WinXP is way overpriced!

[rumble07]

I was thinking about buying WinXP as a Christmas gift to myself until I did a little looking around. Turns out that if you don't have a new system with new peripherals then you'd better be planning on winning a lottery. First off, I'd have to buy the full verson because my current OS, Win98SE, is an upgrade. Then I'd have to buy a new scanner because there are no plans to offer WinXP drivers for my expensive Epson 636 Perfection SCSI scanner...which is only a couple of years old. ( the SCSI host adapter would be rendered obsolete too). And then there's my Norton SystemWorks software....no good anymore in WinXP. Undoubtedly a lot of my other software wouldn't work either. I haven't checked out my HP 722C printer yet, but it's a few years old so there's probably a problem there too. None of this stuff is worn out by any means.
The fact that WinXP renders most of your hardware useless is bad enough, but they add insult to injury by not letting you upgrade from anythng but a full version previous OS. This must be an OS for the wealthy I guess. Far as I'm concerned they can stick it where the sun don't shine.

 

[Nothinman]

Then I'd have to buy a new scanner because there are no plans to offer WinXP drivers for my expensive Epson 636 Perfection SCSI scanner...which is only a couple of years old.

This is far from MS' fault, bitch at Epson if you want them to actually support their hardware.

And then there's my Norton SystemWorks software....no good anymore

Norton software is no good in the first place, but that's just my opinion.

Undoubtedly a lot of my other software wouldn't work either.

Depends, most normal software works fine. So far you listed software that's very dependent on the OS and device drivers, not a valid base for comparison of the rest of the world's software.

If you don't want to run it that's fine, but there's no reason to whine about it.

 

[YBS1]

Or maybe you should check your facts before you go off on your next rant. You don't need a full copy of Win98, an upgrade disc will work fine regardless of what you heard from someone who heard from someone, etc. I can't see how it's terribly overpriced...retail pc game - 3 months use average - $50...WinXP Home Upgrade - probably 1.5 to 3 years use average - $100, you do the math. As for Norton System Works, explain to me how that is a Microsoft issue rather than a Symantec one? HP had no plans to offer software for my printer and scanner either....think it may have been because XP supports them natively? If it didn't I refer you to the statement before, would have been a problem with HP, not Microsoft. Finally, I've yet to install a piece of software that either didn't work or hadn't been patched within a week or two of my getting XP. Your experience may vary. Everyone loves a good Microsoft rant, but at least come up with suitable reasons.

 

[HardwareAddicted]

Well, I'm not sure I can help much with the hardware trouble you will have getting drivers and stuff like that from your MFG's ....

But I can help you save a little cash on the OS if ya like.

Check out the thread here....



~ The Addicted One

 

[rumble07]

<< You don't need a full copy of Win98, an upgrade disc will work fine regardless of what you heard from someone who heard from someone, etc. I can't >>


Well that's odd because FutureShop clearly states on their website that WinXP cannot be installed from a Win98SE upgrade...bold print. I don't think it's a ploy to sell the full version either, they'd run too much risk of losing the sale altogether.


<< This is far from MS' fault, bitch at Epson if you want them to actually support their hardware. >>


I disagree...it's partly Epson's fault and they'll be hearing from me too. Mostly it's Microsoft's fault for cutting corners on supported hardware. It's not like my scanner is an antique. It's also not an obscure make or model, only two years ago it was a PC Magazine's Editor's Choice scanner...and yet it seems that Microsoft has never heard of it.


<< I can't see how it's terribly overpriced >>


It's overpriced if you have to buy the full retail version in order to install it from a previous version of Windows. Who has $300+(Can.) to buy an OS every 18 months or so? Especially if the OS renders half your hardware obsolete.

