Why fight America's war?

[ectx]

tell me something I don't know already

 

[SuperStrokey]

Thats not what started the renaissance, it was a large group of books that monks had hidden for hundreds of years. That really started it, the crusades and what they brought back merely set the stage.

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

It is not discriminatory. I dont need to check it anywhere. It is not archaic, and not outdated, and not inferior.

It clearly is discriminatory. It discriminates between those of Muslim beliefs and those of non-Muslim beliefs. Clearly discriminatory. Any discriminatory tax system is inferior.

And yes, it is outdated and archaic. A discriminatory system that has its foundations and purpose during tribal times. Clearly outdated as it is no longer needed.

It is not discriminatory
It is not archaic
It is not outdated
It is not inferior

 

[MegaWorks]

Originally posted by: SuperStrokey
Thats not what started the renaissance, it was a large group of books that monks had hidden for hundreds of years. That really started it, the crusades and what they brought back merely set the stage.

sure it did! :roll:

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

It is not discriminatory. I dont need to check it anywhere. It is not archaic, and not outdated, and not inferior.

It clearly is discriminatory. It discriminates between those of Muslim beliefs and those of non-Muslim beliefs. Clearly discriminatory. Any discriminatory tax system is inferior.

And yes, it is outdated and archaic. A discriminatory system that has its foundations and purpose during tribal times. Clearly outdated as it is no longer needed.

It is not discriminatory
It is not archaic
It is not outdated
It is not inferior

It is all four. Perhaps you should look up discriminatory in the dictionary.

If it is discriminatory, then it is archaic outdated and inferior.

Perhaps your bigot like view is clouding the dictionary in front of you.

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

It is not discriminatory. I dont need to check it anywhere. It is not archaic, and not outdated, and not inferior.

It clearly is discriminatory. It discriminates between those of Muslim beliefs and those of non-Muslim beliefs. Clearly discriminatory. Any discriminatory tax system is inferior.

And yes, it is outdated and archaic. A discriminatory system that has its foundations and purpose during tribal times. Clearly outdated as it is no longer needed.

It is not discriminatory
It is not archaic
It is not outdated
It is not inferior

It is all four. Perhaps you should look up discriminatory in the dictionary.

If it is discriminatory, then it is archaic outdated and inferior.

Perhaps your bigot like view is clouding the dictionary in front of you.

It is not discriminatory
It is not archaic
It is not outdated
It is not inferior

 

[imported_tss4]

Don't repeat posts, Sultan. If you have evidence to support your claim then present it. But the simple truth is you don't. The system of government you speak of is inherintly unequal.

 

[GasX]

The OP is such a flaming troll or a complete and utter unintelligible moron that I am surprised anyone let this thread get so long...

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Mwilding
The OP is such a flaming troll or a complete and utter unintelligible moron that I am surprised anyone let this thread get so long...

Actually he demonstrates the fututilty of trying to bring civility and freedom to those of that region..even at the point of a gun.

 

[powerMarkymark]

Big brother needs help to kick Iraqi butt, me thinks not.

 

[alchemize]

What I don't understand is why they are arguing about the *tax system*???

Geez, you want to surface all the obscene discriminatory brutality, just start talking about women's rights in islam.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: MegaWorks

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: hatim
talking about a 10 year time frame\

Also one thing Ive learned: Americans/Canadians always think too much of themseleves. Leave them alone, they will learn if they want.

Well anyways, equality: We will all lie in a grave similar sized similar state alone.

So then all humans are created equal. Like a plain blank peice of paper. Then whatever is taught to them, is written onto that paper and thats how the person shapes up. Americans have been taught that they are above everyone else and that they can disrespect everyone/anyone they feel like. I can see how they dump old people into nursing homes. Well, a drop of ink is not going to change those views. Let them be.

I am unsure of what exactly I am supposed to learn.

How to build a backward Theocratic government in my own backyard perhaps?

Seeing how far the "Western" world has progressed in such a short amount of time leads me to think that we must have gotten something right, while large parts of the world are rather slowly lurching out of the industrial revolution.

It's war that destroys civilizitions, remember that before the crusaders the Arabe world was like the western world of today (advance in science, mathematics, philosophy etc) and the west was the opposite. After the fall of the Abbasids the biggest library in the world in Baghdad was destroyed by the mongolian army. When the crusaders invaded the arabe world, they brought back home some arabic books in which they were translated in latin. These books influenced many western lecturers in the 14th century and that created the renaissance (the transitional movement in Europe).

I truly believe that thanks to the advancements made by the arabes (Abbasids empire), the Western world succeed in progressing rapidly

IIRC, the Renaissance was triggered by a rising middle class, renewed affluence, and the subsuquent decline of the feudal system in Europe.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Mwilding
The OP is such a flaming troll or a complete and utter unintelligible moron that I am surprised anyone let this thread get so long...

Actually he demonstrates the fututilty of trying to bring civility and freedom to those of that region..even at the point of a gun.

good post :beer:

 

[Sultan]

I have provided evidence. If you would only read the posts...

The system of government I speak of is not unequal

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: alchemize
What I don't understand is why they are arguing about the *tax system*???

Geez, you want to surface all the obscene discriminatory brutality, just start talking about women's rights in islam.

Women have more than enough rights in Islam. If you have reasons to believe contrary, please let me know, and I'll give you proof otherwise.

 

[imported_tss4]

Originally posted by: Sultan
I have provided evidence. If you would only read the posts...

