Originally posted by: BeauJangles
1) If planes did not bring down the WTC, what did? How did it get there? A controlled demolition on the scale required by the WTC would have required thousands of pounds of explosives, miles (miles!) of detonation cord, and months of preparation. Have you ever seen videos of buildings when they're wired to come down? There is wire and explosives everywhere. In the WTC there was nothing. I hate to break it to you, but it would be nearly impossible for all of that stuff to be hidden.

LMAO, you're quoting speculation from a forum post as evidence? Firstly, explosive can be detonated wirelessly - you do not need miles and miles of detonation cord. Secondly, yes you do need preparation time... did the official story investigate who had maintenance access to the buildings prior to the event? And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

And what have you provided as evidence? Some guys that hear loud noises...

If the explosives were detonated wirelessly there DEFINITELY would have been evidence for multiple reasons. The greatest of which is the fact that wireless signals fail, hence not all of the explosives would have gone off.

Or do you think this is like batman where the joker can pull out a magic remote the size of a tv remote that can detonate explosives 3 miles away through layers and layers of concrete?

As for concrete being pulverized into nothing. Gee, I wonder what happens when one of the largest buildings in the world falls on a piece of concrete. Seriously? I don't know if you noticed this, but the entire building wasn't engulfed in a giant explosion. There was plenty of concrete that was damaged by nothing more then the building falling on it.

LMAO, does this photo look like concrete breaking up as it hits the ground? No, it was being pulverized in mid air.

As for the sounds, that's just one piece of evidence, and there's plenty more available... none of which seemed to be worth investigating to the official story.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: munky
And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

another demolitions expert. man, amazing how many of these guys there are!
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

another demolitions expert. man, amazing how many of these guys there are!
No, the amazing part is that actual demolition experts, architects and engineers say the same thing... but you either ignore it or are completely oblivious to the fact.
 

BeauJangles

Lifer
Aug 26, 2001
13,941
1
0
Originally posted by: munky
LMAO, does this photo look like concrete breaking up as it hits the ground? No, it was being pulverized in mid air.

As for the sounds, that's just one piece of evidence, and there's plenty more available... none of which seemed to be worth investigating to the official story.

Pulverized mid air? Not even the world's most sophisticated explosives could pulverize something mid-air.

As the tower collapses, it crushes the concrete below it. Notice that your evidence confirms this -- the substantial chunks of conrete are BELOW the collapsing tower. That tells us two very interesting things. First, neither WTC 1 or 2 collapsed at near free-fall speeds (as is claimed by some people) and, two, that the visual evidence we have confirms the fact that the tower collapsed in a pancake manner, exactly as the NIST said it did.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

another demolitions expert. man, amazing how many of these guys there are!
No, the amazing part is that actual demolition experts, architects and engineers say the same thing... but you either ignore it or are completely oblivious to the fact.

Exactly...except for all the non-crackpot engineers, scientists and demolition experts. I know you can find 1 in 100 that "want more questions answered". The other 99% are sane.

http://channel.nationalgeograp...-conspiracy-vs-science
 

BeauJangles

Lifer
Aug 26, 2001
13,941
1
0
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

another demolitions expert. man, amazing how many of these guys there are!
No, the amazing part is that actual demolition experts, architects and engineers say the same thing... but you either ignore it or are completely oblivious to the fact.

Yup. Those who have substantial knowledge and experience in the field almost universally support the NIST's report. Their own points of contention are minor and reflect an order of events, not the general premise that the WTC was brought down by planes.

I will just preempt the link to www.ae911truth.org/ that has zero qualifications to be talking about a disaster on the scale of the WTC. If I recall correctly, he has no experience building, designing, or studying the collapse of skyscrapers. The other members of that site are, as a whole, equally lack qualifications to make to statements from authority about the WTC collapse.
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

another demolitions expert. man, amazing how many of these guys there are!
No, the amazing part is that actual demolition experts, architects and engineers say the same thing... but you either ignore it or are completely oblivious to the fact.

Exactly...except for all the non-crackpot engineers, scientists and demolition experts. I know you can find 1 in 100 that "want more questions answered". The other 99% are sane.

http://channel.nationalgeograp...-conspiracy-vs-science

Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?
 

BeauJangles

Lifer
Aug 26, 2001
13,941
1
0
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

another demolitions expert. man, amazing how many of these guys there are!
No, the amazing part is that actual demolition experts, architects and engineers say the same thing... but you either ignore it or are completely oblivious to the fact.

