Your thoughts on God

[ThinClient]

You claim no one can know God because there's no evidence he exists, so why continue to post in these threads?

Because people like you are wrong and so full of themselves that they get insensed when someone challenges their agenda. Debate is the ultimate test of intelligence and respect for one another, IMO. I respect you by bringing truth to your ears. You can accept it or you can reject it and continue to get every single one of your arguments destroyed every time you make the stupid claim that god is real or that the bible is the infallible word of god. It makes me feel good inside to know that someone, somewhere is reading these arguments and the more intelligent of them are going to walk away with an ever-decreasing view of god or gods.

Your petty attempt to get me to leave these threads is comical. Your personal attacks are relentless and do nothing more than bolster my efforts. Hell, YOU, personally, get destroyed in every one of these threads. Why do YOU keep coming back?

 

[ThinClient]

Just wanted to add my two cents... one cannot merely suggest that God is light because, at least in Christian sources (which is what it sounds like you're drawing from), evil can masquerade as an angel of light / a wolf in sheep's clothing. You can't judge based on appearances alone. I would also argue that if something explicitly says it was created by something else, then that must imply the two are distinct. When John said 'God is light', most commentators would suggest that he was using light as a metaphor for good in general to describe God's character: http://www.biblegateway.com/resources/commentaries/IVP-NT/1John/Character-God

Similarly, the idea that evil is simply darkness and does not exist, does not conform to at least Christianity's notion of evil... it's very much about ethics and morals, right and wrong, knowing people from their fruits (the results of their actions/behavior).

Do you really think it's holy to destroy innocent children in Sodom and Gomorah? Do you really think it's holy to bid a man take his son into the wilderness, make an alter, and sacrifice him to god? The bible is full of immoral, unethical atrocities demanded done by the christian god. Christians have absolutely no room to make moral or ethical claims.

None of that light/dark business is meaningful. Allegory and imagination are philosophy, not fact or rationale.

 

[ThinClient]

Moonbeam, you mentioned the words "love" and "experience". The fact that these sorts of things exist makes me a little suspicious about the nature of reality, even if they are considered by many to be only evolutionary byproducts. I feel inclined to take them at face value, despite my logical side telling me they are naturally occurring accidents and are not in any way fundamental. The problem is, they seem to be very fundamental and as a result of this I am conflicted and remain solidly agnostic.
I, for some reason, am unable to view the word as it is and make a judgment. Instead, I tend to view what the world and the rest of the universe may be like in a mature stage, then make a judgment based on what I see.
What I see is something of unspeakable beauty and goodness. I see a staggeringly vast network of intelligent, mature, kind and caring civilizations that span the full stretch of the cosmos. A true masterpiece of creation far greater than anyone could suspect being possible, especially when using the current state of the world as an indicator. But I see the hallmarks of greatness hidden beneath the suffering that we endure, slowly springing forth, determined and unrelenting like a flower sprouting up through the soil, seeking out the life giving sunlight.
When I view what I think may come about, I tend to view the universe as a fixed art piece, like a painting or a sculpture and it is beautiful. But it comes about through a process, and this process involves suffering. Perhaps in order for our descendants to truly appreciate what life is like for them, they have to know and understand where they came from.
When I consider what the universe may be like at maturity, and things like experience and love, it makes it ever harder for me to disregard the possibility that we are in the early stages of something beautiful, artistic and of course, intentional.

Delusion right here, folks. There are people who see the universe exactly the opposite way that you do. What makes you right and them wrong? The same thing that makes you wrong and them right: subjective perception.

Your imagination is running away down the rabbit hole and your brain is convinced of things that are nothing more than figments of your imagination.

 

[Retro Rob]

Because people like you are wrong and so full of themselves that they get insensed when someone challenges their agenda. Debate is the ultimate test of intelligence and respect for one another, IMO. I respect you by bringing truth to your ears.

You're begging the question: If there's no evidence either way, how can you be so sure I am wrong?

You cannot claim someone is wrong unless you can prove it, so where's your evidence?

Your petty attempt to get me to leave these threads is comical. Your personal attacks are relentless and do nothing more than bolster my efforts. Hell, YOU, personally, get destroyed in every one of these threads. Why do YOU keep coming back?

No, I want you to see how silly you sound arguing with people who believe in the equivalent of Unicorns and vampires about how wrong they are.

