News XBOX Series S trailer leaked

[Hans de Vries]

Wow $299
1440p gameplay at up to 120Hz
Upscaling to 4k, 512GB SSD.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1303252607759130624

And it's official now:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1303230071033880576

 

[moinmoin]

I will admit that I'm worried about one aspect of it... how it might make things too bright. As much as I give Sony flak for my TV's slow processor, my 930e has really good picture quality for a non-OLED TV. Given HDR content with high luminescence values, the TV gets quite bright. So, when I'm seeing heat maps of Yakuza 0 with many 1000-nit spots all over the screen, I can only imagine how ridiculously bright it will be. That's sort of the odd thing about it; if your TV cannot get that bright, it won't seem as bad.

Yeah, I get that worry. If you watch the second video you see Auto HDR does mostly a good job picking the correct highlighted areas (personally I think Yakuza with all its neon light was supposed to be this bright). Where it did wrong were the whites of the eyes in Banjo, and it's widely rumored it may clash with plenty of the in-game OSDs and menus. As it uses machine learning I expect it to improve further so I'm not too concerned right now. For me the excitement of getting HDR in all the games that didn't have it before (Panzer Dragoon!) prevails for now. ^^

 

[piokos]

Yeah, that's only enough storage for what... 3 modern AAA titles and the base operating system?

If the new texture compression feature delivers, 1440p games shouldn't take more space than 1080p on Xbox One S.
So that's probably around 50GB per game. Titles that need 100GB are very rare.

You can use an external USB drive (cheap HDD as well) for older games that aren't designed to benefit from the fast SSD.
An external SATA SSD (512GB for under $100) will be 10x faster than Xbox One S HDD and just 4-5x slower than the more expensive dedicated NVMe expansion.
I'll probably use a leftover SSD from the PC.

From what we've heard, Xbox will use the NVMe SSD for Quick Resume no matter where the game files are kept.

 

[ultimatebob]

If the new texture compression feature delivers, 1440p games shouldn't take more space than 1080p on Xbox One S.
So that's probably around 50GB per game. Titles that need 100GB are very rare.

You can use an external USB drive (cheap HDD as well) for older games that aren't designed to benefit from the fast SSD.
An external SATA SSD (512GB for under $100) will be 10x faster than Xbox One S HDD and just 4-5x slower than the more expensive dedicated NVMe expansion.
I'll probably use a leftover SSD from the PC.

From what we've heard, Xbox will use the NVMe SSD for Quick Resume no matter where the game files are kept.

I'm thinking about games like Red Dead Redemption 2 and Call of Duty Modern Warfare, which take up over 150 GB of space on their own. I also see games getting even larger, not smaller.

 

[piokos]

I'm thinking about games like Red Dead Redemption 2 and Call of Duty Modern Warfare, which take up over 150 GB of space on their own. I also see games getting even larger, not smaller.

From what I've read, RDR2 needs 107GB on Xbox One X, slightly under 90GB on One S.
150GB?

Anyway, you're arguing based on obvious outliers. Yes, very large games happen. Very small games (<1GB) happen as well. Most popular titles are somewhere in the 10-60 GB range. So even on a 512GB drive you'll be able to install enough games to play something different every day of a week.

And if someone is seriously unlucky - he likes to play multiple games in turns and all titles he likes will be 150GB, then he'll be unhappy whichever console he buys, because:
Series S: 3 games,
PS5: 5 games,
Series X: 6 games

Avid gamers will probably get the Series X anyway for the better IQ.
But for a more casual gamer, 512GB shouldn't mean great sacrifices. These people (me included) usually rotate between 2-3 games for weeks.
There's also a fairly large group of console owners who have played just a few games in total (it's the same for PC gaming).

Of course all of that is true for a single Xbox user.
512GB will be really challenging for families with 3+ people using the console (unless they like the same games...).

Also, keep in mind most people moved from a >=1TB HDD to 256-512GB SSD during the last few years.
They have already accepted the compromise, so this shouldn't be a huge shock. And they're used to external USB drives.

 

[Aikouka]

In regard to the storage talk, there was a leak from IGN that the Series X's 1TB would lead to having 802GB of usable space. That usable space is with the operating system, any pre-installed apps, and presumably fast resume cache taking up space. (Keep in mind that 1TB = 931TiB; TiB/Tebibyte being the Base-2 capacity term and TB/Terabyte being the Base-10 capacity term.) So, if we consider the Series S only has a 500GB SSD, it should have 465GiB after conversion, and considering the same loss of ~130GiB, it will have 335GiB available. Although, it should be noted that the Series S may have a smaller amount reserved than the Series X. So, I would consider 335GiB to be a worst case scenario.

Although, there have also been plenty of videos around the web recently about performance in backwards compatible games on external drives. Honestly, if you don't want to pay the premium for the Series-compatible 1TB drive, an external SSD is a very, very comparable storage medium. Digital Foundry found that the difference between the 1TB Series-compatible drive and an external SATA SSD and an external NVMe SSD was usually just a couple of seconds at worst. Although, they did also stress to not cheap out on your external USB adapter as they saw a difference of up to +12 seconds when using a cheaper SATA-to-USB3 adapter in... I think it was Borderlands 3 loading.

Honestly, the only downside to using an external SSD is that you can't play Series-specific or Series-enhanced titles off of it. If you're okay with segmenting your games to specific storage areas, it isn't a bad option. I only went with the Series-specific drive because I got a modest discount at Target (brought it down to ~$175), which made it much closer in price to an external SSD setup.