Exactly...except for all the non-crackpot engineers, scientists and demolition experts. I know you can find 1 in 100 that "want more questions answered". The other 99% are sane.

http://channel.nationalgeograp...-conspiracy-vs-science

Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?

Well, the NIST happens to be composed of some of the most qualified people out there. There job is to understand how building collapses and disasters happen and then create rules, laws, and suggestions that make buildings as safe as possible.

So who exactly is this army of experts that refutes what not only the NIST, but hundreds of other experts worldwide believe, and have proven, the cause of collapse was?
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: munky
LMAO, does this photo look like concrete breaking up as it hits the ground? No, it was being pulverized in mid air.

As for the sounds, that's just one piece of evidence, and there's plenty more available... none of which seemed to be worth investigating to the official story.

Pulverized mid air? Not even the world's most sophisticated explosives could pulverize something mid-air.

As the tower collapses, it crushes the concrete below it. Notice that your evidence confirms this -- the substantial chunks of conrete are BELOW the collapsing tower. That tells us two very interesting things. First, neither WTC 1 or 2 collapsed at near free-fall speeds (as is claimed by some people) and, two, that the visual evidence we have confirms the fact that the tower collapsed in a pancake manner, exactly as the NIST said it did.

There are other interesting things, such as the appearance of squibs well below the wave of collapse, and the evidence of debris being ejected sideways with enough force to cover an area much greater than the footprint of the towers. Those details go against the NIST pancake theory.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
No, the amazing part is that actual demolition experts, architects and engineers say the same thing... but you either ignore it or are completely oblivious to the fact.

Exactly...except for all the non-crackpot engineers, scientists and demolition experts. I know you can find 1 in 100 that "want more questions answered". The other 99% are sane.

http://channel.nationalgeograp...-conspiracy-vs-science

Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?

Citing to proper authority is part of my job, so, yeah. If you're confused, let me set you up with the hierarchy.

website set up by disgruntled wingnuts <<<<< Purdue University, along with the American Society of Civil Engineers

....so which organizations are on your side?
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: munky
And for the fact that there was "nothing" - interesting way to put it, because really, the concrete was pulverized into basically nothing. Not something that happens when a building collapses from an earthquake or fire.

another demolitions expert. man, amazing how many of these guys there are!
No, the amazing part is that actual demolition experts, architects and engineers say the same thing... but you either ignore it or are completely oblivious to the fact.

Exactly...except for all the non-crackpot engineers, scientists and demolition experts. I know you can find 1 in 100 that "want more questions answered". The other 99% are sane.

http://channel.nationalgeograp...-conspiracy-vs-science

Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?

Well, the NIST happens to be composed of some of the most qualified people out there. There job is to understand how building collapses and disasters happen and then create rules, laws, and suggestions that make buildings as safe as possible.

So who exactly is this army of experts that refutes what not only the NIST, but hundreds of other experts worldwide believe, and have proven, the cause of collapse was?

Have the NIST findings been reproduced in experiments by unaffiliated sources? And more importantly, is the NIST qualified to conduct a forensic investigation at the scene on the incident? Never mind the fact that they couldn't have done so with most of the physical evidence gone long before their study began.
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: jonks
Citing to proper authority is part of my job, so, yeah. If you're confused, let me set you up with the hierarchy.

website set up by disgruntled wingnuts
Again, so says you...
<<<<< Purdue University, along with the American Society of Civil Engineers

Who conducted the official findings without ever setting foot on ground zero before the forensic evidence was cleaned up. Yeah, sounds real convincing to me... :roll:
 
Feb 6, 2007
16,432
1
81
Originally posted by: munky
Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?

Are you expert enough to choose the larger number?

A. 99%
B. 1%

Take your time.

When 99% of experts in a specific field agree on something, it's considered an extremely strong consensus. 99% of experts agree that the official 9/11 story is correct. There's no question here: if you honestly reject the findings of multiple, scientific, independently reviewed tests that conclusively show that the buildings could have fallen when struck by aircraft, you are a moron and no one is going to take you seriously.
 

BeauJangles

Lifer
Aug 26, 2001
13,941
1
0
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: munky
LMAO, does this photo look like concrete breaking up as it hits the ground? No, it was being pulverized in mid air.

As for the sounds, that's just one piece of evidence, and there's plenty more available... none of which seemed to be worth investigating to the official story.

