Zacarias Moussaoui Verdict

[LtPage1]

I know, let's teach people that killing is wrong by killing them.

Seriously though, all common sense aside, let's not make a martyr out of this guy. Let him rot.

 

[Slick50]

Live or Die.

Just follow my instructions after. Burry the body wrapped in Pork. They wont go to heaven and get their virgins that way. Repeat procedure to all terrorists or fanatic muslims.

 

[CessnaFlyer]

I want him to die, so he can meet Muhammed in Hell!

 

[ViciouS]

Originally posted by: Slick50
Live or Die.

Just follow my instructions after. Burry the body wrapped in Pork. They wont go to heaven and get their virgins that way. Repeat procedure to all terrorists or fanatic muslims.

What about death by pig? Let a pig eat his naked body while people take pictures. "Beware of the pig farmer." (Snatch)

Is becoming pig crap the same as or worse than being rapped in pork after death?

 

[dwell]

Let him live and be the virgin for 72 inmates in America's fine correctional system for the rest of his life.

 

[ViciouS]

GOOD JOB JURY

 

[johnnobts]

he deserves solitary for life, its a living hell. just like timothy mcveigh should have gotten... i don't have a problem with the death penalty, just think there are worse fates than a quick death. moussaoui deserves a gruesome fate. i would have sent him to angola in gen pop, though, make him somebody's sissy.

if the jury came to this decision b/c they thought he was just a 9-11 wannabe, then i'd be upset with the jury. this man could have prevented 911.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie

Originally posted by: ntdz

What in gods name are you talking about? The state makes the laws, they can make whatever laws they want.

No, they can't.

I can't kill him individually because he wouldn't have been convicted of anything. A jury/judge has the rule of law behind them saying capital punishment is an acceptable form of punishment, and thats all they need to make it legal and give them the right to exercise it.

Something being legal and being a 'right' are not the same thing. It is in fact perfectly possible to pass laws that are unethical. In this case, what gives government the authority to say 'we're allowd to kill people'?

The defendant gets every right to appeal and it usually takes 20+ years before they are executed. That's the difference between the legal way and me just taking a gun and shooting him. Are you even thinking through your argument?

But they can only appeal based on a law with no source of moral authority behind it. The state doesn't own you, and making a law doesn't change that. There is one obvious case where you do have the right to kill somone, or at least to take actions that may kill someone, and I'll get to that in the next bit of your post. It doesn't apply to executions.

Killing someone isn't even illegal, per se. What's illegal is murder, or the unlawful killing of someone else. You can kill someone in self defense, which is lawful. The law also allows for someone to be executed if they are found to be guilty of a haineous crime, which Moussaoui clearly is. The fact that you disagree with the death penalty doesn't mean it's wrong or it's hypocritical on anyone's part to support it.

Killing someone in self-defense is preventing them from violating your personal safety. This does not apply to the death penalty.

There are two conditions for the death penalty; either killing is alright, in which case 'laws' and 'convictions' are superfluous because we should all be allowed to kill anyone at any time, or the death penalty is a way to act out vengeance and bloodlust while maintaining the appearance of legitimacy.

Until you have some reasonable explanation for what gives the state the moral authority to extract revenge, you can only shoose between the above alternatives.

Governments have the right and authority to have a death penalty if they wish, you're the first person I've ever heard deny this. Just because it's not "morally right" to you doesn't mean it isn't to me, or most of the population of the USA. Just end your argument, you can never win it. We just have different opinions, don't try to act like you're morally superior.

Where do you get the notion that governments have a right and authority to have a death penalty? They have no such right as such a right is immoral. What they have is the power and the citizenry still in a sufficient state of barbarity to authorize such so called legal murder. It is wrong to kill. It is evil to kill. We kill murderers with the exact same moral justification as they have when they murder their victim, that the victim deserves to die. We kill the murderer because we hate who we are, had our aggressive side beaten deep within us as children, to express itself via rationalizations like, he stole my wife, or he killed a bunch of people. Morality, real morality, is not self justification. You are a subjectivist who denies the reality of absolute moral law. Because you have no idea what you feel, the suppressed self hate that's within you, your hate leaks our all over the place whenever you feel self justified. We are the killers we kill, hiding behind unjust law. It is wrong to kill another human being unless it is your only self defense.

Governments have the right to do whatever they want, as long as it's sanctioned by the people, PERIOD. Morality is a subjective thing, you can't tell me the death penalty is wrong just because you think it's immoral.

A fool convinced against his will is of the same opinion still. Of course I can tell you nothing. You would not be a fool if that were not so. But just as you can't be told anything, I can't be stopped from talking into your vacuum if it pleases me.

And your ignorance is quite profound as you live in a country founded on the notion that everything you claim is the exact opposite of what is true. Remember "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the
pursuit of Happiness. My goodness, unalienable rights! Whatever could those be? Certainly nothing to do with your stupid belief that morality is subjective and nothing to do with what the Founding Fathers, like myself believe, that truth and morality are absolute and inalienable. It is wrong to murder and that is all there is to it. Murdering a murderer is noting more than revenge is this day and age of professional prisons where we can lock people safely away.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: johnnobts
he deserves solitary for life, its a living hell. just like timothy mcveigh should have gotten... i don't have a problem with the death penalty, just think there are worse fates than a quick death. moussaoui deserves a gruesome fate. i would have sent him to angola in gen pop, though, make him somebody's sissy.

if the jury came to this decision b/c they thought he was just a 9-11 wannabe, then i'd be upset with the jury. this man could have prevented 911.

Damn, and you think you are a Christian?