Yeah, I get that worry. If you watch the second video you see Auto HDR does mostly a good job picking the correct highlighted areas (personally I think Yakuza with all its neon light was supposed to be this bright). Where it did wrong were the whites of the eyes in Banjo, and it's widely rumored it may clash with plenty of the in-game OSDs and menus. As it uses machine learning I expect it to improve further so I'm not too concerned right now. For me the excitement of getting HDR in all the games that didn't have it before (Panzer Dragoon!) prevails for now. ^^

I'll definitely check the feature out as it could be interesting. ArsTechnica talked about it in their preview, and they were generally positive. Although, in their case, they noticed an omission by the AI system where it didn't pick up a car's taillights. I'm sure these things can be ironed out over time, so it'll only improve.

However, one thing that I'd like to see is for Microsoft to consider providing more game-specific feature toggles. In other words, let me turn Auto-HDR on by default, but if I see that it doesn't work well in a specific game, I can go into that game's settings/details/options and turn off Auto-HDR. Frankly, there may be some other options that this works for as well given peculiarities that can arise with backwards compatibility.

 

[piokos]

So, if we consider the Series S only has a 500GB SSD, it should have 465GiB after conversion, and considering the same loss of ~130GiB, it will have 335GiB available.
Although, it should be noted that the Series S may have a smaller amount reserved than the Series X. So, I would consider 335GiB to be a worst case scenario.

The default buffer should be 10/16 of that on X (if set to hold the same number of states). I don't know if we'll be able to modify that (I sure hope yes - I play 2 games, so I don't need a buffer for 5...).

I don't get the point of converting to GiB.

Honestly, if you don't want to pay the premium for the Series-compatible 1TB drive, an external SSD is a very, very comparable storage medium. Digital Foundry found that the difference between the 1TB Series-compatible drive and an external SATA SSD and an external NVMe SSD was usually just a couple of seconds at worst.

As I said earlier: an external SSD will do 500MB/s, internal one does 2400MB/s.
There's always some processing after loading data from the drive which makes this difference even smaller.

You need the official 1TB expansion to enable all the Xbox Velocity features (and some games will require it). For loading times alone a cheap SSD will be enough to make this really pleasant to use.
For someone used to the internal HDD in Xbox One, external SSD will be a revelation already.

Of course if someone cares about esthetics, an external drive hanging from the console won't exactly add to living room design.
I'm in that group, but my Series S will be hidden in a shelf under the TV and there are USB ports on the back. So I'm covered.

 

[Aikouka]

I don't get the point of converting to GiB.

Because we actually represent our file sizes in Base-2 (GiB) not Base-10 (GB) (e.g. 1024KiB = 1MiB, not 1000KB = 1MB). In the past, there has been clamor and lawsuits over misrepresentation in hard drive sizes; it's the same thing.

You need the official 1TB expansion to enable all the Xbox Velocity features (and some games will require it).

Only Series-specific games and games that have received Series-optimization patches will require Series-specific storage. Microsoft has stated that older games will not benefit from features like DirectStorage.

Of course if someone cares about esthetics, an external drive hanging from the console won't exactly add to living room design.
I'm in that group, but my Series S will be hidden in a shelf under the TV and there are USB ports on the back. So I'm covered.

I guess that's one good thing about the 6x6x12 dimensions of the Series X. You could easily tape an external SSD to the back of the console as it has a big, bare spot on the back.

 

[piokos]

Because we actually represent our file sizes in Base-2 (GiB) not Base-10 (GB) (e.g. 1024KiB = 1MiB, not 1000KB = 1MB). In the past, there has been clamor and lawsuits over misrepresentation in hard drive sizes; it's the same thing.

No. We represent file size in any unit we want. It's just important to keep this coherent and not get lost in comparisons and calculations.

Converting everything to MiB and GiB is just pointless. It's like if you started correcting everyone for using imperial units. How weird would that be? *

Only Series-specific games and games that have received Series-optimization patches will require Series-specific storage. Microsoft has stated that older games will not benefit from features like DirectStorage.

Sure. But over the time, you'll get more and more Series-optimized games. So a generic external drive bought now will be great, but may feel more and more limiting over time.

I will use a Series S with external SSD, but this shouldn't matter. I don't buy latest games (way too expensive) - mostly relying on Game Pass and older (discounted) titles. So I'm pretty much in the exact target group of Series S.

I guess that's one good thing about the 6x6x12 dimensions of the Series X.

*) 151x151x103 mm

You could easily tape an external SSD to the back of the console as it has a big, bare spot on the back.

I'm not sure "taping to the back" is something I'd call "esthetic". Maybe more esthetic than just a USB drive case lying around.

Like most modern appliances, Xbox is designed to look well from all sides. Back panel is also stylized - it's not a bare plate of metal (like in some PC cases) or a random mess of vents and ports (like earlier consoles).
For that reason I'm sure some people will decide to pay a little bit more for the expansion card.

Heck, I may not care about the cable mess behind the console (since it's in a covered shelf under the TV - very old school).
But when it comes to the TV itself, I actually chose a more expensive model out of 2 options, because it had a nicer back panel and stand (everything else being ~equal).

 

[Aikouka]

No. We represent file size in any unit we want. It's just important to keep this coherent and not get lost in comparisons and calculations.

Converting everything to MiB and GiB is just pointless. It's like if you started correcting everyone for using imperial units. How weird would that be?

Given that the large majority of users are on Windows and Linux, which (mostly) use Base-2 sizing (i.e. 1024 vs 1000) with the incorrect SI prefixes (more on those here), yes, it makes sense to point out the difference to people when a drive is explicitly marketed in Base-10 sizing. A consumer should understand exactly what they're getting when you tell them that a game is x size (in Base-2) and they know their Xbox can hold y size (in Base-10).

On the flip side, if you're a Mac user, they use Base-10 like a bunch of weirdos... "Think Different" I guess.

I'm not sure "taping to the back" is something I'd call "esthetic". Maybe more esthetic than just a USB drive case lying around.

It works because you can't see it.