Pulverized mid air? Not even the world's most sophisticated explosives could pulverize something mid-air.

As the tower collapses, it crushes the concrete below it. Notice that your evidence confirms this -- the substantial chunks of conrete are BELOW the collapsing tower. That tells us two very interesting things. First, neither WTC 1 or 2 collapsed at near free-fall speeds (as is claimed by some people) and, two, that the visual evidence we have confirms the fact that the tower collapsed in a pancake manner, exactly as the NIST said it did.

There are other interesting things, such as the appearance of squibs well below the wave of collapse, and the evidence of debris being ejected sideways with enough force to cover an area much greater than the footprint of the towers. Those details go against the NIST pancake theory.


What evidence do you have for a controlled demolition? There are thousands of videos that there that purport to show "squibs." Have you ever seen a controlled demolition of a building? I'll give you a hint, it doesn't really look like what's shown in the video. More importantly, those discharges fit much more closely with the mountain of evidence that the building crushed itself. As each floor collapsed, it forced the air out of that floor, causing debris to fly sideways.

In a controlled demolition like the one that supposedly happened at the WTC, explosives must be set off in a controlled manner and precisely timed. Videos like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNftLdtL49E merely point out things that seem out of place, but they do not explain what those are. Sure they could be explosions, but then you'd have to answer the following questions:

1) Give the precise nature of such a demolition, why are these mysterious explosions seemingly random? Why do they occur in places that are not collapsing? Why do they direct their out the windows with such force?

2) How does this fit in with the context we have? Considering truthers seem to believe that thermite was used in the demolition, then how are there explosions to begin with? Thermite doesn't explode.

Speaking of context, why don't you just answer these questions for me (ripped from my post earlier in this thread):

Hey friend,

Okay, here are some easy questions for you. #4 is most pertinent to our conversation right now.

1) If planes did not bring down the WTC, what did? How did it get there? A controlled demolition on the scale required by the WTC would have required thousands of pounds of explosives, miles (miles!) of detonation cord, and months of preparation. Have you ever seen videos of buildings when they're wired to come down? There is wire and explosives everywhere. In the WTC there was nothing. I hate to break it to you, but it would be nearly impossible for all of that stuff to be hidden.

2) What exactly blew up the building? Thermite? Thermite doesn't explode and, if this was a controlled demolition, why didn't the terrorists or whoever use real explosives rather than relying on something that has never been used to demolish a building before?

3) Who exactly was involved? At first glance, any sort of conspiracy greater than the planes implicates at least hundreds, if not thousands, of people. Knowledge of demolition, especially on the scale required to bring down the WTC is a rare commodity and would have been done by an expert. Again, that doesn't make it an impossibility, but if the "government" is involved are you accusing the NIST, FEMA, the military, the president, FDNY, the thousands of experts (both government and employed and not) who have independently concluded that the government is right, the NYPD, the hijackers, etc? Really? 21 guys versus thousands?

4) If the government is going to blow up a building, why do they concoct a complicated plan that involves hijacking a plane and slamming it into the building? There is WAAAY too much that could go wrong. What if the hijackers fail to take control of the plane? What if the plane misses the building? Why would they not make the cover story easier -- terrorists snuck truckloads of explosives into the building and blew it up? I mean, we already had an attack on the WTC which was exactly that, why not replicate it? PLUS, if you're going to go to the trouble of hijacking planes and slamming them into the building, why bother planting explosives? Why not load the planes with explosives? Why are there two high-risk operations being conducted simultaneously? This makes zero sense.

In the case of WTC7, why not hijack a 4th plane and hit it with that? If the government's intention was to make everyone believe that the planes brought down the WTC buildings, why leave #7 out? As you point out, it IS the most mysterious because, outside of falling rubble, it was not actually hit by anything. So... if you're planning this thing, why would you not simply hit the motherfucker with a plane, removing any doubt about why it came down? Why even make this a question? After planning such a massive operation, I don't see how the government could overlook something so simple as "oh, yeah we forgot to hit WTC 7 with anything, but we'll take it down with explosives... nobody will ask questions!"