Does that sound silly to you? How many people publicly debate and write books disagreeing with the supposed existence of Dracula?

People like yourself equate belief in God with fictional characters...so I am just turning the tables to point out how silly you sound arguing against them.

 

[JD50]

You're begging the question: If there's no evidence either way, how can you be so sure I am wrong?

You cannot claim someone is wrong unless you can prove it, so where's your evidence?




No, I want you to see how silly you sound arguing with people who believe in the equivalent of Unicorns and vampires about how wrong they are.

Does that sound silly to you? How many people publicly debate and write books disagreeing with the supposed existence of Dracula?

People like yourself equate belief in God with fictional characters...so I am just turning the tables to point out how silly you sound arguing against them.

Once again, Rob has amnesia. This has been explained to you countless times, and here you are pretending like you don't understand it, again.

 

[ThinClient]

You're begging the question: If there's no evidence either way, how can you be so sure I am wrong?

You cannot claim someone is wrong unless you can prove it, so where's your evidence?

Here we go, around in circles, arguing the same stupid arguments that you argued before.

These are frustratingly ignorant questions that you're asking. You KNOW the answer to them because you have been part of many threads where you've asked the same questions and these questions have been destroyed, too.

I'll do it again, though, since you can't get the answer through your thick skull.

1) You can't prove a negative. Stop charging others with proving that god doesn't exist. You cannot prove that something doesn't exist.

2) You don't seem to understand the concept of a positive claim. A positive claim is "[something] exists." The burden of proof rests on the shoulders of those making the positive claim. If you're claiming that god exists, it's not my responsibility to prove you wrong. It's your responsibility to prove that what you are claiming is correct. Another way of stating this is that the burden is on YOU to prove that you are not a liar.

No one in the history of the world has ever been able to prove that any god or gods exist.

I'll patiently wait for you to provide the evidence that you have seen that leads you to the conclusion that god is real, though. When you post whatever drivel you're going to post (or not post and simply change the subject or ignore the challenge, as your posting history proves), I will be quick to break down whatever arguments you bring to the table (because we've all heard the arguments you use and all of them are vapid).

3) I can claim all day that someone is wrong if they make a positive claim without backing it up. The same goes for anyone claiming that vampires are real, that fairies are real, that trolls living under the bridge are real, that Santa Claus is real, that the Tooth Fairy is real, that the Flying Spaghetti Monster is real, the list goes on and on.

No, I want you to see how silly you sound arguing with people who believe in the equivalent of Unicorns and vampires about how wrong they are.

Does that sound silly to you? How many people publicly debate and write books disagreeing with the supposed existence of Dracula?

People like yourself equate belief in God with fictional characters...so I am just turning the tables to point out how silly you sound arguing against them.

The argument that god is real is just as stupid and silly as the argument that fairies are real.

Again, you are just as atheistic as I am about 99% of the gods out there. I simply take the notion one step further but your brain EXPLODES because it doesn't want to stop believing in something in which there is no evidence to support.

If you want to bring these childish arguments to the table, you could at least do the rest of us a favor and read the thread again since these arguments have already been completely dismantled in this thread and in dozens of threads prior just like this in which you have participated, bringing up the same boring tired false arguments.

 

[serpretetsky]

Delusion right here, folks. There are people who see the universe exactly the opposite way that you do. What makes you right and them wrong? The same thing that makes you wrong and them right: subjective perception.

Your imagination is running away down the rabbit hole and your brain is convinced of things that are nothing more than figments of your imagination.

... I am conflicted and remain solidly agnostic.

I don't think he said that he's right and everyone else is wrong. Also I think his post is pretty elegant.

You say delusion. I say hope. Sometimes we can all use a little bit of that.

 

[ThinClient]

I don't think he said that he's right and everyone else is wrong. Also I think his post is pretty elegant.

You say delusion. I say hope. Sometimes we can all use a little bit of that.

Hope in something that will never come to pass is intellectually dishonest -especially when the person is attempting to brainwash the rest of his species with the same false hope. It is a wicked and immoral gesture.

Dawkins talks about this using the analogy that the universe owes them something, like peace of mind. Well, it doesn't. If you're still clinging to childish things like religion and "hope" in something that has no evidence will ever or has ever come to pass, then you're setting yourself up for disappointment and you're setting up the next person for disappointment by spreading the lie of that false hope.

