WMD - Bekaa Valley

[outriding]

Originally posted by: lanche
You people are so predictable. By all means please continue to keep your inacurrate and irrelevant views. You and people like you have been and will continue to be on the wrong side of history. Your only use at this point is pure entertainment value and even that will get old as your arguement already has.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, even you, and I respect that. Actually if it wasn't for people like you we would not have any exmples of the mindset that could have been detrimental to the security of this wonderful country.

To correct your ignorance here is a link, with your "evidence" that discusses two shells found in Iraq last year, one containing sarin, and one containing mustard gas. The amount of sarin gas estimated to be in the shell was enough to kill 40,000 people+-. If thats not WMD, then what is. At what point do you draw the line? I know, I know, its not stockpiles but it does provide proof that your "evidence" of nothing existing after 1990 is just plain wrong and it shows just how ignorant and irrelevant you are.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,120401,00.html

We all know that you most likely will bash this as well due to it being a Fox News link but do your research and you will find more stories that cover this. Of course the reality of it is, is that people like you will ALWAYS find a way to bash any argument that is pro war. History has proven that it takes war to bring peace.

Peoplpe who understand how this world works understand that there will always be a "pecking order". It is the way of nature. Meaning that some country will always have more power than any others. If not already there then they will be striving to achieve this. It would appear to me that you do not want the US in that position. So who would you prefer to be at the top?

Thank you for being out there to use as an example. No offense intended.

Do you relize that sarin has a really short shelf life so your beloved fox news story really doesnt go anywhere.

edit spelling..

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: lanche
You people are so predictable. By all means please continue to keep your inacurrate and irrelevant views. You and people like you have been and will continue to be on the wrong side of history. Your only use at this point is pure entertainment value and even that will get old as your arguement already has.

<rest of BS snipped>

<ahem>

Pay attention, n00b:

Weapons of Mass destruction found.
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...hreadid=1311977&enterthread=y&arctab=y

Polish Troops Find Sarin Warheads in Iraq
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...hreadid=1343389&enterthread=y&arctab=y

Iraq had no WMD: the final verdict
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...hreadid=1398298&enterthread=y&arctab=y

 

[Jhhnn]

Even your link lanche, describes the found shells as ancient, probably duds fired or lost during the Iraq / Iran conflict of 15 years ago. This in no way proves the allegations of chemical weapons stockpiles or manufacture since the early 90's, or their transport to the Bekaa, and anybody with enough sense to pour piss out of a boot has given up on that little bit of malarkey... given that they were unmarked, they might not have even been of Iraqi manufacture- both sides made extensive use of chemical weapons in that conflict... Misplaced sarin based weapons were recently found on the grounds of the former Rocky Mtn Arsenal, too, and there are literally hundreds of thousands virtually unguarded in wooden sheds and crumbling crates in the former Soviet Union...

But, please, tell us more about the Bible Codes- I think I have a Ouija Board around here, somewhere, if you think it might be useful in support of your cause...

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
anybody with enough sense to pour piss out of a boot has given up on that little bit of malarkey...
But, please, tell us more about the Bible Codes- I think I have a Ouija Board around here, somewhere, if you think it might be useful in support of your cause...

:laugh::thumbsup:

 

[lanche]

Do you relize that sarin has a really short shelf life so your beloved fox news story really doesnt go anywhere.


Point noted. Thanks for the info but it is irrelevant to the point of my arguement that Sarin is WMD.

Its hard to carry on a valuable debate when one side doesn't take the time to comprehend the actual subject of the debate. Please read and comprehend before responding. You may be better off leaving this to those that understand the concept.

Thanks again for the info.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: lanche


Do you relize that sarin has a really short shelf life so your beloved fox news story really doesnt go anywhere.


Point noted. Thanks for the info but it is irrelevant to the point of my arguement that Sarin is WMD.

Its hard to carry on a valuable debate when one side doesn't take the time to comprehend the actual subject of the debate. Please read and comprehend before responding. You may be better off leaving this to those that understand the concept.

Thanks again for the info.

<ahem>

Pay attention, n00b:

Weapons of Mass destruction found.
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...hreadid=1311977&enterthread=y&arctab=y

Polish Troops Find Sarin Warheads in Iraq
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...hreadid=1343389&enterthread=y&arctab=y

Iraq had no WMD: the final verdict
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...hreadid=1398298&enterthread=y&arctab=y

 

[Darkhawk28]

Man, the neocons are DESPERATE!

 

[MoFunk]

Originally posted by: conjurI take it you have conceded them, then, and are afraid to admit your beloved NY Times article proves nothing that you claim.

Concede what? A pissing match with an idiot liberal? You could find a WMD shoved up your backside and would still deny it!

Beloved NYTimes? The cornerstone of liberal idiocy? Whatever! I guess I need to subscribe to the Conjur times for the REAL news.

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: MoFunk

Originally posted by: conjurI take it you have conceded them, then, and are afraid to admit your beloved NY Times article proves nothing that you claim.

Concede what? A pissing match with an idiot liberal? You could find a WMD shoved up your backside and would still deny it!

Beloved NYTimes? The cornerstone of liberal idiocy? Whatever! I guess I need to subscribe to the Conjur times for the REAL news.

You and all the people that think there are WMD's need to go to Iraq and look for them. Granted this administration has given up on that.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: MoFunk

Originally posted by: conjurI take it you have conceded them, then, and are afraid to admit your beloved NY Times article proves nothing that you claim.

Concede what? A pissing match with an idiot liberal? You could find a WMD shoved up your backside and would still deny it!

Beloved NYTimes? The cornerstone of liberal idiocy? Whatever! I guess I need to subscribe to the Conjur times for the REAL news.