5) Finally, I would ask you to simply outline a coherent theory about what happened on 9/11. The beauty of the true story is that it is a complete story. We know who was where and when. We know what they did, why they did it, and when they did it. Conspiracy theories regarding 9/11 are laughable because they aren't theories at all, they simply try to insert shadowy agents and figures into the gaps in our knowledge, they attack what they can and ignore the mountain of evidence that they cannot disprove. When one element of their charade is disproved, they simply flash to the next. We've seen this over and over again, so all I ask is that you explain to us who did it and why. Please. Once you attempt to do this, you'll realize that there is no coherence to your theory and that it's not a theory at all.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: jonks
Citing to proper authority is part of my job, so, yeah. If you're confused, let me set you up with the hierarchy.

website set up by disgruntled wingnuts
Again, so says you...
<<<<< Purdue University, along with the American Society of Civil Engineers

Who conducted the official findings without ever setting foot on ground zero before the forensic evidence was cleaned up. Yeah, sounds real convincing to me... :roll:

Yes, says me. An independent website cobbled together does not have the credibility of the American Socity of Civil Engineers. You're going dispute that, go ahead, your judgment is already demonstrated to be seriously lacking.

And here's their findings based on experimentation instead of speculation about how a loud sound "must have been a demolition because a building collapsing from fire doesn't sound like that."
http://channel.nationalgeograp...-conspiracy-vs-science

And again...what recognized organizations side with you?
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy
Originally posted by: munky
Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?

Are you expert enough to choose the larger number?

A. 99%
B. 1%

Take your time.

When 99% of experts in a specific field agree on something, it's considered an extremely strong consensus. 99% of experts agree that the official 9/11 story is correct. There's no question here: if you honestly reject the findings of multiple, scientific, independently reviewed tests that conclusively show that the buildings could have fallen when struck by aircraft, you are a moron and no one is going to take you seriously.

No, I'm expert enough to chose critical thinking over going with the flow... apparently you aren't.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy
Originally posted by: munky
Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?

Are you expert enough to choose the larger number?

A. 99%
B. 1%

Take your time.

When 99% of experts in a specific field agree on something, it's considered an extremely strong consensus. 99% of experts agree that the official 9/11 story is correct. There's no question here: if you honestly reject the findings of multiple, scientific, independently reviewed tests that conclusively show that the buildings could have fallen when struck by aircraft, you are a moron and no one is going to take you seriously.

No, I'm expert enough to chose critical thinking over going with the flow... apparently you aren't.

Lol. Accepting proven authorities 99% of which agree is 'going with the flow' and believing 1% of dissenters demonstrates critical thinking. I love you guys, I really do

What "critical thinking" should tell you is that it's rare for scientists to have a consensus of such magnitude, so that when they in fact do, that's likely the correct theory.
 
Feb 6, 2007
16,432
1
81
Originally posted by: munky
Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy
Originally posted by: munky
Uh huh... so says you. Are you the expert now to judge the qualifications of other professionals?

Are you expert enough to choose the larger number?

A. 99%
B. 1%

Take your time.

When 99% of experts in a specific field agree on something, it's considered an extremely strong consensus. 99% of experts agree that the official 9/11 story is correct. There's no question here: if you honestly reject the findings of multiple, scientific, independently reviewed tests that conclusively show that the buildings could have fallen when struck by aircraft, you are a moron and no one is going to take you seriously.

No, I'm expert enough to chose critical thinking over going with the flow... apparently you aren't.

It's not critical thinking to completely dismiss the findings of a group comprised entirely of people who have spent their entire lives learning and living the subject at hand and have considerably more expertise than you. I'm not a doctor, so if my doctor told me that I had pancreatic cancer, it wouldn't be "critical thinking" on my part to say, "actually, I believe it's just gas, you pompous windbag;" it'd be asinine. It's similarly asinine for you to dismiss a massive body of experts, every single one of whom knows considerably more about the field than you, in favor of some website with no accreditation and evidence which has been proven wrong.

If you actually "thought critically" instead of just leaping on wild conspiracy theories, you'd know that.
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,589
5
0
Originally posted by: kylebisme
I use spell check constantly, but occasionally slip up with the c/p when moving the checked text back to the message window.

ieSpell will spell check in your active window.
 

Munky

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2005
9,372
0
76
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
What evidence do you have for a controlled demolition? There are thousands of videos that there that purport to show "squibs." Have you ever seen a controlled demolition of a building? I'll give you a hint, it doesn't really look like what's shown in the video. More importantly, those discharges fit much more closely with the mountain of evidence that the building crushed itself. As each floor collapsed, it forced the air out of that floor, causing debris to fly sideways.