The universe is cold, heartless, and unforgiving. Screw your balls on and stop crying in the dark when you go to bed, using "god" as a crutch to help you feel better. You are doing yourself a vast disservice and you are helping to spread that same disservice to the rest of us by perpetuating the lie that is religion.

 

[Retro Rob]

Again, you are just as atheistic as I am about 99% of the gods out there. I simply take the notion one step further but your brain EXPLODES because it doesn't want to stop believing in something in which there is no evidence to support.

Lol -- I don't reject other gods. I am not sure if they exists, nor do I care much, and I don't reject the idea/existence of a higher being (no matter "how" that being is designated by said culture), so I am nowhere near atheistic.

That must be that "word salad" you're employing.

If you want to bring these childish arguments to the table, you could at least do the rest of us a favor and read the thread again since these arguments have already been completely dismantled in this thread and in dozens of threads prior just like this in which you have participated, bringing up the same boring tired false arguments.

Well, stop arguing about the non-existence of a god, then. Do you get into heated debates about how not-real Dracula is?

But no, seriously, its just becomes pointless, honestly. No one's gonna change their minds.

 

[ThinClient]

Lol -- I don't reject other gods. I am not sure if they exists, nor do I care much, and I don't reject the idea/existence of a higher being (no matter "how" that being is designated by said culture), so I am nowhere near atheistic.

That must be that "word salad" you're employing.



Well, stop arguing about the non-existence of a god, then. Do you get into heated debates about how not-real Dracula is?

But no, seriously, its just becomes pointless, honestly. No one's gonna change their minds.

I would just as easily get into a debate about the existence of Dracula, but nobody is stupid enough to make the claim to argue against.

I'm sure you'll be back in a few hours to make the same stupid arguments you made above so we can make the same child-level replies to destroy your arguments.

You're not going to change your mind in the face of absolute destruction of your arguments over and over and over?

You're not willing to learn. You're not willing to accept. Your arguments are born out of close-minded bigotry. You're more than welcome to what many would describe as willful ignorance (others would call it stupidity) as long as you keep it to yourself and you stop acting like your arguments haven't been dismantled at every level at every turn.

I don't understand why you're willing to be so irrational and illogical. It's like you're too prideful to accept facts because you don't like the people presenting them and you don't like the people presenting them because those facts paint your belief as entirely foolish.

 

[ThinClient]

Lol -- I don't reject other gods. I am not sure if they exists, nor do I care much, and I don't reject the idea/existence of a higher being (no matter "how" that being is designated by said culture), so I am nowhere near atheistic.

If you aren't sure, then why do you follow the one you follow? How do you know that you're not wrong? How do you know that you're right? Why do you defend your belief like everyone else is wrong, yet you admit that you don't even know if you're right?

 

[Retro Rob]

If you aren't sure, then why do you follow the one you follow?

Not sure about what? Secondly, I believe the Bible is a prophetic book and no man can make accurate predictions about the future. It's also historical.

Sure, I've heard almost every argument AGAINST already fulfilled prophecy, but no real evidence to substantiate those claims...it's normally conjecture among the scholars, and they criticize each other's work, so they really have no leg to stand on.

Sure, I can deny almost *anything* as being fabricated and made up, but with no evidence, its all talk.

Keep talking.

How do you know that you're not wrong? How do you know that you're right? Why do you defend your belief like everyone else is wrong, yet you admit that you don't even know if you're right?

How do you know YOU'RE not wrong? I have my own reasons why I believe:

There is compelling evidence of a Creator. The word "simple" can be misleading as regards our beginnings...there isn't anything simple about an atom, for instance, that is almost empty space made up of protons and neutrons surrounded by one or more electron shells, yet is unimaginably stable.

Yep, I draw a logical conclusion that orderly precision is totally guided, reflects supreme knowledge, and purpose.

That's just one piece of evidence for me, and the more science learns about things like this, the more I see we had to have been designed by someone with much more power and ability than we posses.

 

[ThinClient]

I have invited you at ever turn to prove me wrong. I am open to the idea of being wrong. In fact, I scrutinize every piece of incoming "evidence" to make sure that my conclusion doesn't need to change and I change that conclusion if it does.