You're the one that's harping on this NY Times article as some sort of proof that WMDs existed when that article says NOTHING of the sort.

 

[Infohawk]

WMDs are in the ground, somewhere. Iraq was going to use them on the US with ICBMs or give them to islamo-terrorists. GWB cares about the environment and is actively working to protect it. GWB cares about the poor and the elderly, he's compassionate. GWB is just an average joe from Texas who because of his sheer intelligence got into Yale, but I'd drink beers with him. Muslims hate our freedom.

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: Infohawk
WMDs are in the ground, somewhere. Iraq was going to use them on the US with ICBMs or give them to islamo-terrorists. GWB cares about the environment and is actively working to protect it. GWB cares about the poor and the elderly, he's compassionate. GWB is just an average joe from Texas who because of his sheer intelligence got into Yale, but I'd drink beers with him. Muslims hate our freedom.

I can see the goose-stepping now!

 

[lanche]

Yes, yes thanks for the links. I must admit that it sucks being the N00B.

Look, I stumbled upon this thread last night and it interested me so put in my two cents.

But it seems to me and correct me if I'm wrong (no invitation need I'm sure) that your argument that these WMD's found in Iraq could be from anywhere is right on. I however would draw a correlation between your stance and the guy you see on COPS that was caught with drugs in his car and he tells the cop that its not his. Or that his cousin must have left it there. Possession is 9/10 - I hate to use that cliche but it fits.

This arguement will continue as I'm sure your response will be forthcoming. And believe it or not I respect your thoughts and beliefs, I just don't agree with them. I think Saddam had every intention of using WMD any way he thought fit to hurt and kill anyone, who disagreed with him, including and especially Americans. And I feel Bush made the correct decision to bi-lateraly disarm him.

Believe me I think George Bush has some issues but the guy is solid in his beliefs and his stance on the War on Terror, of which Irag has been and is a part of ( uh oh - I feel I might have opened a can of worms on that one). And ultimately the War on Terror trumps everything else, in my opinion.

I must say that I do not participate in these threads very often but you guys seemed that you had a thread here that stuck to the issues and refrained, for the most part, from belittleing people and their beliefs.

I can see how addicting these threads can be but as quickly as I came I must leave. Due to your respect and valid opinions that you have provided me I will probably check in from time to time to try to give you my perspective, which I feel is an important part of being an American.

One last thing before I have to go out and pay the bills. I have yet to see a response to my question posed in an earlier post asking about the pecking order that is part of nature. And it would appear that some of you may not realize that your stance dictates that the US should not be the top dog on the block. Just curious.

Thanks for firing me up last night and the continuation this morning. So are you all self made millionaires or just invisible to the boss while sitting in your cube?

Take care

 

[Jhhnn]

You've missed the point entirely, lanche. Nobody denies that the Iraqis had and used Chemical weapons during their war with Iran, or that they existed at the end of GW1. The Iraqis claim that they were all destroyed, to the best of their ability, shortly thereafter, and there's really been no evidence presented to the contrary.

In the chaos of War, things get lost, misplaced, buried as the tide turns one way and then the other- vast swaths of countryside get obliterated, whatever was there is lost- at least until somebody finds it. And such appears to be the case with the very few chemical warfare implements found to date- Iraqi insurgents came across them, and thinking they were conventional explosive shells, used them in IED's. It in no way implicates the former Iraqi regime in the maintenance of chemical weapons stockpiles up into the time of the invasion.

Insurgents everywhere are great scroungers and scavengers- they have to be. The Vietcong routinely defused unexploded American ordnance, sweated out the TNT, used it for their own... and the former battlefields of the world are littered with unexploded ordnance- some places in France are still off-limits to humans because of unexploded WW1 ordnance...

 

[lanche]

I see your point.

I guess what it boils down to for me is that in this post 911 era to claim that Bush deliberately lied about the existance of WMD's just to go to war, in my opinion, is ridiculous. I'm not saying thats your stance, maybe it is or isn't(I have not read this entire thread) but I do think that is what the general left likes to rant and thus is at the base of almost any discussion I get into with them about WMD.

Truth is no one knows what really was the case in Iraq with WMD. All we had to go on was the intel reports, Saddam's history, his obvious ambiguity in his WMD report and his unwillingness to comply fully with years of UN resolutions. I think its too easy for people to look at the info we have now and lay the blame at Bush's feet. Looking at what was available at the time and what had just happend on 911 I personally am glad Bush acted as a true leader should. I do not believe that Saddam had anything to do with 911 but with a tyrant like that with weapons like he had it is absolutely amazing to me that people would believe that he would remain separate and in no way connected to terrorist organizations.

Take away any of the three items above, keeping in mind that the WMD report was related to the resolution, and Sadaam would still be in power and we never go to war. So it makes sense to me that if you consider those items - something had to be done and I feel Bush was justified. Not to mention I still believe he moved the weapons out or hid them. And thats not a political opinion, just common sense.

As for the Bible Codes issue that you happily bust my chops on, I was like you when I first heard about them. I would bust on people just as you have, telling people that I bet they also believe in that hack Nostradamous and his incredibly generalized predictions. I'm not even a religious person - I believe in the string theory or band theory as it has evolved into. Although some believe the strings/bands that make up everythinig in the universe are "thoughts of god". However, I've been researching these Bible Codes for over two years now and there are some incredibly intelligent and highly respected people that have studied this and put their reputations on the line. They have uncovered some provable formulas that have led to some undeniable discoveries in the books of the old testament.

Well I'm sure I have opened myself up for more bashing but I guess it comes with the territory when you discuss items that are only theory. Some agree others bash.

Thanks for your time

Later