In a controlled demolition like the one that supposedly happened at the WTC, explosives must be set off in a controlled manner and precisely timed. Videos like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNftLdtL49E merely point out things that seem out of place, but they do not explain what those are. Sure they could be explosions, but then you'd have to answer the following questions:

1) Give the precise nature of such a demolition, why are these mysterious explosions seemingly random? Why do they occur in places that are not collapsing? Why do they direct their out the windows with such force?
Who says they're random? Answer this question: does a controlled demolition collapse a building instantaneously, is is there a short delay between when the charges go off and when the structure collapses?
2) How does this fit in with the context we have? Considering truthers seem to believe that thermite was used in the demolition, then how are there explosions to begin with? Thermite doesn't explode.
And regular office fires don't cause modern steel-frame buildings to collapse. What's your point?
Speaking of context, why don't you just answer these questions for me (ripped from my post earlier in this thread):

Hey friend,

Okay, here are some easy questions for you. #4 is most pertinent to our conversation right now.

1) If planes did not bring down the WTC, what did? How did it get there? A controlled demolition on the scale required by the WTC would have required thousands of pounds of explosives, miles (miles!) of detonation cord, and months of preparation. Have you ever seen videos of buildings when they're wired to come down? There is wire and explosives everywhere. In the WTC there was nothing. I hate to break it to you, but it would be nearly impossible for all of that stuff to be hidden.

2) What exactly blew up the building? Thermite? Thermite doesn't explode and, if this was a controlled demolition, why didn't the terrorists or whoever use real explosives rather than relying on something that has never been used to demolish a building before?

3) Who exactly was involved? At first glance, any sort of conspiracy greater than the planes implicates at least hundreds, if not thousands, of people. Knowledge of demolition, especially on the scale required to bring down the WTC is a rare commodity and would have been done by an expert. Again, that doesn't make it an impossibility, but if the "government" is involved are you accusing the NIST, FEMA, the military, the president, FDNY, the thousands of experts (both government and employed and not) who have independently concluded that the government is right, the NYPD, the hijackers, etc? Really? 21 guys versus thousands?

4) If the government is going to blow up a building, why do they concoct a complicated plan that involves hijacking a plane and slamming it into the building? There is WAAAY too much that could go wrong. What if the hijackers fail to take control of the plane? What if the plane misses the building? Why would they not make the cover story easier -- terrorists snuck truckloads of explosives into the building and blew it up? I mean, we already had an attack on the WTC which was exactly that, why not replicate it? PLUS, if you're going to go to the trouble of hijacking planes and slamming them into the building, why bother planting explosives? Why not load the planes with explosives? Why are there two high-risk operations being conducted simultaneously? This makes zero sense.

In the case of WTC7, why not hijack a 4th plane and hit it with that? If the government's intention was to make everyone believe that the planes brought down the WTC buildings, why leave #7 out? As you point out, it IS the most mysterious because, outside of falling rubble, it was not actually hit by anything. So... if you're planning this thing, why would you not simply hit the motherfucker with a plane, removing any doubt about why it came down? Why even make this a question? After planning such a massive operation, I don't see how the government could overlook something so simple as "oh, yeah we forgot to hit WTC 7 with anything, but we'll take it down with explosives... nobody will ask questions!"

5) Finally, I would ask you to simply outline a coherent theory about what happened on 9/11. The beauty of the true story is that it is a complete story. We know who was where and when. We know what they did, why they did it, and when they did it. Conspiracy theories regarding 9/11 are laughable because they aren't theories at all, they simply try to insert shadowy agents and figures into the gaps in our knowledge, they attack what they can and ignore the mountain of evidence that they cannot disprove. When one element of their charade is disproved, they simply flash to the next. We've seen this over and over again, so all I ask is that you explain to us who did it and why. Please. Once you attempt to do this, you'll realize that there is no coherence to your theory and that it's not a theory at all.

What exactly blew up the building? Who exactly was involved? Would you rather have consult my crystal ball, or should it suffice to say that the ones who really know the answers aren't talking, and the ones who want to know can't conduct a forensic investigation when the evidence has been destroyed long ago?
 

ElFenix

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Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
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Originally posted by: munky
What exactly blew up the building? Who exactly was involved? Would you rather have consult my crystal ball, or should it suffice to say that the ones who really know the answers aren't talking, and the ones who want to know can't conduct a forensic investigation when the evidence has been destroyed long ago?

the fact that the president can't keep a blow job secret tells me all i need to know. unless the blow job was leaked by 'them' to make it appear that the place is full of leaks and there by throw people off their trail

<.<

>.>
 
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