You, on the other hand, have you fingers in your ears and your eyes closed and are going LA LA LA LA LA LA I WILL BELIEVE WHATEVER CRAZY IRRATIONAL ILLOGICAL FALSE CLAIM I WANT TO BELIEVE AND YOU CANNOT CHANGE MY MIND LA LA LA LA LAAAAAA

 

[Retro Rob]

I have invited you at ever turn to prove me wrong. I am open to the idea of being wrong. In fact, I scrutinize every piece of incoming "evidence" to make sure that my conclusion doesn't need to change and I change that conclusion if it does.

You, on the other hand, have you fingers in your ears and your eyes closed and are going LA LA LA LA LA LA I WILL BELIEVE WHATEVER CRAZY IRRATIONAL ILLOGICAL FALSE CLAIM I WANT TO BELIEVE AND YOU CANNOT CHANGE MY MIND LA LA LA LA LAAAAAA

I don't think I can "prove you wrong", and I simply don't want to. Obviously, you've long made your mind up, and you stated earlier about how people like Dawkins pulled you away from religion...so you're actually not open to being "wrong" because you don't for a second think you are "wrong".

That much is obvious...so don't make this out to be something along the lines that you're completely open to being wrong, because you're not.

Its safe and easy to play the "default" position because you don't have to answer any tough questions....you can simply reject any and all evidence and not have to provide anything.

It's a smart position, btw.

 

[serpretetsky]

Hope in something that will never come to pass is intellectually dishonest -especially when the person is attempting to brainwash the rest of his species with the same false hope. It is a wicked and immoral gesture.

Dawkins talks about this using the analogy that the universe owes them something, like peace of mind. Well, it doesn't. If you're still clinging to childish things like religion and "hope" in something that has no evidence will ever or has ever come to pass, then you're setting yourself up for disappointment and you're setting up the next person for disappointment by spreading the lie of that false hope.

The universe is cold, heartless, and unforgiving. Screw your balls on and stop crying in the dark when you go to bed, using "god" as a crutch to help you feel better. You are doing yourself a vast disservice and you are helping to spread that same disservice to the rest of us by perpetuating the lie that is religion.

Hope in something that will never come to pass is the greatest of all hopes. The greatest people on earth have pushed for things that others thought were impossible at the time. To say the heroes of the world didn't hope for what they achieved is incorrect. They had fantastic dreams, and they hoped they would come true.

But you are right, there are many that have hopes and dreams that never happen. I would argue that that is true strength; Hoping for something marvelous, and seemingly impossible, when you know there is a chance that you will fail, but believing in it none the less, and trying to bring it to reality.

In regard to moonbogg's post, what exactly are you disagreeing with?

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

Not sure about what? Secondly, I believe the Bible is a prophetic book and no man can make accurate predictions about the future. It's also historical.

Sure, I've heard almost every argument AGAINST already fulfilled prophecy, but no real evidence to substantiate those claims...it's normally conjecture among the scholars, and they criticize each other's work, so they really have no leg to stand on.

Sure, I can deny almost *anything* as being fabricated and made up, but with no evidence, its all talk.

Keep talking.

Would you be interested in participating in a spin-off thread discussing alleged prophecies and critically examining their merit? I'll start the thread but I'd need someone to submit at least a few such prophecies for analysis.

 

[JD50]

Well, stop arguing about the non-existence of a god, then. Do you get into heated debates about how not-real Dracula is?

But no, seriously, its just becomes pointless, honestly. No one's gonna change their minds.

Once again, Rob has amnesia. This has been explained to you countless times, and here you are pretending like you don't understand it, again.

And again

Edit - BTW, plenty of people change their mind.

 

[Retro Rob]

Would you be interested in participating in a spin-off thread discussing alleged prophecies and critically examining their merit? I'll start the thread but I'd need someone to submit at least a few such prophecies for analysis.

No I wouldn't be, nor would I participate.

 

[alzan]

Not sure about what? Secondly, I believe the Bible is a prophetic book and no man can make accurate predictions about the future. [/B]It's also historical.[/B]

Many fiction books contain a few historical references, usually to give the reader(s) reference points, but they aren't considered historical in the same way non-fiction books are written.

Sure, I've heard almost every argument AGAINST already fulfilled prophecy, but no real evidence to substantiate those claims...it's normally conjecture among the scholars, and they criticize each other's work, so they really have no leg to stand on.

Sure, I can deny almost *anything* as being fabricated and made up, but with no evidence, its all talk.

Keep talking.




How do you know YOU'RE not wrong? I have my own reasons why I believe:

There is compelling evidence of a Creator. The word "simple" can be misleading as regards our beginnings...there isn't anything simple about an atom, for instance, that is almost empty space made up of protons and neutrons surrounded by one or more electron shells, yet is unimaginably stable.

