YACT: Problems starting, probably alternator?

[Kenazo]

1997 Saturn SL1. I replaced the battery 4 months ago, and the starter a week ago. Now I went to start it and all I get is click click click staccato sound (sounds like a dead battery). Let it sit, try again, try again, boom it starts. Anyways, I do this a few times but then it doesn't seem to work so I hook up one of those battery pack boosters and start the car. Seems pretty obvious that it must be a power problem. My battery is new so it must be the alternator right?

But my question is if it is the alternator why can I still drive around once the car is started? I've driven around 300 miles in the last two days and it runs alright once it is going (had it stall once when I did a hard brake). Also, the battery light flickered a bit at first but now it doesn't come on at all?

 

[NutBucket]

Maybe there's some abnormal parasitic drain that has come up recently, hence your 300 miles of driving recharged the battery.

 

[Yax]

I had the same problem one time. I had the Alternator changed and my car had problems starting too. I took it to a mom and pop shop where they took a look at it. The place was a rip off. They tried to tell me it was the alternator, I said I just changed it. Then they said they'll look at it again. Later they said it was the belt. It was loose.

Maybe you check the belt. If its not tight enough, it wouldn't turn the alternator.

Well, back to my story, they fixed the car. I went by to pick it up. It wouldn't start still. This time, NO CLICK either. I asked them to look at it. They did, they called me up a day later and said it was my relay switch. They charged me to fix that too. When I was driving home, I noticed a broken fuse on the passenger side mat. When I got home, I opened up the fuse box, which was on the passenger side of my car. I noticed one of my fuses had been replaced. I pulled out the new one and put the broken one back in. When I tried to start the car, it wouldn't start. Same symptoms as before. I quickly checked the relay switch, it was my old one. Darn people ripped me off. Couldn't prove a thing though. That's why I said they were a rip off place.

Replacing the fuse would be cheap, instead they charged me $30 for the relay switch and $75 for what they called "research and diagnostic".

 

[Kenazo]

Hmm I'll have to check the fuses then...

I'm starting to think it may be a short or ground somewhere as I just tried my radio and it is all static?

 

[HiTek21]

Get a multi meter, See how much power your battery has when the car is running, it should read high 13's low 14's if the alternator is working. If its not the alternator use the multi meter to rule out possible power drains.

 

[Wolverine27]

NM.

 

[RobCom]

check the connections at the battery for proper tightness and clean any corrosion... also look for corrosion that could be somewhere in the wire under insulation... bend the wire before the terminals back and forth and listen for crackling. there is a better way to diagnose if you have a multimeter, you can look for resistance in the wires for the entire charging system; too much resistance, means not enough voltage... also you mentioned replacing the starter too, right? check those connections as well. even the bolts that mount the starter to the bell housing... they act as ground on some models.... rusty bolts or corrosion can play havok on electrical systems on cars... i see it every day

Good Luck,
Rob

 

[conjur]

Loose battery cable? Clean the battery posts, too.

 

[Kenazo]

Ok I put my multi-meter on and it reads 12.x when shut off and around the same when idling (wouldn't it make a difference if I revved up the car?). So that seems to indicate the alternator is shot...

But why no battery light? and why does it keep running once it is started? and why is my radio all static?

The battery is the side-mount screw in type, not a top post. I checked to make sure it was screwed in tight.

RobCom - How do I check the resistance in the charging system? I've got a nice multi-meter but I have no idea how to use it for anything beyond checking the voltage...

 

[RobCom]

12.86v with engine off is a good fresh battery. anything under 13.8 v with motor running with all accessories on denotes a bad alternator... If you revved it up and the voltage rose but then fell back at idle that denotes a weak alternator(still have to replace it!)

the battery light may not have come on because you didn't not allow the cars computer to do a self test.... most cars go through self tests without you even knowing it.. sometimes you have check engine light one day and the next day you don't... that one day something failed a test the next day for some reason the variable were within range and it passed. this differents model to model....

the engine keeps running because its running off the battery...thats very bad for the electrical system as some important items won't get there proper voltages... radio static? you got me on that one? memory reset? not enough voltage for power antenna?

All in all you need to have your charging system checked out. you most likely need a new alternator. if you are going to do the work yourself take the alternator off (pretty easy with a 97 saturn, 1.9L?) and take it to a local parts shopper (autozone, pepboys, advance auto) they will check your old alternator for free before they sell you one.

Take care...
Rob


<<Ok I put my multi-meter on and it reads 12.x when shut off and around the same when idling (wouldn't it make a difference if I revved up the car?). So that seems to indicate the alternator is shot...

But why no battery light? and why does it keep running once it is started? and why is my radio all static?

The battery is the side-mount screw in type, not a top post. I checked to make sure it was screwed in tight.

RobCom - How do I check the resistance in the charging system? I've got a nice multi-meter but I have no idea how to use it for anything beyond checking the voltage...
>>

 

[edfcmc]

It could be the starter switch a/k/a starter relay a/k/a starter solenoid. It may not have been changed when your starter was replaced.

The starter circuit is quite easy.

Battery ---->Starter solenoid (relay) ------>Starter (full juice side)

Battery ---->fuse link------>Acessory----->Ignition switch ------->Safety transmission gear switch (Netural switch)---->Starter Solenoid (Low juice side)


When you flick the ignition switch---it sends a low amp 12V to the starter relay which causes the starter relay to send 12V (high amp) to the starter.

THe click/click/click you are hearing is most likely the Starter Solenoid (they get stuck sometimes do to the heat).

 

[Kenazo]

The starter solenoid was changed with the new starter.

RobCom- Thanks for the advice, I will get my wife to rev up the engine and see what happens with the voltage. I'm guessing it is the alternator (looks like it's only $60 for a reman) so I'll change it out on the weekend...hopefully it won't be a curse job

I think it is probably weak or half functioning that's why I've been able to drive so far...I still can't figure out the radio static either, or why my battery light doesn't come on even when I can't start the car without a boost?

 

[Kenazo]

Ok, I had my wife rev up the engine to around 2000, the reading was 12.x volts when idling and then rose to ~13.8-14 when revved up. When it revved down it came down to the low 13's.

So does that mean weak alternator for sure?

 

[Ladies Man]

no

alternator would seem fine from that reading....

you probably have a slow drain somewhere

 

[Eli]

A bad alternator wouldn't cause the symptoms you describe.

A friend of mine had an 80s Camry that would do the same thing. It turns out there was a TSB out for it, and it was a known problem.

Look into it.

 

[RobCom]

honestly get it checked out... i can't give a definite answer unless i seen and diagnosed the car with my own eyes and tools... its most likely the alternator or a voltage regulator (which i beleive is either built in the alternator or part the the computer ECU)..

good luck,
Rob