 

[skyking]

If you have an afternoon to waste, you can find a demo version of XP, or borrow someone's cd, and install it on an empty partition or drive. Then the fun begins! I put it on an old Tiny computer, and did not activate it. This gives you 30 days to tweak it up, or abandon it. Ancient(10? years old) epson printer was natively driven, old jaton vid card works good, only had to get a modem driver from Tiny for the softmodem AMR card. This wasn't a signed driver, and I had to force it on XP pro, but all works fine. The only problem is the slowness of an old, weak system with a huge and complicated OS. This was just an experiment, Tiny will likely get win98se, Xp will go on the Athlon xp machine.

 

[YBS1]

Regardless of what FutureShop states on their site, I can assure you they are wrong. Unless of course my Windows 98 disc that clearly states "Upgrade" on it was one of those rare, secret "full version in upgrade disguise" discs. Considering when I install it to a clean drive it asks for my Windows 95 disc, I don't think that is the case. WinXP Pro simply asked me to insert a qualifying product to install, I inserted my Win98 upgrade disc and away the install went.

 

[Psychoholic]

<< It's overpriced if you have to buy the full retail version in order to install it from a previous version of Windows. Who has $300+(Can.) to buy an OS every 18 months or so? Especially if the OS renders half your hardware obsolete. >>


Then don't buy it. Geez.. some people here are acting like MS is pointing a gun at their head and forcing them to buy the product. <rolleyes>

 

[CQuinn]

Futureshop (or any other retailer) can only go by the official policy
given by Microsoft. That doesn't mean the software won't work in
other configurations, only that they cannot garuantee that it will
work in untested situations. Since others here have reported that
it does work in those situation, it is up to you to do the research
and determine if such a course of install is right for you.




<< Mostly it's Microsoft's fault for cutting corners on supported hardware >>



Bzzzt, wrong. MS doesn't write the drivers (except in extreme circumstances).
They get the drivers that the manufacturer provides, makes sure those drivers
meet the requirements of the OS, and then bundle those as the official release
drivers for the initial install. It is completely up to the vendor to provide
drivers beyond the basic functionality. As for "cutting corners" XP supports
many more drivers and new hardware than Windows 2000 did, and MS has really
pressed the requirements of WHQL testing to insure stable drivers are released
for XP, so the fault is more with companies that will not / did not
invest in better legacy support for their products.



<< It's not like my scanner is an antique. >>



You said yourself it's a couple of years old, that's a couple of
generations of technology, even for scanners. Did you even check to
see if there were Windows 2000 drivers for the scanner? Any XP driver
would have to be based on the NT/2000 driver or written from scratch.
Again, the ball is in Epsons court on that matter.
(You also did not mention what model SCSI card you are using with it)

And BTW: According to this this MS Knowledgebase article
- cached by google here :

" This article provides a list of scanners that are supported by Windows Image
Acquisition (WIA) in Windows XP. These scanners have WIA device drivers that are,
or that will soon be included in Windows XP. "

The Perfection 636 36Bit 600x1200dpi SCSI is listed.

Epson does seem to have a twain driver for Windows 2000 , so support for XP should be possible.

 

[rumble07]

The info you point to is very helpful..thanks. My scanner is not listed among those which will be getting future support on Epson's own website. I would probably still have to buy a new SCSI card though because the Adaptec AVA-2902E than came with the scanner is not on Microsft's list....nor Adaptec's list of future supported devices.

 

[Rankor]

<< And then there's my Norton SystemWorks software....no good anymore in WinXP >>



Depends on the version you're using. If you're using Norton 2002 sw, you should be fine, but check out Symantec's site for any updates or patches using LiveUpdate.

Norton 2001 will work, also. You have to head over to Symantec's site and look for a patch that fixes an incompatibility with XP. Norton 2000 and older versions might have to upgrade.

XP isn't overpriced; price has gone up, since Win98 SE, but this is an OS based off the NT kernel and not some mish-mash of 16-bit and 32-bit code. Win98 full version was $179 and Win98 Upgrade was $89.

If you want (XP), you pay for it. If you don't really need it and require legacy support, you don't buy it and stick with whatever you're using now.