Then please present your evidence. Saying that scientific theories are incorrect or incomplete is not evidence that your Creator exists. Neither is looking at one aspect, stable atoms, and saying that they are too complex to have happened by chance.

Yep, I draw a logical conclusion that orderly precision is totally guided, reflects supreme knowledge, and purpose.

If you knew more about the earth/universe you'd realize just how chaotic it is.

That's just one piece of evidence for me, and the more science learns about things like this, the more I see we had to have been designed by someone with much more power and ability than we posses.

Again, present evidence of this "someone".

 

[Moonbeam]

Hope in something that will never come to pass is the greatest of all hopes. The greatest people on earth have pushed for things that others thought were impossible at the time. To say the heroes of the world didn't hope for what they achieved is incorrect. They had fantastic dreams, and they hoped they would come true.

But you are right, there are many that have hopes and dreams that never happen. I would argue that that is true strength; Hoping for something marvelous, and seemingly impossible, when you know there is a chance that you will fail, but believing in it none the less, and trying to bring it to reality.

In regard to moonbogg's post, what exactly are you disagreeing with?

I was going to answer moonbogg's post with the comment that I enjoy a good cup of soup and on a good day, washing the bowl and putting it away but I thought he might think I was being insulting by suggesting the mundane. I didn't want him to think I might be suggesting his dreams were too large and silly rather than that I see a different truth in very little things. In a grain of sand the universe is contained, means to me that the meaning of life is in being. I love souls full of hope who ache for something better, for a way to end suffering and separation. Your post made me think of this song I love to hear especially by Roy Orbison:

1.
Beautiful dreamer, wake unto me,
Starlight and dewdrops are waiting for thee;
Sounds of the rude world, heard in the day,
Lull'd by the moonlight have all pass'd away!
Beautiful dreamer, queen of my song,
List while I woo thee with soft melody;
Gone are the cares of life's busy throng,
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!

2.
Beautiful dreamer, out on the sea,
Mermaids are chanting the wild lorelei;
Over the streamlet vapors are borne,
Waiting to fade at the bright coming morn.
Beautiful dreamer, beam on my heart,
E'en as the morn on the streamlet and sea;
Then will all clouds of sorrow depart,
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!

So for the sake of hope and dreaming let me tell you a story:

Once there was a young man who dreamed the world was good and set about to prove it to humanity. And this young man thought and read and thought. And the more he thought and read and thought the more he came to realize that the universe was cold and empty and the more that realization grew the more he suffered. He fought a long and bitter battle with the Nothing and the Nothing won. All hope died and the world turned black and that young man knew he would suffer hopelessness to his grave. There was no exit anywhere and he knew it.

But that young man chanced upon a story written by somebody who saw as he does but with a funny twist, somebody who seemed to have found a door out of emptiness. It was the story of a man hanging from roots on a cliff with arms weakening, a tiger above and one below. The young man realized right away that this was him. But in the story within this story the man hanging there with strength waning found a strawberry growing next to where he clung, and he picked it and it tasted so good. Can you imagine such a story. I know it filled our young man with rage. What strawberry is there in this hopeless universe.

Well one night our young man got his answer when again in deepest despair, thinking about why he suffers a blast of wind hit his house and his thinking stopped and to this day he's never suffered again. In a fraction of an instant there came a realization that the need for meaning is as meaningless as everything else.

When hopeless takes every think that can be taken, when all your hopes are truly dead you are left only with what is real, the taste of the most incredible strawberry, the organic joy of being. I know because this is my story.

I believe that God is that Joy of Being and I know that He is real.

So the bottom line from me to you is do not worry. Hope and hopelessness all lead to the same place. If you go straight ahead in either direction you will be OK.

 

[sandorski]

No I wouldn't be, nor would I participate.

lol

 

[serpretetsky]

I was going to answer moonbogg's post with the comment that I enjoy a good cup of soup and on a good day, washing the bowl and putting it away but I thought he might think I was being insulting by suggesting the mundane. I didn't want him to think I might be suggesting his dreams were too large and silly rather than that I see a different truth in very little things. In a grain of sand the universe is contained, means to me that the meaning of life is in being. I love souls full of hope who ache for something better, for a way to end suffering and separation. Your post made me think of this song I love to hear especially by Roy Orbison:

1.
Beautiful dreamer, wake unto me,
Starlight and dewdrops are waiting for thee;
Sounds of the rude world, heard in the day,
Lull'd by the moonlight have all pass'd away!
Beautiful dreamer, queen of my song,
List while I woo thee with soft melody;
Gone are the cares of life's busy throng,
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!