The system of government I speak of is not unequal

I read all the posts. There was no evidence. Only you saying that unequal tax amounts were fair.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: alchemize
What I don't understand is why they are arguing about the *tax system*???

Geez, you want to surface all the obscene discriminatory brutality, just start talking about women's rights in islam.

Women have more than enough rights in Islam. If you have reasons to believe contrary, please let me know, and I'll give you proof otherwise.

But not equal rights to a man, correct?

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: tss4

Originally posted by: Sultan
I have provided evidence. If you would only read the posts...

The system of government I speak of is not unequal

I read all the posts. There was no evidence. Only you saying that unequal tax amounts were fair.

Did you not read my subsequent posts after I posted the first one in which I incorrectly stated that Jizyah is higher than Zakat? I have repeatedly stated that while Muslims pay Zakat, the non-Muslims pay Jizyah. Equal but distributed in a different way. The Islamic government, in its discretion can also charge higher taxes from both Muslims and non-Muslims. Additionally, the non-Muslims can choose whether to enter into the contract of paying Jizyah or not. This is the concept of Jizyah is a nut-shell.

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: alchemize
What I don't understand is why they are arguing about the *tax system*???

Geez, you want to surface all the obscene discriminatory brutality, just start talking about women's rights in islam.

Women have more than enough rights in Islam. If you have reasons to believe contrary, please let me know, and I'll give you proof otherwise.

But not equal rights to a man, correct?

If you mean the same as a man's rights, then no.
If you mean equivalent to a man's right, then yes.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: alchemize
What I don't understand is why they are arguing about the *tax system*???

Geez, you want to surface all the obscene discriminatory brutality, just start talking about women's rights in islam.

Women have more than enough rights in Islam. If you have reasons to believe contrary, please let me know, and I'll give you proof otherwise.

But not equal rights to a man, correct?

If you mean the same as a man's rights, then no.
If you mean equivalent to a man's right, then yes.

What is your definition of "equivalent"?

 

[Doboji]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: tss4

Originally posted by: Sultan
I have provided evidence. If you would only read the posts...

The system of government I speak of is not unequal

I read all the posts. There was no evidence. Only you saying that unequal tax amounts were fair.

Did you not read my subsequent posts after I posted the first one in which I incorrectly stated that Jizyah is higher than Zakat? I have repeatedly stated that while Muslims pay Zakat, the non-Muslims pay Jizyah. Equal but distributed in a different way. The Islamic government, in its discretion can also charge higher taxes from both Muslims and non-Muslims. Additionally, the non-Muslims can choose whether to enter into the contract of paying Jizyah or not. This is the concept of Jizyah is a nut-shell.

Wow... this thread is still alive huh?

Well allow me to point out the stupidity of you argument Sultan.

Simply put: Islamic government = discrimination = unequal = unacceptable

Logic:

Jizya: Muslims and Non Muslims pay a different tax

Public worship: Churches, Synagogues, etc, are not permitted within Islamic society

Non-Muslims, Non-Christians, Non-Jews are not permitted citzenship at all.

Ummmm only a bloody fool could not see this as blatant systematic discrimination.

-Max

 

[Doboji]

The Jizya is bad because it allows the government to tax non-muslims differently.... if a particular government decided it wanted to remove, or put pressure on non-muslims to convert, it could simply raise the Jizya... as there is nothing in the Quran to stop the government for doing this.

Thus, the Jizya is the mechanism by which an islamic government can dish out religious persecution.

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: Doboji
The Jizya is bad because it allows the government to tax non-muslims differently.... if a particular government decided it wanted to remove, or put pressure on non-muslims to convert, it could simply raise the Jizya... as there is nothing in the Quran to stop the government for doing this.

Jizyah is not bad.

The reasoning you gave is valid however. But you must remember that it is man who corrupts religion and therefore the society in general.

I doubt Christians and Jews and Hindus are taught to have pre-marital sex (which can cause diseases, low morals, etc) or have alcohol (drunk driving, wife beating, etc). But they do it anyways. An Islamic government is also headed by man. Religion is meant to provide guidelines. It is upto man to implement them.

Thus, the Jizya is the mechanism by which an islamic government can dish out religious persecution.

History has shown how many clerics have used interpretations of religious doctrines for political, economic gain and for religious persecution. That does not mean the religious doctrines are bad.

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: alchemize
What I don't understand is why they are arguing about the *tax system*???

Geez, you want to surface all the obscene discriminatory brutality, just start talking about women's rights in islam.

Women have more than enough rights in Islam. If you have reasons to believe contrary, please let me know, and I'll give you proof otherwise.

But not equal rights to a man, correct?

If you mean the same as a man's rights, then no.
If you mean equivalent to a man's right, then yes.

What is your definition of "equivalent"?

What is your defnition of "equal"?

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: alchemize
What I don't understand is why they are arguing about the *tax system*???

Geez, you want to surface all the obscene discriminatory brutality, just start talking about women's rights in islam.

Women have more than enough rights in Islam. If you have reasons to believe contrary, please let me know, and I'll give you proof otherwise.

But not equal rights to a man, correct?

If you mean the same as a man's rights, then no.
If you mean equivalent to a man's right, then yes.

What is your definition of "equivalent"?

What is your defnition of "equal"?

How would the respective rights of men and women under Islamic rule compare to those granted under a "Western" system (lets say the US for this example)?