 

[mrman3k]

I have the HP 720C printer which is the same as your 722C and XP has native drivers that support it, even though the upgrade advisor said the HP software will not work, but the software built into WinXP is just great. I like it a lot more since I can plug my scanner in and it recognizes it and it is ready to use in Windows w/o any extra software. Try to get a demo copy or something and see how your hardware works, I definetly have to give MS props for XP, it is been what I have been waiting for since Win98.

 

[resinboy]

In every instance where an XP driver was not available for a piece of my hardware, a 2K driver worked fine, since XP is actually NT5.1.


Resinboy

 

[rbV5]

Seems like it cost $10 more than I paid for Win2k pro(worth it to me), the rest of what you spew is classic FUD.

 

[phalsedoom]

But why upgrade? That is the question that you have to ask your self. if your system works fine now, what is the point? we are simply behaving like automatons with this upgrade fancy. Stick with the old grey mare if she still has some good stuff.

 

[baisezmoi]

<< winXP is way overpriced! >>



not really, i paid around $100cad for an WinxP home full version OEM, no fancy packaging or silly manuals i don't how much that is in american dollars but i'm sure it isnt alot.



<< offer WinXP drivers for my expensive Epson 636 Perfection SCSI scanner >>



shouldn't epson be responsible for thier hardware drivers and support?



<< The fact that WinXP renders most of your hardware useless is bad enough, >>



no, that fact most hardware manufacturers are too lazy to release new hardware drivers is another reason not to buy from them in the future.

 

[rumble07]

Well I'm not intrinsically anti-Windows, I've never run anything else. Some of you seem to be super defensive about XP...are there a lot of MS employees in the room or what? Or have you just formed an unnatural bond with your operating system? A preliminary look at it would lead most people to arrive at the same conclusions I did...that I'd be looking at a lot bigger expenditure than just the OS itself. However, it's looking like the thing may be more flexible than its billing would suggest. If it'll run my hardware I can cut it some slack. And surely one can be forgiven for assuming XP can't be installed from a Win98 upgrade when various retailers are saying just that.
And to Psychohlic who suggests the simplest thing is just to not buy it, I thought about that, but I really kind of want it..you know? I'll probably end up with a dual boot setup, Win98SE and WinXP, then if it's lacking in legacy support I'll have some options.

 

[rumble07]

baissezmoi,

Where did you get the OEM for $100?

 

[baisezmoi]

rumble, actually i have a friend who works at microsoft get me the winXP home full version for $30US so it came out to around $60cad.

if you want a place to buy an oem copy try : http://www.ntcw.com/ it sell for around $155cad.

 

[rbV5]

<< Some of you seem to be super defensive about XP...are there a lot of MS employees in the room or what? Or have you just formed an unnatural bond with your operating system? >>



I think its more a perception issue, that and the fact that this subject has been done to death and of course gems like "The fact that WinXP renders most of your hardware useless is bad enough" that illicits those kind of responses.

It gives you the core functionality of your computer, you can pay anywhere from $0 to $299 for Linux to WinXP full retail, you're choice. Either will last for years if you want (lots of peope using Win98 still) and yes, you can pick up XP OEM from most retailers when you buy a HD or MB for $100. How many people will pay $50 for RTCW or new PS games? We have software at work that goes for $15000 a seat, and thats nothing when you start talking to a video or animation house, multiply that by 5 for the support you need to go with it.

You get alot for your money IMHO, but you don't have to spend anything for your OS if you don't want to.

 

[Yvo]

You can buy OEM software off of Pricewatch.

I have seem WinXP Home Edition for as low as $83, but you need to buy a piece of hardware (OEM licensing rules), so either buy a ram upgrade or a cheap $6 soundcard .

Good luck!

Yvo

 

[themadmonk]

All of MS' products are overpriced, especially Office XP.

 

[Nothinman]

All of MS' products are overpriced, especially Office XP.

What would you charge and how did you come up with the number?