2.
Beautiful dreamer, out on the sea,
Mermaids are chanting the wild lorelei;
Over the streamlet vapors are borne,
Waiting to fade at the bright coming morn.
Beautiful dreamer, beam on my heart,
E'en as the morn on the streamlet and sea;
Then will all clouds of sorrow depart,
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!

So for the sake of hope and dreaming let me tell you a story:

Once there was a young man who dreamed the world was good and set about to prove it to humanity. And this young man thought and read and thought. And the more he thought and read and thought the more he came to realize that the universe was cold and empty and the more that realization grew the more he suffered. He fought a long and bitter battle with the Nothing and the Nothing won. All hope died and the world turned black and that young man knew he would suffer hopelessness to his grave. There was no exit anywhere and he knew it.

But that young man chanced upon a story written by somebody who saw as he does but with a funny twist, somebody who seemed to have found a door out of emptiness. It was the story of a man hanging from roots on a cliff with arms weakening, a tiger above and one below. The young man realized right away that this was him. But in the story within this story the man hanging there with strength waning found a strawberry growing next to where he clung, and he picked it and it tasted so good. Can you imagine such a story. I know it filled our young man with rage. What strawberry is there in this hopeless universe.

Well one night our young man got his answer when again in deepest despair, thinking about why he suffers a blast of wind hit his house and his thinking stopped and to this day he's never suffered again. In a fraction of an instant there came a realization that the need for meaning is as meaningless as everything else.

When hopeless takes every think that can be taken, when all your hopes are truly dead you are left only with what is real, the taste of the most incredible strawberry, the organic joy of being. I know because this is my story.

I believe that God is that Joy of Being and I know that He is real.

So the bottom line from me to you is do not worry. Hope and hopelessness all lead to the same place. If you go straight ahead in either direction you will be OK.

thumbs up to everything you just wrote.

I grew up with "mild" orthodox Christian parents. We went to church like once a year, and we had icons hanging around our house. I believed there was a god.

At some point in middle school I began to get scientifically very curious. And at some point I had an epiphany that everything in the universe is probably cold, hard, mechanical. I took this a step further; what if it isn't cold, hard, and machinical, what if there really is a god, what difference does it make. If I die I goto heaven or hell where I am in nirvana or constant suffering? Thats what this world is about? My pathetic human contentness in the afterlife? It seemed dull and unimportant in some "greater scheme" of things. Somehow I had imagine things "above" god, I still don't really understand how this is possible.

Now, even in the presence of god, I found little meaning in things. This was my period of complete nihilism. nothing mattered. Every human emotion and action had no importance, after all, we're either all in giant soup of random math equations or there is some "god" that arbitrarily judges based on some arbitrary scales that have no meaning to me. I believe this period is very important in people's lives, they must break down EVERYTHING they believe in, so that they may rebuild from the beginning.

This continued until after high school, where at some point I began to realize, that despite all of this meaninglessness, I was still alive, I was still happy and sad, people around me interacted with me and I could help them be happy or sad. Things inherently have meaning TO ME in the universe, even though the universe may or may not have some greater purpose.

I would go off on a rant about my use of the word "ME" but that's another story.

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

Lol -- I don't reject other gods.

If you don't reject other gods, then atheists don't reject your god.

Well, stop arguing about the non-existence of a god, then. Do you get into heated debates about how not-real Dracula is?

Is there a significant subset of the population insistent that Dracula is real, and has particular instructions about how everyone is supposed to behave, and influences that subset's ideas about socio-political policy?

 

[ThinClient]

And again

Edit - BTW, plenty of people change their mind.

Yep. I'm one of them.

 

[ThinClient]

Things inherently have meaning TO ME in the universe, even though the universe may or may not have some greater purpose.

The Son of Sam truly thought that he was hearing voices from a dog that was commanding him to kill people.

Just because you believe it doesn't make it true. In fact, in honor of Rob M., I'll give another Richard Dawkins quote.

"No amount of belief can make a belief into a fact."

The whole "it's true to me" is a joke, too.