 

[colonel]

Live, I think we can find out more about these terrorists if he is alive.

 

[Balt]

I'm glad he'll rot for the rest of his life. He wanted to make a grand exit and he loves an audience. Now he'll have neither.

 

[carage]

I wouldn't mind sending this guy to some sort of Abu Gharib-ish prison (aka Muslim Hell), assuming he can actually provide any more useful information.
However, if the government just keeps him in a small cell for the rest of his life is still a waste of taxpayers' money.
If this idiot's really not afraid of death, perhaps he should try suicide in prison.
Burning the body with lard might be a good idea.
Burning him alive with lard might be an even better idea. (BBQ then served to prison dogs)
It might sound barbaric, but what else can you do to an idiot who thinks he is willing to die for a cause?
I think that sounds right for a terrorist.

 

[carage]

Originally posted by: raildogg
If we put him away, he will go down as a hero, or a traitor in the Arab/muslim world. If he stays in jail, maybe someone or some group will do something crazy to free him. Or they may carry out attacks in his name.

The only solution is to let him go free.

Let him go free?!
So he can regroup with his buddies and figure out better ways to attack?
Or assume that his terrorist buddies will be suscipicious of him and decide to carry out their own sorts of punishment on him?

 

[ViciouS]

Originally posted by: raildogg
If we put him away, he will go down as a hero, or a traitor in the Arab/muslim world. If he stays in jail, maybe someone or some group will do something crazy to free him. Or they may carry out attacks in his name.

The only solution is to let him go free.

They should buy him a new car too! Maybe a house, and free dinner at RedLobster FOR EVER!

 

[tommywishbone]

He's clearly already insane, but after a few years in Supermax, he'll be totally completely insane. That man has a whole lot of pain in his future.

 

[imported_Tango]

I am always against death penalty. The more brutal is the crime, the harder it is to keep up with this moral oath.

Had he killed my sons, I would probably want him dead. But that's why victims' parents are not allowed to sit in the jury.

 

[BoomerD]

I have no problem with the death penalty in capital crimes, but for some reason, lI havemy doubts about Zacarias Moussaoui and his story. Personally, I kind of think he was either lying to make us think he was more than he really was, or that we were set-up to believe him, and the truth might come out after he was executed, putting us in a bad light. Why would he lie about such things? well, there are all manner of psycho's in the world, and ask any cop, they come out in droves to confess to all kinds of heinous crimes. IF the man is truely guilty, then life in prison is letting him off too easily, BUT, we do have laws against cruel and unusual punishment, and those are the only ways to kill him that would be appropriate. A nice quiet death by injection seems way too easy for someone involved with the deaths of over 3000 people...NO, I;m not a kook...well, maybe, but generally I don't buy most of the conspiracy theories...some. MAYBE, but most are too far out there...I just am not convinced that this guy is what he claims to be...

 

[WHAMPOM]

If we were a civilized country, we would not work hand in hand with the repressive regimes that created Moussaoui.

 

[Uhtrinity]

Moussaoui moves to withdraw guilty plea


This is right in line with what I believe and had previously posted here. The guy is obvisously nuts and / or an attention whore. He didn't get the attention getting death sentence and can't be martered, so he tries to change his plea. IMO he deserves what he got for being a total idiot, but still don't believe he had anything to do with 911.

 

[Genx87]

I guess he lied again, the US won and he lost.

 

[dmcowen674]

I'm sure that the U.S. will be releasing him at some point.

We're winning that War on Terror alright.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

I guess this isn't too surprising. What a wacko. I am personally glad he didn't get the death penalty, since he seems completely crazy, and I simply don't believe his claims about his involvement in 9/11, but I can't say I'm losing any sleep over his spending the rest of his life behind bars.

Honestly, I find the idea of spending the rest of your life in 23-hour lockdown almost too much to bear. What a nightmare.

 

[LegendKiller]

Here come the tools to say "wow, he was a terrorist and is now trying to back out"

Sorry guys, this dude was a loon from day 1. Everybody involved in 9/11 said he was a loon, all of A-Q thought he was a loon. FFS, he was in the midwest training and everybody else was in FL or elsewhere. Then, he says all of this crap in court "I am A-Q, I am 9/11..blah blah blah".

All of the sudden the prescutors think "Wow, now we can slam-dunk this case by parading 9/11 family members and Guiliani, and we get huge pats on the back from the gubment, raises, and make GWB look good".

These guys were played like a fiddle, as was our legal system. It's funny and sad at the same time.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: DonVito
I guess this isn't too surprising. What a wacko. I am personally glad he didn't get the death penalty, since he seems completely crazy, and I simply don't believe his claims about his involvement in 9/11, but I can't say I'm losing any sleep over his spending the rest of his life behind bars.

Honestly, I find the idea of spending the rest of your life in 23-hour lockdown almost too much to bear. What a nightmare.

I visited the federal prison in Marion and we walked down the "hard case" row where they are in 23 hour lockdown. The "exercise yard" is really just a short alley with a pullup bar and a basketball hoop. The cells were about the size of a small broom closet. I think this is the worst (best?) punishment a civilized society can throw at a person. He'll be totally drooling nuts bonkers within a year.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: alchemize

I visited the federal prison in Marion and we walked down the "hard case" row where they are in 23 hour lockdown. The "exercise yard" is really just a short alley with a pullup bar and a basketball hoop. The cells were about the size of a small broom closet. I think this is the worst (best?) punishment a civilized society can throw at a person. He'll be totally drooling nuts bonkers within a year.

It really does seem pretty unimaginably awful. No question in my mind I'd rather enjoy the surf & turf last meal and climb into Old Sparky.